Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

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DoubleChecks
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby DoubleChecks » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:24 pm

JohnstonMMM wrote:I never said "ignore" and never said "completely disregard"... The failing grades are there on the transcript for everyone to see, and they do not go away. No doubt this would count against an applicant when the admissions council looks at the transcript... But to count all those grades into one of the two main criteria that determine your chances of acceptance is ludicrous... How can you have 2 or 3 grades factoring into your gpa from one class? You retake stuff for a reason...

Compare this with someone taking an LSAT cold, with no plans of going to law school, in their freshman year of college and getting a 120... Then 5 years later, they take it for real and score a 170. Is their reported LSAT score now 145???


what about the people who went to colleges that dont let you retake grades? see, unlike the LSAT, this option is not available to everyone. and LSAT scores usually only last 5 yrs max...GPAs tend to also matter less over time (ie if you've been working for 5 yrs, they care less about your GPA). and retaking a course sets you up to get a higher grade...i mean, you're RETAKING the material. if it didnt have a strong enough penalty, hell, it could be argued that it RAISED your LSDAS GPA to retake courses in certain situations, and since your LSDAS GPA is law schools report for rankings, then it'd be a boost to applications.

like someone else said above, while the +/- aspect of the LSDAS GPA is debatable...this is pretty clear cut.

plenty of ppl DIDNT screw up and worked hard early on in college.

ViP
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby ViP » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:25 pm

You said that you failed "a bunch of classes" during your first two years... Not one, not two, but "a bunch" of classes...

Of course, in a just universe, your LSAC GPA will suffer as a result.

The fact that you were 18 is not a justifiable excuse. Every freshmen in college is 18...

Your aptitude for law school is not in question. LSAC doesn't grant strong GPAs to those who qualify for law school, but rather to those who performed strongly in undergrad. How does that not add up?

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Kohinoor
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:38 pm

It's so interesting how whatever furthers one's interests the most is considered fair.

keg411
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby keg411 » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:43 pm

These threads always make me laugh. You could re-take classes at my UG, but the grade would still be there and still counted on your final transcript. You couldn't just "wipe away" crap grades with a re-take. Just own your bad GPA and concentrate on the LSAT and what you've done since.

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D. H2Oman
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby D. H2Oman » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:50 pm

keg411 wrote:These threads always make me laugh. You could re-take classes at my UG, but the grade would still be there and still counted on your final transcript. You couldn't just "wipe away" crap grades with a re-take. Just own your bad GPA and concentrate on the LSAT and what you've done since.



Yeah but you went to a real school. That's your own fault, I think they should only factor in classes from your major taken in your Junior year (obviously dropping the lowest grade)

Bruiser
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby Bruiser » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:51 pm

Hows this for screwing up. when I was in my second or third semester of undergrad (in 1988/89) I just left college. I didn't withdraw so I had 5 Fs!! I still regret that to this day. I went on the community college later for 2 semesters (got all As) and then five years later went to the state university and completed four years for a BA in history with a 3.97 gpa (only one B, all As). The entire time they factored in those Fs. I didn't even graduate with honors.
So, my LSAC gpa is a 3.3. I know that's not horrible but still. I know they will see the 3.97 for 4 years at a State University but still. I will definitely write an addendum for that. However, this was no surprise, I expected it. I still am kicking myself but obviously I learned from that lesson. It sucks but that's the way it is.

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D. H2Oman
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby D. H2Oman » Mon Oct 19, 2009 5:53 pm

Bruiser wrote:Hows this for screwing up. when I was in my second or third semester of undergrad (in 1988/89) I just left college. I didn't withdraw so I had 5 Fs!! I still regret that to this day. I went on the community college later for 2 semesters (got all As) and then five years later went to the state university and completed four years for a BA in history with a 3.97 gpa (only one B, all As). The entire time they factored in those Fs. I didn't even graduate with honors.
So, my LSAC gpa is a 3.3. I know that's not horrible but still. I know they will see the 3.97 for 4 years at a State University but still. I will definitely write an addendum for that. However, this was no surprise, I expected it. I still am kicking myself but obviously I learned from that lesson. It sucks but that's the way it is.



Hey, if anyone is going to get their bad early performance overlooked it will be you, I'm trying to convince them that those shit grades I got waaaaaaay back in 2006 don't reflect my current ability.

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DoubleChecks
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby DoubleChecks » Mon Oct 19, 2009 6:05 pm

Dwaterman86 wrote:
Bruiser wrote:Hows this for screwing up. when I was in my second or third semester of undergrad (in 1988/89) I just left college. I didn't withdraw so I had 5 Fs!! I still regret that to this day. I went on the community college later for 2 semesters (got all As) and then five years later went to the state university and completed four years for a BA in history with a 3.97 gpa (only one B, all As). The entire time they factored in those Fs. I didn't even graduate with honors.
So, my LSAC gpa is a 3.3. I know that's not horrible but still. I know they will see the 3.97 for 4 years at a State University but still. I will definitely write an addendum for that. However, this was no surprise, I expected it. I still am kicking myself but obviously I learned from that lesson. It sucks but that's the way it is.



Hey, if anyone is going to get their bad early performance overlooked it will be you, I'm trying to convince them that those shit grades I got waaaaaaay back in 2006 don't reflect my current ability.


whoah no way, you were alive back then?

Bruiser
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby Bruiser » Tue Oct 20, 2009 7:03 pm

Yeah, I know those grades are 20 years old and they still haunt me. I currently teach high school and am almost done with my masters in leadership/admin. I warn my students (I teach seniors) that if they screw up their first year of college it will follow them. When I applied to our state university in 2006, I was rejected! That was with a 1250 SAT (school average of 1000) and a high school gpa of 3.89 (school average of like 2.8). I went in and spoke to someone, explained what happened and took some lame remedial test (passed) and started that next semester.
I am planning on going to law school fall of 2011 (when my son can drive) and finally doing what I want to do. I figure if I can't get a law job, I can get an administrative job in education with a good salary. I am so sick of the field of education, though, but still need a back up plan.

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Whatisthis
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby Whatisthis » Tue Oct 20, 2009 7:10 pm

jss1100 wrote:This is normal. They did not mess up your gpa. That is your true cum. gpa.

No takebacksies in LSAC



Am I the only one a little irked by the fact that you can retake the LSAT (probably the single largest deciding factor in admissions), but LSAC won't let you retake a stupid class from X number of years ago. I mean I get LSAT and GPA measure two different things, but it still seems like quit a gap.

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paratactical
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby paratactical » Tue Oct 20, 2009 7:17 pm

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Last edited by paratactical on Wed Feb 13, 2013 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

utmguy
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby utmguy » Tue Oct 20, 2009 7:28 pm

Whatisthis wrote:
jss1100 wrote:This is normal. They did not mess up your gpa. That is your true cum. gpa.

No takebacksies in LSAC



Am I the only one a little irked by the fact that you can retake the LSAT (probably the single largest deciding factor in admissions), but LSAC won't let you retake a stupid class from X number of years ago. I mean I get LSAT and GPA measure two different things, but it still seems like quit a gap.
Having one bad class won't kill your GPA.

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kurla88
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby kurla88 » Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:06 pm

Whatisthis wrote:
jss1100 wrote:This is normal. They did not mess up your gpa. That is your true cum. gpa.

No takebacksies in LSAC



Am I the only one a little irked by the fact that you can retake the LSAT (probably the single largest deciding factor in admissions), but LSAC won't let you retake a stupid class from X number of years ago. I mean I get LSAT and GPA measure two different things, but it still seems like quit a gap.


But... when you retake the LSAT, both scores are still on your record. When you retake a class, both grades are put into your LSAC GPA. What's the difference?

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Whatisthis
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby Whatisthis » Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:12 pm

kurla88 wrote:
Whatisthis wrote:
jss1100 wrote:This is normal. They did not mess up your gpa. That is your true cum. gpa.

No takebacksies in LSAC



Am I the only one a little irked by the fact that you can retake the LSAT (probably the single largest deciding factor in admissions), but LSAC won't let you retake a stupid class from X number of years ago. I mean I get LSAT and GPA measure two different things, but it still seems like quit a gap.


But... when you retake the LSAT, both scores are still on your record. When you retake a class, both grades are put into your LSAC GPA. What's the difference?


US News

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chipcope
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby chipcope » Thu Oct 29, 2009 3:33 pm

What if I retook a class that I did not fail?

I got two C's in freshman year German and ended up retaking the class my junior year and replacing them with a B+ and A-. Will all four of these grades count then? Or, only the first two? Or, am I in the clear because I didn't actually fail the classes?

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D. H2Oman
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby D. H2Oman » Thu Oct 29, 2009 3:38 pm

chipcope wrote:What if I retook a class that I did not fail?

I got two C's in freshman year German and ended up retaking the class my junior year and replacing them with a B+ and A-. Will all four of these grades count then? Or, only the first two? Or, am I in the clear because I didn't actually fail the classes?



They all count.

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ravens20
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby ravens20 » Thu Oct 29, 2009 6:10 pm

At my school (and several others that I know of), you could retake a class if you failed but your grade would not affect your GPA. In other words, you could get credit for taking the class (which makes sense if it was required for a major/minor) but you couldn't magically erase your previous F. This system also accounts for the fact that it would be inherently unfair for one kid to get an F and another to get a C but not have the option to retake. It also stops us both from intentionally failing to get a feel for the exams/material before retaking with a decided advantage and also from retaking classes until we ended up with a 4.0

too old for this sh*
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby too old for this sh* » Tue Feb 09, 2010 8:52 pm

Hopefully I am not breaching forum etiquette here by blowing this much dust off of a thread, but...

...as I read about impact of earlier grades on LSDAC computations, I stumbled upon this thread (among others) that described my situation, specifically a semester from hell but where everything was repeated later in life and where I ultimately finished in the top 4 in the class for work performed in residence at the degree-granting institution.

I do take some umbrage to the following statements:

ViP wrote:You said that you failed "a bunch of classes" during your first two years... Not one, not two, but "a bunch" of classes...

Of course, in a just universe, your LSAC GPA will suffer as a result.

The fact that you were 18 is not a justifiable excuse. Every freshmen in college is 18...


Not all freshmen are 18. I was actually a full time student at the age of 17 and managed to piss away a full honors scholarship as a consequence of youthful freedoms run amuck. Throw in a major knee injury while living in a dorm that lacked elevators and it was truly the semester from hell.

But just for the twist of fate's knife, I would find out several years later that my withdrawals had not been processed for four of the courses. Consequently I was stuck with twelve hours of zero point zero, all prior to the age of 18. I did not expend much time tracking down or attempting to fix the problem at the time because it did not impact my later completion of requirements for my degree. You can imagine the fun of trying to correct the problem more than 25 years from the last time I had to consider the semester from hell.

Your aptitude for law school is not in question. LSAC doesn't grant strong GPAs to those who qualify for law school, but rather to those who performed strongly in undergrad. How does that not add up?


What does not add up is that the present system seems to unfairly penalize those that, for whatever reason, had a poor semester very early in life and then got on with their academic career, even if many years later. I'm still over 3.x even with the 12 hours included in any recalculation, but when viewing past academic performance, do you really want to tell me that a poor semester at the age of 17 should offset a top 5 graduation more than a decade later (and that was done while working full time) AND where an extensive body of work in the area of criminal law speaks to abilities?

It seems as though too much attention is placed on variables that do not really provide a true measure of one's ability to succeed in law school when one is pursuing the JD many years after the receipt of an undergraduate degree...

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b.gump81
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby b.gump81 » Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:01 pm

i had three dropped classes on my transcript (DG) which LSAC counted as D's for some reason. Not too sure why a reasonable human being would assume DG meant D instead of dropped grade, but I called and made them aware of their error, and they changed it the next day. It brought my gpa up a whole 2 tenths...i know this may be specific to my school, but just something to look out for...people, even the lsac, makes mistakes

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existenz
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby existenz » Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:04 pm

I was 17 my freshman year in college. Had a 3.95 GPA that year. So no, being 17 is not an excuse either.

You just have to own your GPA and rock the LSAT and write an addendum. If it has been many years since school then you should still have a shot at decent schools, just not necessarily T14.

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Lawl Shcool
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby Lawl Shcool » Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:20 pm

life is tough, get a helmet

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adrib
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby adrib » Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:37 pm

I hear you, OP. It really pissed me off when I saw what LSAC did to my GPA, too. All I can say is, at least all of us that retook classes are penalized the same way, so at least it's fair. I still got into my dream school :D Keep your chin up!

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im_blue
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby im_blue » Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:49 pm

adrib wrote:I hear you, OP. It really pissed me off when I saw what LSAC did to my GPA, too. All I can say is, at least all of us that retook classes are penalized the same way, so at least it's fair. I still got into my dream school :D Keep your chin up!


Actually, some schools have a policy where the first grade is replaced by RP, so LSAC doesn't count it because the originally grade is wiped off, rather than just crossed out or otherwise not counted in the undergrad's GPA. In that case, it's not fair.

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adrib
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby adrib » Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:50 pm

im_blue wrote:
adrib wrote:I hear you, OP. It really pissed me off when I saw what LSAC did to my GPA, too. All I can say is, at least all of us that retook classes are penalized the same way, so at least it's fair. I still got into my dream school :D Keep your chin up!


Actually, some schools have a policy where the first grade is replaced by RP, so LSAC doesn't count it because the originally grade is wiped off. In that case, it's not fair.

Wow, wipes the grade completely off your transcript? I had no idea.

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$1.99
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Re: Academic Summary Report -- LSAC Trashed my GPA

Postby $1.99 » Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:51 pm

o doyle rules!




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