magnum_law wrote: LurkerTurnedMember wrote: magnum_law wrote: LurkerTurnedMember wrote:
Duke easily has more lay prestige than Berkeley or any other state school. International rankings are dogshit and elevate dogshit state schools (for clarification, not counting Berkeley as a dogshit state school) way above where they belong.
Here are rankings of schools based on global and regional reputation. Berkeley is 4th, just .1 behind Stanford. I'll let you click through the rest of the pages to find Duke. https://www.usnews.com/education/best-g ... s/rankings
These rankings are silly - you genuinely believe anyone in their right mind thinks of Berk as superior over Yale, for example? C'mon man. Also, Duke definitely crushes Berk in lay prestige generally... it gets too mucked up with UCLA, etc.
For law school, of course not! Yale beats Berkeley hands down. I think our earlier discussion was mostly about lay prestige generally and not specifically to law school. I think if you talk about prestige with respect to law school specifically, then you're automatically cutting off everyday people, so there's no such thing as lay prestige for law schools. So you gotta talk about the school generally, which is what I thought we were talking about. So, generally, Berkeley and Yale I think are about the same nationally, although Berkeley takes the cake by a bit at least internationally. You can't deny history at Berkeley. I didn't even go there. I went to U of Chicago. But sometimes I read these forums and I'm so surprised. There was a guy trying to say Vandy is better than Berkeley. Before this, in another thread, another person tried saying WashU was better than Columbia. Come on now. You can't deny Berkeley's history and standing. The free speech/rights movement, the constant leader of progressivism, it's on the media all the time. Turn on CNN, there's Robert Reich from Berkeley, turn on the local news, there are protests at Berkeley (which I'm 100% sure wouldn't have been covered so nationally if it happened at some other university with a different history), the military including it in their commercials in the Midwest as a top school along with MIT and Harvard, the reputation rankings, both national and international, always putting it up high. I didn't go there and I'm U of Chi all the way. But come on. You can't tell me Duke, which is known for basketball generally, beats Berkeley. It's Berkeley.
With all due respect; no fucking way man..I gotta say that I completely disagree with you.
I was speaking of general lay prestige, not law school. I honestly can't say much about international reputations because I've never lived abroad, but I CAN speak for national lay prestige I think. And just to kind of push back on your international rankings point, just look at the national undergrad rankings.... Yale is at #3, Duke is at #8, while Berkeley is at #20! Berk and Yale are NOT in the same league nationally.... I'm from NY area and later in live moved to the South, and in both places, Berkeley and Vanderbilt are pretty comparable in prestige. The UG rankings also support this. (Although I agree that Berk is DEFINITELY better known than WashU.)
Ok. I got ya. I think it just then comes to what information we rely on. So if we go by the national rankings, you're right. But if we consider more of the international rankings, then I'm right. Or I should say your or my position is "supported," not necessarily proved right. My thinking was just that if a school is so well known globally, then it trumps someone's regional reputation even if regionally another school is more known. So WashU is huge in St. Louis I'm sure since that's where it is, more so than Berkeley. But on a broader level, it doesn't compare to Berkeley. Similarly, sure, Yale might outrank Berkeley nationally and be better known, but my thought was that who cares if globally it's not on Berkeley's level. Same for Vandy in the Midwest, or a particular state in the U.S.
And I agree with the person above and the convo you had with your sister from Stanford. When I applied, I applied to almost all T14 schools, including Stanford, U of Chi, and Berkeley. But I didn't apply to Duke, and because I had the same perception as your sister. I'm not saying I'm right, or anyone else is wrong. I'm sure these things fluctuate depending on where you are and what information you have. I'm just putting in my two cents. And by the way, it goes U of Chicago, Yale, Stanford, then Harvard (then Columbia, NYU/Berkeley, Penn/UVA, Mich)