Latest employment data

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starry eyed
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby starry eyed » Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:53 pm

he's serious but yes Y should be 100%
Last edited by starry eyed on Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Moneytrees
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby Moneytrees » Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:54 pm

Anyone want to put forth an explanation for H's mediocre numbers?

03152016
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby 03152016 » Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:56 pm

@mcavoy
i think gulc probably does have a fair bit of self selection
lot of school funding, but they put up high pi/gov't numbers even before they funded an eighth of the graduating class

@moneytrees
i did on the last page

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starry eyed
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby starry eyed » Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:57 pm

Moneytrees wrote:Anyone want to put forth an explanation for H's mediocre numbers?


what did you expect? for it to be 90%?

if that was true, then practically everyone who chose H had biglaw/Fc in mind. But from this site alone, it's obvious that they strive for more unicornish jobs.

03152016
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby 03152016 » Sat Apr 11, 2015 2:07 pm

the problem with all of this bl/fc stuff is that people think it means more than it does
it's a useful number in the sense that it generally affirms that a certain chunk of schools place well in biglaw
prospective students should not draw conclusions much further than that

harvard's bl/fc is lower than penn's. but that doesn't mean penn has better placement
similarly, cornell doesn't outplace nyu
and duke doesn't outplace yale
so use these numbers as a tool, but don't assume a lower relative number is "mediocre" (for an explanation of why, see my post on the last page)

there is no magic formula
a lot of the really good info (grade cut-offs, elite firm placement, oci success rate) aren't publicly disclosed
tho imo they should be
there's simply no substitute for doing thorough research about law school job placement, which includes bl/fc, but is not limited to it, even for a biglaw gunner

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rpupkin
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby rpupkin » Sat Apr 11, 2015 2:49 pm

Brut wrote:
kcdc1 wrote:
JFO1833 wrote:2: Harvard - BL+FC-71%, FTLTBR-90%, FTLTBR (w/o LSF)-85%
https://hls.harvard.edu/content/uploads ... -Final.pdf

These numbers are not particularly impressive - makes Harvard seem like just another T14 except they don't offer merit scholarships. I don't see a good reason to give Harvard the same pass Yale gets either.

haven't been following this thread so idk if this point has already been made
but bl/fc only gives a very rough sense of a school's placement ability
it doesn't account for self-selection out of biglaw, which is higher at certain schools – hys, nyu, boalt, gulc, possibly uva tho a lot of that is a recent pi spike coinciding w/ school funding
and it doesn't account for elite firm placement - the 101+ category encompasses a broad range of firms, some far more selective than others
harvard's 71% bl/fc is about where i would have expected it. when i look at these numbers, i'm more inclined to think H students are selecting out of bl than H students are having placement problems
(i think this may play into overall ft/lt/jd numbers as well, H students selecting riskier tracks, as opposed to the safe bl/fc route)
at equal cost and a goal of biglaw, i'd pick H over P 7 days a week

Brut gets it. Many of you 0Ls do not. Guys, big law—while certainly better than shit law or unemployment—is not a good outcome for the majority of people who end up in it. People hate it. LIke, really, really hate it.

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starry eyed
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby starry eyed » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:12 pm

And NYC (the easiest market) big law forces you to live in a third world country where half your check goes to a studio apartment. Why ppl want it so bad is beyond me

071816
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby 071816 » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:16 pm

starry eyed wrote:And NYC (the easiest market) big law forces you to live in a third world country where half your check goes to a studio apartment. Why ppl want it so bad is beyond me

lol

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sublime
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby sublime » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:23 pm

..

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Capitol_Idea
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby Capitol_Idea » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:25 pm

Biglaw isn't the desired outcome per se, but it's one that makes sticker debt almost palatable. Insofar as existing metrics are useful for predicting a biglaw outcome, it can then be useful for predicting whether you have a shot at getting a job that pays down dat debt.

But yes, 'Biglaw or Bust', especially if you have scholarship money or other means of reducing debt, is far from inherently ideal.

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starry eyed
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby starry eyed » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:29 pm

The more I think about how absolutely shitty nyc really is, The more I would consider taking out an extra 200k for Harvard in lieu of Full ride C/C/c to keep options open - it makes more sense now why so
Many do it

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starry eyed
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby starry eyed » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:46 pm

sublime wrote:
starry eyed wrote:And NYC (the easiest market) big law forces you to live in a third world country where half your check goes to a studio apartment. Why ppl want it so bad is beyond me



I mean, you can disagree but I am sure you can figure out why people covet it. Money, prestige, exit options, living in NYC, more available spots, less ties sensitive, etc.

Also, if you are spending $6,500+ a month on a studio, I have no idea where you are living.


Lol at prestige. Unless you're a big law partner, you are a middle class bro In nyc

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star fox
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby star fox » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:48 pm

Moneytrees wrote:Anyone want to put forth an explanation for H's mediocre numbers?

Just go to the choosing a law school forum. People choose Harvard over full ride at T14s all the time because they consider big law beneath them.

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runinthefront
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby runinthefront » Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:49 pm

starry eyed wrote:
sublime wrote:
starry eyed wrote:And NYC (the easiest market) big law forces you to live in a third world country where half your check goes to a studio apartment. Why ppl want it so bad is beyond me



I mean, you can disagree but I am sure you can figure out why people covet it. Money, prestige, exit options, living in NYC, more available spots, less ties sensitive, etc.

Also, if you are spending $6,500+ a month on a studio, I have no idea where you are living.


Lol at prestige. Unless you're a big law partner, you are a middle class bro In nyc


zero debt third year single male/female in NYC biglaw is anything but middle class to me

although I'd imagine that many people have differing opinions on what "middle class" means, even in NYC

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sublime
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby sublime » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:05 pm

..

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starry eyed
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby starry eyed » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:07 pm

if someone gets biglaw in nyc, are they destined to work there for life if they have no real ties anywhere?

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starry eyed
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby starry eyed » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:08 pm

sublime wrote:
starry eyed wrote:
sublime wrote:
starry eyed wrote:And NYC (the easiest market) big law forces you to live in a third world country where half your check goes to a studio apartment. Why ppl want it so bad is beyond me



I mean, you can disagree but I am sure you can figure out why people covet it. Money, prestige, exit options, living in NYC, more available spots, less ties sensitive, etc.

Also, if you are spending $6,500+ a month on a studio, I have no idea where you are living.


Lol at prestige. Unless you're a big law partner, you are a middle class bro In nyc


Ignoring that NYC biglaw is objectively not middleclass, there is prestige in certain firm names. Not that there should be, but there is.


"We collected a few of the most important ones. But first, let's define the "middle class." For the Council's purpose they went with households with incomes between 100 percent and 300 percent of the area median income. Here in New York that means income between $66,400 and $199,200." -from a google search

so much for 'objective'

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sublime
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby sublime » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:11 pm

..

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Mack.Hambleton
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby Mack.Hambleton » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:15 pm

Daily reminder starting biglaw salary is in the top ~5% of household incomes in the US

you rich fuckers

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mt2165
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby mt2165 » Sat Apr 11, 2015 5:23 pm

runinthefront wrote:
starry eyed wrote:
sublime wrote:
starry eyed wrote:And NYC (the easiest market) big law forces you to live in a third world country where half your check goes to a studio apartment. Why ppl want it so bad is beyond me



I mean, you can disagree but I am sure you can figure out why people covet it. Money, prestige, exit options, living in NYC, more available spots, less ties sensitive, etc.

Also, if you are spending $6,500+ a month on a studio, I have no idea where you are living.


Lol at prestige. Unless you're a big law partner, you are a middle class bro In nyc


zero debt third year single male/female in NYC biglaw is anything but middle class to me

although I'd imagine that many people have differing opinions on what "middle class" means, even in NYC


middle class is whatever it needs to be for you to not feel like the either the insufferable 1 percenters/oligopoly or the stinky proletariat welfare dependents

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JohannDeMann
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby JohannDeMann » Sat Apr 11, 2015 5:45 pm

nah 20% of people make more than $135k. Top 5% is around 260k and top 1% is $615k. Also NYC is expensive as fuck. Everyone lives like middle class there.

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Cobretti
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby Cobretti » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:16 pm

JohannDeMann wrote:nah 20% of people make more than $135k. Top 5% is around 260k and top 1% is $615k. Also NYC is expensive as fuck. Everyone lives like middle class there.

I don't think that's right, unless you're saying some different values for NYC?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_income_in_the_United_States#Income_distribution

100k is top ~7%

SLS_AMG
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby SLS_AMG » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:18 pm

starry eyed wrote:
"We collected a few of the most important ones. But first, let's define the "middle class." For the Council's purpose they went with households with incomes between 100 percent and 300 percent of the area median income. Here in New York that means income between $66,400 and $199,200." -from a google search

so much for 'objective'


All this tells us is that you don't know what a "household" is. What are you, some 20-year-old who's never done their own taxes before? Good game.

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Tiago Splitter
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby Tiago Splitter » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:29 pm

starry eyed wrote:The more I think about how absolutely shitty nyc really is, The more I would consider taking out an extra 200k for Harvard in lieu of Full ride C/C/c to keep options open - it makes more sense now why so
Many do it

And then when you end up in the 40% of Harvard's class that is starting in NYC biglaw you'll feel pretty stupid. If you wanna skip biglaw take the full ride and skip biglaw.

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starry eyed
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Re: Latest employment data

Postby starry eyed » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:41 pm

fair point. 40% is a lot higher than i thought it would be.




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