Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

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bob_j42

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Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby bob_j42 » Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:34 pm

Never for a second thought that my dorm write ups would come back to haunt me or that I would have to disclose them but I just saw a couple posts where people were anxious about their write ups. So i guess these dorm room violations are apart of law school apps? Wish i would have known this, I would have been a lot more careful.

I have three different dorm violations and all of them are exactly the same which is being in the presence of both and weed alcohol and "failure to comply." I'm not sure what "failure to comply" means or why I always received this charge but I'm assuming this is just standard procedure as I was never not compliant .Nothing serious ever happened as a result of these incidents. After the first write up I received an informal warning and was found not responsible. After the second write up I had to write a little essay reflecting on what happened and was put on housing probation. After the third one one I had to attend like a 30 minute drug and alcohol counseling session and my housing probation was extended. Is it really necessary to disclose this stuff? Its so minor and it seems kindve ridiculous to me that law schools would really care about things of this nature.

Additionally, I received a ticket for smoking weed in public on my 21st birthday. Im in a legal state and since I was 21 I just received a civil infraction. The cop told me it was the equivalent of a traffic ticket. When I attempted to pay the 100 dollar fine I was told the ticket was dismissed but that I would have to attend a drug and alcohol class. I Did the class, and haven't thought about the incident since. Any clue if I would have to disclose this? I never saved any paperwork or anything since this is before I considered going to law school and to be quite honest, I never thought it would matter for anything since it was an infraction that was dismissed.

How much will this affect my scholarship/admission? Obviously all of this is minor but I feel like it looks really bad? So stressed can someone give me some advice?

cavalier1138

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby cavalier1138 » Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:50 pm

Any of these alone probably wouldn't be an issue. But the consistent pattern of write-ups and a subsequent citation for marijuana use starts to paint a less rosy picture. The issue isn't that you were young and reckless in college; it's that you were young and reckless three times in college in exactly the same manner, followed by a more serious public citation, again for the same kind of behavior. It makes you sound like you're (a) not mature enough to learn from your mistakes and (b) prone to substance abuse. Neither of those is a good look for a potential lawyer, and it may cause some admissions issues, not to mention C&F issues down the line.

How old are you now? The key to minimizing the effect of these issues is going to be how you frame them. If you're not too far removed from that last ticket, you're going to have to figure out a better spin for these than "I learned my lesson" (since no one will buy that narrative). But your goal should be to explaining these offenses in a way that makes it clear that you're not going to be getting similar citations in law school or after graduation. If you can't convince the adcomms of that, it will definitely have a negative impact on your apps.

bob_j42

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby bob_j42 » Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:17 pm

wow, is this really that serious? im shocked.

Your making it seem like im some hard drug addict with a criminal history. I have a completely clean record. The only time Ive had any interaction with law enforcement was a civil infraction for smoking in public on my 21st birthday which has a maximum punishment of a fine of a 100 dollars. The ticket was dismissed anyways and this is an extremely minor violation regardless of whether or not was dismissed.

Other than that I got in trouble a couple times for being in dorms where people were drinking or smoking and got a literal slap on the wrist punishment where i had to write a 2 page essay and go to a counseling session for 30 minutes. Why are these things so serious in your opinion ? Im genuinely so confused.

Why would law schools even care or ask about dorm room violations like this is beyond me.

nixy

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby nixy » Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:35 pm

Law schools ask because the state bar will ask, and the state bar asks not because they care about the infractions themselves, but that you’re honest about what happened. Failing to disclose something is always worse than whatever the thing is.

Read the questions carefully and answer what’s asked. If a school asks for info about any school discipline, this seems like your dorm writeups would count. But it depends on the question. Ditto for the citation.

I don’t have quite as negative reaction as cav - it is pretty minor stuff and I doubt it will raise eyebrows - but you may need to provide some kind of explanation for what can be seen as a pattern.

cavalier1138

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby cavalier1138 » Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:02 pm

Just to clarify the reaction:

I don't think this stuff would be a problem if you didn't have a pattern of behavior. One or two dorm infractions for pot? Fine. Three? Probably still fine, but it's looking a little like you're a stoner who prioritizes partying above things like not getting written up for doing drugs in the dorm. Three dorm infractions plus a police citation (no, you do not have a "completely clean record")? Now I'm starting to think that you have self-control issues. And maybe you don't, but if I'm the adcomm reading your file, all I get to see are the violations and your addendum explaining them.

Again, it's not that any of these incidents in and of themselves rise above minor violations. It's that you clearly haven't bothered to change your behavior despite repeated disciplinary actions, which have escalated.

As nixy said, disclosure is the most important thing. But you need to take a much more penitent attitude in disclosure. I think if you try to brush these things off as not being a problem, it will sound like you're going to continue to rack up citations and/or criminal charges rather than grow up and stop smoking pot every time you feel like celebrating.

nixy

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby nixy » Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:35 pm

I definitely agree that talking about them as “this is so minor!” is not the way to go in the application process.

Anon-non-anon

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby Anon-non-anon » Wed Aug 07, 2019 12:54 pm

Definitely disclose that stuff. I had to amend my application to add a dorm violation like you describe so there wouldnt be inconsistencies later. It was annoying but absolutely not an issue with the bar. I bet especially given that your state is legal, this won't be an issue at all if you are totally honest about it.

HoJu

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby HoJu » Wed Aug 07, 2019 4:12 pm

Even if you didn't disclose and got into law school, you would end up getting screwed on your Bar C&F screening because these incidents will definitely be brought up then. Not disclosing now makes you look like a liar and will cause a major headache down the road. Just disclose, in the worst case scenario you might have to wait a few years before applying in order to put enough distance between you and the incident.

iar

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby iar » Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:14 pm

Posting here instead of starting a new thread...

I have a traffic violation from a few years back that I need to disclose to some schools (or at least that's my understanding). I want to be as accurate as I can but I no longer have the ticket. It's also not on my driving record, presumably because I went to traffic school. Is there a way of seeing my confidential conviction at the DMV so I can be sure I have the correct details? I don't know if it was for distracted driving (not correct hands free equipment), or having 2 earbuds in. I thought I was making a call in a legal way because I didn't realize that each state had different laws (I was new to the country). I don't think I was doing both of these things wrong, but I honestly don't remember what the officer wrote me up for exactly. I just paid the fine, went to traffic school, and learned the details of my local laws as they pertained to cell phones etc.

cavalier1138

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby cavalier1138 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 1:21 pm

iar wrote:Posting here instead of starting a new thread...

I have a traffic violation from a few years back that I need to disclose to some schools (or at least that's my understanding). I want to be as accurate as I can but I no longer have the ticket. It's also not on my driving record, presumably because I went to traffic school. Is there a way of seeing my confidential conviction at the DMV so I can be sure I have the correct details? I don't know if it was for distracted driving (not correct hands free equipment), or having 2 earbuds in. I thought I was making a call in a legal way because I didn't realize that each state had different laws (I was new to the country). I don't think I was doing both of these things wrong, but I honestly don't remember what the officer wrote me up for exactly. I just paid the fine, went to traffic school, and learned the details of my local laws as they pertained to cell phones etc.


If you remember approximate dates and the general thrust of the citation (i.e. using phone in car), that should be enough. Just include in the disclosure that you are unable to provide more detail because it's not on your record.

iar

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby iar » Thu Sep 05, 2019 5:09 pm

Great, thank-you! Appreciate it.

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LSATWiz.com

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby LSATWiz.com » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:08 pm

bob_j42 wrote:wow, is this really that serious? im shocked.

Your making it seem like im some hard drug addict with a criminal history. I have a completely clean record. The only time Ive had any interaction with law enforcement was a civil infraction for smoking in public on my 21st birthday which has a maximum punishment of a fine of a 100 dollars. The ticket was dismissed anyways and this is an extremely minor violation regardless of whether or not was dismissed.

Other than that I got in trouble a couple times for being in dorms where people were drinking or smoking and got a literal slap on the wrist punishment where i had to write a 2 page essay and go to a counseling session for 30 minutes. Why are these things so serious in your opinion ? Im genuinely so confused.

Why would law schools even care or ask about dorm room violations like this is beyond me.

I would mention the dorm infractions all in one paragraph, and just list the date range they took place during and the punishment. Then I'd list the citation, and class completed. I'd mention any add'l steps you've taken.

It sounds like you just have a problem with marijuana, and there are worse things in the world than having a problem with marijuana. I don't think it would have a major impact on your cycle, but don't play it off as a small thing. Lawyers have to uphold and follow rules, even ones that seem stupid.

I'd also consider whether there may be an underlying issue that is causing you to use marijuana as much as you do. This isn't something any lawyer can answer, but it's possible you were using pot to treat an underlying condition, and if that is the case, you'd want to get that resolved before you take the next step in your career.

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Jordan Catalano

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Re: Will these minor conduct violations affect me? Concerned about character and fitness!

Postby Jordan Catalano » Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:48 am

I don’t think any of these things are going to be a problem. Just write about it in a matter of fact way, concisely, make no excuses, say it was wrong, and that’s it. It’s marijuana and college dorm write ups we’re talking about here. Not everything is a major issue.



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