ED Penn

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jsh807
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ED Penn

Postby jsh807 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:16 pm

Hello,
I have an lsat score of 161, average GPA, and what I'd like to think are strong softs in public interest. I am really REALLY interested in the Penn Toll Public Interest Scholars program and want to apply to Penn ED. I know you have to be invited to apply to that TPIC program after being admitted to Penn, but do you think I have a shot at being accepted with those scores if I apply ED? Help! :|
Last edited by jsh807 on Sat Nov 11, 2017 12:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

cavalier1138
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Re: ED Penn

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:18 pm

I think you have no chance of being admitted with those numbers, period, so the question is moot. Get your LSAT into a reasonable range for Penn, then worry about whether you'll be considered for a specific scholarship.
Last edited by cavalier1138 on Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

jsh807
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Re: ED Penn

Postby jsh807 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:27 pm

Unfortunately I've taken the LSAT 3 times already with no luck, despite doing really well on preptests and having a super score of around 171 (best section scores put together - I wish this was a real thing in law school apps!!). There is an optional essay section about explaining my score - perhaps I can make an appeal there? But don't want to risk sounding like I'm making weak excuses.

Option 2: go for ED at Berkeley? Still no chance?

Thanks all.

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Thomas Hagan, ESQ.
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Re: ED Penn

Postby Thomas Hagan, ESQ. » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:32 pm

jsh807 wrote:Unfortunately I've taken the LSAT 3 times already with no luck, despite doing really well on preptests and having a super score of around 171 (best section scores put together - I wish this was a real thing in law school apps!!). There is an optional essay section about explaining my score - perhaps I can make an appeal there? But don't want to risk sounding like I'm making weak excuses.

Option 2: go for ED at Berkeley? Still no chance?

Thanks all.


Sorry to burst your bubble but your 2 posts on here indicate that you have close to no idea how the law school admission process works.

1. Unless you won a Nobel Prize, Olympic Gold medal, or anything of the scope, you don't have "REALLY" strong soft.
2. No, there is no super score...lawls.
3. Your numbers are at the 25th percentile for Penn so you have close to no chance of getting in (unless your softs satisfy bullet #1.)

cavalier1138
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Re: ED Penn

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:36 pm

If you want any chance at admission to the T13 at all, you need to bump your score up 5 points, minimum.

But what are your PI goals? If you're targeting local orgs, you may not need a degree from a top school.

jsh807
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Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:07 pm

Re: ED Penn

Postby jsh807 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:41 pm

re: cavalier1138
My PI goal for law school is mentorship and money. What I like about Penn PI is the full scholarship as well as the intensive exclusive programming, summer jobs funding, events, networking etc that comes with it. While there are other PI scholarships, this program is different. It seems like a cohort. I've seen similar at NYU and Georgetown.
Last edited by jsh807 on Sat Nov 11, 2017 12:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

cavalier1138
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Re: ED Penn

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:43 pm

jsh807 wrote:True, I really have no idea what I'm doing. I saw that 25th percentile number too. What exactly does that mean? Judging from your comments, its not 1 in 4 chance of getting in? struggling...

And re: cavalier1138
My PI goal for law school is mentorship and money. What I like about Penn PI is the full scholarship as well as the intensive exclusive programming, summer jobs funding, events, networking etc that comes with it. While there are other PI scholarships, this program is different. It seems like a cohort. I've seen similar at NYU and Georgetown.


I didn't mean your PI goal for which students you get to hang out with for three years. I'm asking what you want to do with your degree.

jsh807
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Re: ED Penn

Postby jsh807 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:49 pm

I want to do criminal defense and policy work. I know I really dont need to go to an elite law school for this, a local one in the town where I want to practice is probably sufficient. But I was hoping for a more intensive and fulfilling experience than your average law program. I was thinking a program like this in a top school would push me to be a better lawyer and make better connections

LawTweet
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Re: ED Penn

Postby LawTweet » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:07 pm

jsh807 wrote:Hello,
I have an lsat score of 163, GPA of 3.68, and what I'd like to think are strong softs in public interest. I am really REALLY interested in the Penn Toll Public Interest Scholars program and want to apply to Penn ED. I know you have to be invited to apply to that TPIC program after being admitted to Penn, but do you think I have a shot at being accepted with those scores if I apply ED? Help! :|


Also don't want to burst your bubble (and I really don't know the process works) but I had a 170, 3.7 and several forms of national public interest recognition. I didn't even advance to finalist.

cavalier1138
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Re: ED Penn

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:14 pm

jsh807 wrote:I want to do criminal defense and policy work. I know I really dont need to go to an elite law school for this, a local one in the town where I want to practice is probably sufficient. But I was hoping for a more intensive and fulfilling experience than your average law program. I was thinking a program like this in a top school would push me to be a better lawyer and make better connections


That is completely the wrong way of thinking about it. If you want to work at a local public defender's office, focus on going to a decent regional school for free. You're not going to be a better lawyer because you went to a top school, and the only extra connections you make would be for federal and national non-profit work.

Law school is not undergrad; it's professional training. There is no such thing as a "more intensive and fulfilling experience" in school. There's just school.

jsh807
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Re: ED Penn

Postby jsh807 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:29 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:
That is completely the wrong way of thinking about it. If you want to work at a local public defender's office, focus on going to a decent regional school for free. You're not going to be a better lawyer because you went to a top school, and the only extra connections you make would be for federal and national non-profit work.

Law school is not undergrad; it's professional training. There is no such thing as a "more intensive and fulfilling experience" in school. There's just school.



Yikes, well I guess I really need to think about where geographically I want to end up. Or if I should go for a 4th LSAT score.

da.goat
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Re: ED Penn

Postby da.goat » Fri Oct 13, 2017 6:03 pm

jsh807 wrote:
cavalier1138 wrote:
That is completely the wrong way of thinking about it. If you want to work at a local public defender's office, focus on going to a decent regional school for free. You're not going to be a better lawyer because you went to a top school, and the only extra connections you make would be for federal and national non-profit work.

Law school is not undergrad; it's professional training. There is no such thing as a "more intensive and fulfilling experience" in school. There's just school.



Yikes, well I guess I really need to think about where geographically I want to end up. Or if I should go for a 4th LSAT score.


I would add to this that going to a top school is great not for the better training, but for the amount of options you have if you change your mind about PI. I went into LS wanting to do PI and (like many others) decided to do biglaw instead about halfway through 1L. If I was not at a T14 that would've potentially been a damning realization, but because I'm at a T14 it was no problem. Focus on upping your LSAT score and going to a T14 for as lowest cost as possible so that you have options just in case. If you KNOW beyond all doubt that PI is for you, then nvm and definitely do regional for free.

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Thomas Hagan, ESQ.
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Re: ED Penn

Postby Thomas Hagan, ESQ. » Fri Oct 13, 2017 6:27 pm

da.goat wrote:
jsh807 wrote:
cavalier1138 wrote:
That is completely the wrong way of thinking about it. If you want to work at a local public defender's office, focus on going to a decent regional school for free. You're not going to be a better lawyer because you went to a top school, and the only extra connections you make would be for federal and national non-profit work.

Law school is not undergrad; it's professional training. There is no such thing as a "more intensive and fulfilling experience" in school. There's just school.



Yikes, well I guess I really need to think about where geographically I want to end up. Or if I should go for a 4th LSAT score.


I would add to this that going to a top school is great not for the better training, but for the amount of options you have if you change your mind about PI. I went into LS wanting to do PI and (like many others) decided to do biglaw instead about halfway through 1L. If I was not at a T14 that would've potentially been a damning realization, but because I'm at a T14 it was no problem. Focus on upping your LSAT score and going to a T14 for as lowest cost as possible so that you have options just in case. If you KNOW beyond all doubt that PI is for you, then nvm and definitely do regional for free.


Exactly this!

jsh807
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Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:07 pm

Re: ED Penn

Postby jsh807 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 6:59 pm

Thanks all, very helpful!




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