how golden is my friend? retake or no?

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Lmao Zedong
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Lmao Zedong » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:03 pm

bump with an update of the situation and a new question.

so, my friend sat on the 175 and applied to yale. he was recently rejected (to recap, black, 3.7/175 from a good private school). does retaking the LSAT and reapplying make more sense now if he really has his heart set on yale? he was a pretty consistent 178+ on PTs when we were prepping together, so i don't doubt he'd be more likely to go up than down on a retake.

thanks

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Kohinoor
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Kohinoor » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:18 pm

No need. UVA will take him with his current numbers.

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Unitas
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Unitas » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:23 pm

GargamelITT wrote:bump with an update of the situation and a new question.

so, my friend sat on the 175 and applied to yale. he was recently rejected (to recap, black, 3.7/175 from a good private school). does retaking the LSAT and reapplying make more sense now if he really has his heart set on yale? he was a pretty consistent 178+ on PTs when we were prepping together, so i don't doubt he'd be more likely to go up than down on a retake.

thanks


Doubtful he had the numbers for Yale to give him a faculty review so it wasn't numbers that kept him out. Working on softs or doing something important may give him an edge for next year.

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NayBoer
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby NayBoer » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:26 pm

So he's too good for HS?

I would be surprised if those numbers for AA are not enough to get consideration. Maybe he doesn't have enough interesting stuff or his Yale 250 sucked.

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Lurkster
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Lurkster » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:30 pm

Considering his URM status, if yale isn't taking him with a 175, then the LSAT is not the limiting factor here.

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Lmao Zedong
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Lmao Zedong » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:31 pm

NayBoer wrote:So he's too good for HS?



no i really don't think that's the case, it's just a strong preference on his part. he's got specific reasons to want Y in particular. but i really doubt he'd be too upset if he ended up "settling" for H or S.

is it safe to say he's in at H, though?

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Kohinoor
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Kohinoor » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:47 pm

GargamelITT wrote:
NayBoer wrote:So he's too good for HS?



no i really don't think that's the case, it's just a strong preference on his part. he's got specific reasons to want Y in particular. but i really doubt he'd be too upset if he ended up "settling" for H or S.

is it safe to say he's in at H, though?

As safe as in at Y.

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Lmao Zedong
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Lmao Zedong » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:52 pm

Kohinoor wrote:
GargamelITT wrote:
NayBoer wrote:So he's too good for HS?



no i really don't think that's the case, it's just a strong preference on his part. he's got specific reasons to want Y in particular. but i really doubt he'd be too upset if he ended up "settling" for H or S.

is it safe to say he's in at H, though?

As safe as in at Y.


in other words, not safe. well, shit. i really thought his solid numbers + URM status would make him a really safe bet for at least one of HYS

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tomhobbes
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby tomhobbes » Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:56 pm

GargamelITT wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:
GargamelITT wrote:
NayBoer wrote:So he's too good for HS?



no i really don't think that's the case, it's just a strong preference on his part. he's got specific reasons to want Y in particular. but i really doubt he'd be too upset if he ended up "settling" for H or S.

is it safe to say he's in at H, though?

As safe as in at Y.


in other words, not safe. well, shit. i really thought his solid numbers + URM status would make him a really safe bet for at least one of HYS


90% sure he's in at Harvard.

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underachiever
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby underachiever » Fri Feb 05, 2010 6:05 pm

the LSAT is not your friends problem....and he is a shoe in at Harvard unless his app is seriously deficient. As for Yale, he should take a year off and do relief work in a foreign country, or something along these lines as it is his softs that bounced him from Yale or maybe a poor Yale 250 or diversity essay.

nycparalegal
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby nycparalegal » Fri Feb 05, 2010 6:06 pm

GargamelITT wrote:my friend is considering retaking the LSAT, and i'm under the impression that it would be a mistake. the situation:

he is black, and a UG junior at a well-regarded private university. GPA will be 3.65-3.7 when he's done (if it's important for this number to be as precise as possible, i can ask him for his best estimate).

he got a 175 on the feb LSAT, but wants to retake because it's a few points below what he was practicing at. he wants HYS. my impression is that he's already golden and can probably sweep them, and retaking the LSAT would be pointless / possibly even harmful.


what's the verdict?


Wow, he was practicing at 177-180 level.

SimonSaysStudy
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby SimonSaysStudy » Fri Feb 05, 2010 6:11 pm

GargamelITT wrote:
NayBoer wrote:So he's too good for HS?



no i really don't think that's the case, it's just a strong preference on his part. he's got specific reasons to want Y in particular. but i really doubt he'd be too upset if he ended up "settling" for H or S.

is it safe to say he's in at H, though?



He hasn't already gotten into H or S? When did he apply? Was he held by H?

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Kohinoor
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Kohinoor » Fri Feb 05, 2010 6:11 pm

tomhobbes wrote:
90% sure he's in at Harvard.

and 85% sure he's in at Yale.

SimonSaysStudy
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby SimonSaysStudy » Fri Feb 05, 2010 6:58 pm

edit: wrong thread

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CoaltoNewCastle
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby CoaltoNewCastle » Sat Feb 06, 2010 12:40 am

Your friend will get into Harvard.

I really wish I had seen and posted in this thread a year ago. Every single person told you that it could only hurt him to retake the LSAT, and most of them said he was guaranteed to get into Yale. I would have told you that while he's guaranteed Harvard barring something really wrong with his application, he may not get into Yale. An LSAT retake could only have helped him. I also don't think getting below a 175 would have had a noticeable impact on his application. And people saying that getting above a 175 wouldn't help him at all were just being ridiculous. If he retakes the LSAT and gets a 177+ he will have a much better shot at Yale if he applies next year.

Edit: I should say that I got a 179 on the LSAT the June after my sophomore year and I just signed up for the June test this year a few days ago. I was testing straight 180's on my practice tests and then seven or eight things went wrong test day. Though I feel extremely fortunate to have gotten my score, I've always kind of wanted to retake and I decided that taking it in June and getting a 180 could help me if I end up on a waitlist. If I get lower than a 179 I don't think it'll hurt me. I think your friend should have retaken.

rundoxierun
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby rundoxierun » Sat Feb 06, 2010 12:53 am

FWIW, Im a black UG junior right now with ~3.6 LSDAS GPA and 177 LSAT and people who actually work in admissions have told me that I will be almost a lock for Harvard next cycle. So yea, your friend should be a lock. In fact, he will likely be the top black applicant this cycle with the 175 combined with a ~3.7

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dutchstriker
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby dutchstriker » Sat Feb 06, 2010 1:02 am

CoaltoNewCastle wrote:Edit: I should say that I got a 179 on the LSAT the June after my sophomore year and I just signed up for the June test this year a few days ago. I was testing straight 180's on my practice tests and then seven or eight things went wrong test day. Though I feel extremely fortunate to have gotten my score, I've always kind of wanted to retake and I decided that taking it in June and getting a 180 could help me if I end up on a waitlist. If I get lower than a 179 I don't think it'll hurt me. I think your friend should have retaken.

:lol: What?

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Lmao Zedong
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Lmao Zedong » Sat Feb 06, 2010 4:50 am

tkgrrett wrote:FWIW, Im a black UG junior right now with ~3.6 LSDAS GPA and 177 LSAT and people who actually work in admissions have told me that I will be almost a lock for Harvard next cycle. So yea, your friend should be a lock. In fact, he will likely be the top black applicant this cycle with the 175 combined with a ~3.7


seriously?

lawman335
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby lawman335 » Sat Feb 06, 2010 1:25 pm

I better suggest him not to retake bcoz 175 is a good score , just tell your friend to think before he could retake.......

rundoxierun
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby rundoxierun » Sat Feb 06, 2010 1:28 pm

GargamelITT wrote:
tkgrrett wrote:FWIW, Im a black UG junior right now with ~3.6 LSDAS GPA and 177 LSAT and people who actually work in admissions have told me that I will be almost a lock for Harvard next cycle. So yea, your friend should be a lock. In fact, he will likely be the top black applicant this cycle with the 175 combined with a ~3.7


seriously?


Yea seriously, i have seen numbers from last cycle(2008-2009).. only 1 black applicant with GPA of 3.5+ and LSAT 175+. You have to remember that that LSAT is already at the 99.5th percentile or so for the general population and African-Americans overall score very poorly. That would definitely make a 175 around the 99.99th percentile for black applicants.

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Borhas
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Borhas » Sat Feb 06, 2010 1:52 pm

GargamelITT wrote:my friend is considering retaking the LSAT, and i'm under the impression that it would be a mistake. the situation:

he is black, and a UG junior at a well-regarded private university. GPA will be 3.65-3.7 when he's done (if it's important for this number to be as precise as possible, i can ask him for his best estimate).

he got a 175 on the feb LSAT, but wants to retake because it's a few points below what he was practicing at. he wants HYS. my impression is that he's already golden and can probably sweep them, and retaking the LSAT would be pointless / possibly even harmful.


what's the verdict?

99% chance he gets in all three
100% chance at Harvard
99.99% chance at Stanford
99% chance at Yale

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Kohinoor
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Kohinoor » Sat Feb 06, 2010 2:47 pm

Borhas wrote:
GargamelITT wrote:my friend is considering retaking the LSAT, and i'm under the impression that it would be a mistake. the situation:

he is black, and a UG junior at a well-regarded private university. GPA will be 3.65-3.7 when he's done (if it's important for this number to be as precise as possible, i can ask him for his best estimate).

he got a 175 on the feb LSAT, but wants to retake because it's a few points below what he was practicing at. he wants HYS. my impression is that he's already golden and can probably sweep them, and retaking the LSAT would be pointless / possibly even harmful.


what's the verdict?

99% chance he gets in all three
100% chance at Harvard
99.99% chance at Stanford
99% chance at Yale
You saw that he got dinged at Yale right?

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Borhas
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Borhas » Sat Feb 06, 2010 2:53 pm

Kohinoor wrote:
Borhas wrote:
GargamelITT wrote:my friend is considering retaking the LSAT, and i'm under the impression that it would be a mistake. the situation:

he is black, and a UG junior at a well-regarded private university. GPA will be 3.65-3.7 when he's done (if it's important for this number to be as precise as possible, i can ask him for his best estimate).

he got a 175 on the feb LSAT, but wants to retake because it's a few points below what he was practicing at. he wants HYS. my impression is that he's already golden and can probably sweep them, and retaking the LSAT would be pointless / possibly even harmful.


what's the verdict?

99% chance he gets in all three
100% chance at Harvard
99.99% chance at Stanford
99% chance at Yale
You saw that he got dinged at Yale right?


no, but I'm glad I didn't say 100%

SimonSaysStudy
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby SimonSaysStudy » Sat Feb 06, 2010 3:01 pm

tkgrrett wrote:
GargamelITT wrote:
tkgrrett wrote:FWIW, Im a black UG junior right now with ~3.6 LSDAS GPA and 177 LSAT and people who actually work in admissions have told me that I will be almost a lock for Harvard next cycle. So yea, your friend should be a lock. In fact, he will likely be the top black applicant this cycle with the 175 combined with a ~3.7


seriously?


Yea seriously, i have seen numbers from last cycle(2008-2009).. only 1 black applicant with GPA of 3.5+ and LSAT 175+. You have to remember that that LSAT is already at the 99.5th percentile or so for the general population and African-Americans overall score very poorly. That would definitely make a 175 around the 99.99th percentile for black applicants.


What data are you referring to?

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Sogui
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Re: how golden is my friend? retake or no?

Postby Sogui » Sat Feb 06, 2010 4:06 pm

Borhas wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:
Borhas wrote:
GargamelITT wrote:my friend is considering retaking the LSAT, and i'm under the impression that it would be a mistake. the situation:

he is black, and a UG junior at a well-regarded private university. GPA will be 3.65-3.7 when he's done (if it's important for this number to be as precise as possible, i can ask him for his best estimate).

he got a 175 on the feb LSAT, but wants to retake because it's a few points below what he was practicing at. he wants HYS. my impression is that he's already golden and can probably sweep them, and retaking the LSAT would be pointless / possibly even harmful.


what's the verdict?

99% chance he gets in all three
100% chance at Harvard
99.99% chance at Stanford
99% chance at Yale
You saw that he got dinged at Yale right?


no, but I'm glad I didn't say 100%



Yea you're only 99% embarrassed right now!


But serously, the Yale ding was surprising. However from what people have said about Yale's black box, once you get above a certain score/GPA index and you get the faculty review, numbers cease to be as important as they would at other schools.

I would say as a URM with a decent GPA and a very strong LSAT that he should focus on his softs and making a killer PS and Yale 250, and making sure that his recc's are glowing.

His numbers are NOT what's holding him back, I feel that it would take an exceptional hole in his application elsewhere for Yale to turn down a 3.75/175 AA male. He is definitely making it to faculty review, but the Yale faculty is clearly not impressed with what they saw in his softs/LoRs/PS/Y250, hence the surprising ding.

Yet to answer the original question, if he's confident he can break a 175 then he should go for it. But he should expend 5% of his energy for re-taking the LSAT (should he choose) and 95% figuring out what parts of his application got him dinged at Yale.




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