CLASS OF 2019! MEDIANS (LSAT/GPA/CLASS SIZE) Forum

[AriGold33]

.

[vcap180]

As an NYUer, I am outraged that my year NYU had a 172 median and it has fallen down to 169 for two years in a row now. Meanwhile, CLS has risen risen from 171 to 172. The notion of NYU=CLS should be over.

HLS falling to a 172 median like CLS should really hit home the notion that CLS = HLS and that the gap is extremely small between the two, if anything.

Also, Columbia's 25th LSAT is 168, not 169, as is currently stated in the Excel file.

I note that UCLA also now has a higher median LSAT (167) than Berkeley (166).

It depends on how you define the gap. I doubt the quality of students/education/opportunities varies much between any of those schools. The only difference is that the general public will be infinitely more impressed if you went to Harvard Law School. HLS will always have unrivaled name-prestige among those outside of the legal community. Which may or may not matter.

[Huskies13!]

Fordham:
http://www.fordham.edu/info/21183/selection_criteria
FT
160(-1)/163/165
3.37(+.02)/3.53/3.68

PT
156(-1)/158(-1)/163(+1)
3.30/3.48(-.05)/3.62(.1)

[Huskies13!]

UNLV:
https://law.unlv.edu/admissions/fast-facts
116(+12)
153(-2)/157(-1)/159(-2)
3.21(+.23)/3.52(+.2)/3.71(+.23)

[dietcoke1]

spreadsheet updated, including fix on Columbia's 25th LSAT

[bmathers]

What's taking Wake Forest, Penn State, Georgia State, Villanova, and Pitt so long?

Hopefully they release before September LSAT scores come out, but I know that that is certainly not a guarantee.

[Mikey]

i wanna know if cornell is going to stick to their median

[SCOAngers]

UC Davis

158(-1)/163/164(-1)
3.31(+.04)/3.52(+.01)/3.73(+.05)
Class Size 157 (-23)

Women - 58%
Students of Color - 52%

[theboringest]

So I'm hoping that delays in reporting from the remaining schools translate into them having lower scores...

[proteinshake]

So I'm hoping that delays in reporting from the remaining schools translate into them having lower scores...

haha yeah this thread hasn't seen action for a while

[JCougar]

Saint Louis:
http://law.slu.edu/about-us/slu-law-profile

151 (-1) / 154 (-1) / 158
3.15 (-0.02) / 3.40 (-0.04) / 3.62 (-0.04)
186 (+16)

Another school raising class size while lowering standards.

way to stay classy, St. Louis!

Yeah, St. Louis needs more law grads like it needs more homicides. 90% of these people are fucked for life by this decision. Even above-median people at WashU can't find legit jobs.

[vcap180]

Saint Louis:
http://law.slu.edu/about-us/slu-law-profile

151 (-1) / 154 (-1) / 158
3.15 (-0.02) / 3.40 (-0.04) / 3.62 (-0.04)
186 (+16)

Another school raising class size while lowering standards.

way to stay classy, St. Louis!

Yeah, St. Louis needs more law grads like it needs more homicides. 90% of these people are fucked for life by this decision. Even above-median people at WashU can't find legit jobs.

Right! They couldn't even keep their football team lol.

Seriously though, I bet you have a better chance of becoming part of their absurdly high violent crime rate than finding a solid bar-required job there.

[asdfdfdfadfas]

Saint Louis:
http://law.slu.edu/about-us/slu-law-profile

151 (-1) / 154 (-1) / 158
3.15 (-0.02) / 3.40 (-0.04) / 3.62 (-0.04)
186 (+16)

Another school raising class size while lowering standards.

way to stay classy, St. Louis!

Yeah, St. Louis needs more law grads like it needs more homicides. 90% of these people are fucked for life by this decision. Even above-median people at WashU can't find legit jobs.

Your story ever make a full turn around Jcougar?

[JCougar]

Your story ever make a full turn around Jcougar?

Not yet, and living in poverty and practicing a complex area of law with zero resources against people with 10 times your experience and 1,000 times the resources is extremely stressful.

I had lunch with two of my fellow WashU law grads this weekend, and all three of us are not going to crack the $40K barrier this year, unless one of my better cases magically settles.

[JCougar]

unless one of my better cases magically settles.

Which brings up another point. All you future BigLawers need to make sure you're nice to your local plaintiff attorney. We are the reason you have a job, so if you run us out of business, you too will be run out of business.

The best way to cure the legal employment crisis is to actually give law grads some real training and resources. No matter what law school you plan on entering (even if it's HYS), be prepared for a huge, wasteful, useless joke for 3 years that teaches you nothing useful and drains your resources--and makes you depressed:

http://abovethelaw.com/2015/01/if-youre ... depressed/

You won't learn how to manage a case, market yourself, object to harassing discovery practices without pissing off the judge, depose a pathological liar, stand up to opposing counsel who's fraudulently negotiating in bad faith, do effective jury selection, etc. Even if you "win" at these things, the process is emotionally draining and makes you want to commit suicide. Sometimes it's a Phyrric victory.

Most of all, you won't find anybody that's willing to actually train you. Everyone just wants your labor or loan money without giving you anything in return. An "associate" is someone who just does endless bales and bales of busywork so partners can run up the bill. If you go solo, you'll barely have the money to pay your electric bill at home...let alone $300/month for a decent legal research service, $500 a month to rent a shitty office, etc. And a law student is an economic stimulus package for professors who do about 500 hours of pointless "work" per year and get paid a quarter million dollars.

The funny thing is that from my experience, there is an insane amount of demand for my services. I've only been managing my own practice for 6 months, and I already have a full case load. I just settled my first case yesterday, but it was a smaller one and not enough to be a fiscal breakthrough. I'll have enough money to tread water for another month or two. Nobody knows how to do what I do where I do it, and I get referrals from everybody. Most of my clients would simply never be able to find a lawyer if I weren't here, and I'm not exactly out in the boonies. This is all wasted business potential for the legal industry itself--not just for plaintiff attorneys, but for defense attorneys as well, who have to defend these lawsuits and train corporations on compliance. There's no incentive to pay for compliance training if you never get sued.

Problem is, when opposing counsel wants to be a bastard and not settle, I don't have the resources to go to court on 4 cases at the same time, each with 3 Biglaw partners and 2 associates defending them--each at firms that have 10,000 document brief-banks, partners around the world they can go to with questions, law libraries, 3 different legal research services, etc.

The ultimate problem with this industry is that it completely and wholly lacks leadership. It's a bunch of 60-year-old Martin Shkrelis looking to fatten their pockets at the expense of everyone else--including the legal industry itself. Nobody has the vision to see the bigger picture and address the systemic problems inherent in it. If it weren't for the federal school loan scam/pyramid scheme, the entire legal education industry would go out of business overnight.

[poptart123]

Well I guess the cup is half empty.

[dietcoke1]

Well I guess the cup is half empty.

not even half

[asdfdfdfadfas]

Well I guess the cup is half empty.

Just lol. Rumor has it law school= guaranteed 180k= to start. Just sign the dotted line, bro. Positive think your way to victory!

[asdfdfdfadfas]

unless one of my better cases magically settles.

Which brings up another point. All you future BigLawers need to make sure you're nice to your local plaintiff attorney. We are the reason you have a job, so if you run us out of business, you too will be run out of business.

The best way to cure the legal employment crisis is to actually give law grads some real training and resources. No matter what law school you plan on entering (even if it's HYS), be prepared for a huge, wasteful, useless joke for 3 years that teaches you nothing useful and drains your resources--and makes you depressed:

http://abovethelaw.com/2015/01/if-youre ... depressed/

You won't learn how to manage a case, market yourself, object to harassing discovery practices without pissing off the judge, depose a pathological liar, stand up to opposing counsel who's fraudulently negotiating in bad faith, do effective jury selection, etc. Even if you "win" at these things, the process is emotionally draining and makes you want to commit suicide. Sometimes it's a Phyrric victory.

Most of all, you won't find anybody that's willing to actually train you. Everyone just wants your labor or loan money without giving you anything in return. An "associate" is someone who just does endless bales and bales of busywork so partners can run up the bill. If you go solo, you'll barely have the money to pay your electric bill at home...let alone $300/month for a decent legal research service, $500 a month to rent a shitty office, etc. And a law student is an economic stimulus package for professors who do about 500 hours of pointless "work" per year and get paid a quarter million dollars.

The funny thing is that from my experience, there is an insane amount of demand for my services. I've only been managing my own practice for 6 months, and I already have a full case load. I just settled my first case yesterday, but it was a smaller one and not enough to be a fiscal breakthrough. I'll have enough money to tread water for another month or two. Nobody knows how to do what I do where I do it, and I get referrals from everybody. Most of my clients would simply never be able to find a lawyer if I weren't here, and I'm not exactly out in the boonies. This is all wasted business potential for the legal industry itself--not just for plaintiff attorneys, but for defense attorneys as well, who have to defend these lawsuits and train corporations on compliance. There's no incentive to pay for compliance training if you never get sued.

Problem is, when opposing counsel wants to be a bastard and not settle, I don't have the resources to go to court on 4 cases at the same time, each with 3 Biglaw partners and 2 associates defending them--each at firms that have 10,000 document brief-banks, partners around the world they can go to with questions, law libraries, 3 different legal research services, etc.

The ultimate problem with this industry is that it completely and wholly lacks leadership. It's a bunch of 60-year-old Martin Shkrelis looking to fatten their pockets at the expense of everyone else--including the legal industry itself. Nobody has the vision to see the bigger picture and address the systemic problems inherent in it. If it weren't for the federal school loan scam/pyramid scheme, the entire legal education industry would go out of business overnight.

Yeah. Are you carrying around a good amount of debt too?

Some of these problems, to be fair, aren't just law. Some of it is just working in general- greedy people, people in control doing things that are unethical, useless theories taught in academia, people in work unwilling to write shit down to teach anyone, Dealing with stupid people, dealing with intelligent people, etc.

To think- now is the BOOM time. What are we going to do if the FED ever raises interest rates?

The previous generation fucked us just about as hard as they could have, it isn't just some made up complaint. That is why so many men are leaving the work force.

[Hikikomorist]

unless one of my better cases magically settles.

Which brings up another point. All you future BigLawers need to make sure you're nice to your local plaintiff attorney. We are the reason you have a job, so if you run us out of business, you too will be run out of business.

The best way to cure the legal employment crisis is to actually give law grads some real training and resources. No matter what law school you plan on entering (even if it's HYS), be prepared for a huge, wasteful, useless joke for 3 years that teaches you nothing useful and drains your resources--and makes you depressed:

http://abovethelaw.com/2015/01/if-youre ... depressed/

You won't learn how to manage a case, market yourself, object to harassing discovery practices without pissing off the judge, depose a pathological liar, stand up to opposing counsel who's fraudulently negotiating in bad faith, do effective jury selection, etc. Even if you "win" at these things, the process is emotionally draining and makes you want to commit suicide. Sometimes it's a Phyrric victory.

Most of all, you won't find anybody that's willing to actually train you. Everyone just wants your labor or loan money without giving you anything in return. An "associate" is someone who just does endless bales and bales of busywork so partners can run up the bill. If you go solo, you'll barely have the money to pay your electric bill at home...let alone $300/month for a decent legal research service, $500 a month to rent a shitty office, etc. And a law student is an economic stimulus package for professors who do about 500 hours of pointless "work" per year and get paid a quarter million dollars.

The funny thing is that from my experience, there is an insane amount of demand for my services. I've only been managing my own practice for 6 months, and I already have a full case load. I just settled my first case yesterday, but it was a smaller one and not enough to be a fiscal breakthrough. I'll have enough money to tread water for another month or two. Nobody knows how to do what I do where I do it, and I get referrals from everybody. Most of my clients would simply never be able to find a lawyer if I weren't here, and I'm not exactly out in the boonies. This is all wasted business potential for the legal industry itself--not just for plaintiff attorneys, but for defense attorneys as well, who have to defend these lawsuits and train corporations on compliance. There's no incentive to pay for compliance training if you never get sued.

Problem is, when opposing counsel wants to be a bastard and not settle, I don't have the resources to go to court on 4 cases at the same time, each with 3 Biglaw partners and 2 associates defending them--each at firms that have 10,000 document brief-banks, partners around the world they can go to with questions, law libraries, 3 different legal research services, etc.

The ultimate problem with this industry is that it completely and wholly lacks leadership. It's a bunch of 60-year-old Martin Shkrelis looking to fatten their pockets at the expense of everyone else--including the legal industry itself. Nobody has the vision to see the bigger picture and address the systemic problems inherent in it. If it weren't for the federal school loan scam/pyramid scheme, the entire legal education industry would go out of business overnight.

Yeah. Are you carrying around a good amount of debt too?

Some of these problems, to be fair, aren't just law. Some of it is just working in general- greedy people, people in control doing things that are unethical, useless theories taught in academia, people in work unwilling to write shit down to teach anyone, Dealing with stupid people, dealing with intelligent people, etc.

To think- now is the BOOM time. What are we going to do if the FED ever raises interest rates?

The previous generation fucked us just about as hard as they could have, it isn't just some made up complaint. That is why so many men are leaving the work force.

Very subtle.

[asdfdfdfadfas]

unless one of my better cases magically settles.

Which brings up another point. All you future BigLawers need to make sure you're nice to your local plaintiff attorney. We are the reason you have a job, so if you run us out of business, you too will be run out of business.

The best way to cure the legal employment crisis is to actually give law grads some real training and resources. No matter what law school you plan on entering (even if it's HYS), be prepared for a huge, wasteful, useless joke for 3 years that teaches you nothing useful and drains your resources--and makes you depressed:

http://abovethelaw.com/2015/01/if-youre ... depressed/

You won't learn how to manage a case, market yourself, object to harassing discovery practices without pissing off the judge, depose a pathological liar, stand up to opposing counsel who's fraudulently negotiating in bad faith, do effective jury selection, etc. Even if you "win" at these things, the process is emotionally draining and makes you want to commit suicide. Sometimes it's a Phyrric victory.

Most of all, you won't find anybody that's willing to actually train you. Everyone just wants your labor or loan money without giving you anything in return. An "associate" is someone who just does endless bales and bales of busywork so partners can run up the bill. If you go solo, you'll barely have the money to pay your electric bill at home...let alone $300/month for a decent legal research service, $500 a month to rent a shitty office, etc. And a law student is an economic stimulus package for professors who do about 500 hours of pointless "work" per year and get paid a quarter million dollars.

The funny thing is that from my experience, there is an insane amount of demand for my services. I've only been managing my own practice for 6 months, and I already have a full case load. I just settled my first case yesterday, but it was a smaller one and not enough to be a fiscal breakthrough. I'll have enough money to tread water for another month or two. Nobody knows how to do what I do where I do it, and I get referrals from everybody. Most of my clients would simply never be able to find a lawyer if I weren't here, and I'm not exactly out in the boonies. This is all wasted business potential for the legal industry itself--not just for plaintiff attorneys, but for defense attorneys as well, who have to defend these lawsuits and train corporations on compliance. There's no incentive to pay for compliance training if you never get sued.

Problem is, when opposing counsel wants to be a bastard and not settle, I don't have the resources to go to court on 4 cases at the same time, each with 3 Biglaw partners and 2 associates defending them--each at firms that have 10,000 document brief-banks, partners around the world they can go to with questions, law libraries, 3 different legal research services, etc.

The ultimate problem with this industry is that it completely and wholly lacks leadership. It's a bunch of 60-year-old Martin Shkrelis looking to fatten their pockets at the expense of everyone else--including the legal industry itself. Nobody has the vision to see the bigger picture and address the systemic problems inherent in it. If it weren't for the federal school loan scam/pyramid scheme, the entire legal education industry would go out of business overnight.

Yeah. Are you carrying around a good amount of debt too?

Some of these problems, to be fair, aren't just law. Some of it is just working in general- greedy people, people in control doing things that are unethical, useless theories taught in academia, people in work unwilling to write shit down to teach anyone, Dealing with stupid people, dealing with intelligent people, etc.

To think- now is the BOOM time. What are we going to do if the FED ever raises interest rates?

The previous generation fucked us just about as hard as they could have, it isn't just some made up complaint. That is why so many men are leaving the work force.

Very subtle.

Very Subtle? What are you talking about? I wasn't trying to hide anything. Are you going to send me to the thought police or should I take a timeout in a safe zone and do some thinking to myself .

http://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2016/08/ ... rking.html

[poptart123]

Who is Greg Mankiw and why doesn't he post more medians?!?!

[proteinshake]

Who is Greg Mankiw and why doesn't he post more medians?!?!

the famous economist!

[PrezRand]

Who is Greg Mankiw and why doesn't he post more medians?!?!

He's ight. Probably the best and most respected free-market economist in public policy right now. He almost got his JD too

[Tiago Splitter]

Sorry been away awhile can I get a tl;dr