Latest employment data Forum
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Re: Latest employment data
The issue I think is that "Mostly interested in PI" means "Lol, you're obviously not going to do PI dude, see you at OCI."
Buttloads of 0Ls are mostly interested in PI. But there they are at OCI.
So if you want to do OCI at Michigan then go for it.
Buttloads of 0Ls are mostly interested in PI. But there they are at OCI.
So if you want to do OCI at Michigan then go for it.
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Re: Latest employment data
What point is your comment trying to make? Would a total COA of 150k make it better? Genuine question--not trying to be a jerk.hoos89 wrote:Your math seems to assume that nobody has a scholarship and everybody is paying 100% of their living expenses to the school.
Last edited by runinthefront on Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Latest employment data
COA is what it is (the student still has to pay it, although I would argue that living costs are not actual costs of attending school because you'd be paying them regardless unless you'd otherwise be living at home or something), point is that the school isn't getting all of it. Still a good deal for the school, but if someone's going to use numbers to support a point they should at least be right.runinthefront wrote:What point is your comment trying to make? Would a total COA of 150k make it better? Genuine question--not trying to be a jerk.hoos89 wrote:Your math seems to assume that nobody has a scholarship and everybody is paying 100% of their living expenses to the school.
- storpappa
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Re: Latest employment data
It doesn't matter who the name is on the checks, the student is still writing checks for 3 years.
And not working full time, which would have offset those living expenses.... again the assumption is not living at home and not living off of a trust fund. If your wanting to see a full list of disclaimers.
The point of the SFJ is still the same ... it benefits the school, not the student.
And not working full time, which would have offset those living expenses.... again the assumption is not living at home and not living off of a trust fund. If your wanting to see a full list of disclaimers.
The point of the SFJ is still the same ... it benefits the school, not the student.
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Re: Latest employment data
That Emory plan is ridiculous. $12k/year and they're limited to working 80 hours a month. You can make more working at McDonald's. I can't believe that counts for their employment stats.
Just for contrast, the UVA Kennedy Fellowship funded positions pay $31.5k and include bar review stipends. Not all law school funded positions are equal.
Just for contrast, the UVA Kennedy Fellowship funded positions pay $31.5k and include bar review stipends. Not all law school funded positions are equal.
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Re: Latest employment data
is 100% of UVA's SFJ the Kennedy Fellowship? If so, that's not a bad deal (considering the other option is unemployment)envisciguy wrote:That Emory plan is ridiculous. $12k/year and they're limited to working 80 hours a month. You can make more working at McDonald's. I can't believe that counts for their employment stats.
Just for contrast, the UVA Kennedy Fellowship funded positions pay $31.5k and include bar review stipends. Not all law school funded positions are equal.
For what it's worth, from what I hear, at least a few of Cornell's 12 SFJ for c/o 2014 were closer to Emory's plan than UVA's.
Last edited by runinthefront on Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:30 am, edited 2 times in total.
- sneezus
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Re: Latest employment data
yeah you're right, so is Mal Reynolds up there (ya twat). overreaction probably. it's a nerve-wracking time, i'm clearly a bit on edge about this stuff. i'll chillruninthefront wrote:Lol $120k from UM for primarily PI w/ option of biglaw is still not a bad optionsneezus wrote:fuck. i had just come to the decision that Michigan would be where I deposit this month (they offered me 120k).
this just throws it all back up in the air. I'm mostly interested in PI, but i really want the biglaw option there.
please don't take this side-commentary the wrong way
just don't end up like the hard-headed peers that precede you and understand that you're not getting Indianapolis biglaw or w/e secondary markets these kids target
That's a nice amount of scholly $$$
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Re: Latest employment data
From my understanding, they're all either Kennedy or Powell fellowships. Powell is $40k.runinthefront wrote:is 100% of UVA's SFJ the Kennedy Fellowship? If so, that's not a bad deal (considering the other option is unemployment)envisciguy wrote:That Emory plan is ridiculous. $12k/year and they're limited to working 80 hours a month. You can make more working at McDonald's. I can't believe that counts for their employment stats.
Just for contrast, the UVA Kennedy Fellowship funded positions pay $31.5k and include bar review stipends. Not all law school funded positions are equal.
For what it's worth, from what I hear, Cornell's at least a few of Cornell's 12 SFJ for c/o 2014 were closer to Emory's plan than UVA's.
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Re: Latest employment data
storpappa wrote:It doesn't matter who the name is on the checks, the student is still writing checks for 3 years.
And not working full time, which would have offset those living expenses.... again the assumption is not living at home and not living off of a trust fund. If your wanting to see a full list of disclaimers.
The point of the SFJ is still the same ... it benefits the school, not the student.
It matters to the school whose name is on the checks, and that was kind of your point: that the school gets $198k guaranteed. They don't. It probably averages more like $90k per student (assuming SFJ payment). Also, you're right: foregone income (if any) is a cost of attendance, but cost of living is not (except to the extent you pay more for CoL in school than you otherwise would).
Also, to say flat out that SFJ doesn't benefit students at all is kind of silly. It benefits the school by helping them boost their employment numbers (although the new ABA disclosures temper that somewhat), and it benefits the students by effectively giving them a partial refund of tuition (8% at sticker, 16% on a half scholarship). It's not as good as reducing the tuition to begin with, but it's still better than doing neither.
- Robb
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Re: Latest employment data
it also gives them experience, which could be helpful in leading to a permanent job. would be nice to have data of what people do after the school funded jobhoos89 wrote:Also, to say flat out that SFJ doesn't benefit students at all is kind of silly. It benefits the school by helping them boost their employment numbers (although the new ABA disclosures temper that somewhat), and it benefits the students by effectively giving them a partial refund of tuition (8% at sticker, 16% on a half scholarship). It's not as good as reducing the tuition to begin with, but it's still better than doing neither.
- TheodoreKGB
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Re: Latest employment data
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Last edited by TheodoreKGB on Sun Apr 26, 2015 4:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- BrazilBandit
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- Robb
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Re: Latest employment data
Wow.TheodoreKGB wrote:https://www.law.georgetown.edu/careers/ ... e-Info.pdf
You thought Michigan was bad?
80% FTLTBR, 48% BL+FC, 70% FTLTBR w/o SFJ.
(-4%, -1%, and +2% respectively)
Last edited by Robb on Tue Apr 14, 2015 12:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Latest employment data
GeorgeTTTown strikes again!TheodoreKGB wrote:https://www.law.georgetown.edu/careers/ ... e-Info.pdf
You thought Michigan was bad?
- pamphleteer
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Re: Latest employment data
Can we stop calling it the T14 now?
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Re: Latest employment data
looking forward to the damage control on this one
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Re: Latest employment data
I know people always use the PI excuse for NYU, but I wonder how much that holds up for GULC. They're 24% government/PI. Any idea how much of that is self-selection versus striking out at OCI?
E: Their FLTBR minus SFJ numbers make me lean more towards the "striking out" explanation, though.
E: Their FLTBR minus SFJ numbers make me lean more towards the "striking out" explanation, though.
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- Clemenceau
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Re: Latest employment data
Hasn't gulc typically been at least somewhat decent for clerkships?
22/626 = 3.5% fed clerk
And 29 state/local clerkships is probably not a good sign either from my understanding of local clerkships
22/626 = 3.5% fed clerk
And 29 state/local clerkships is probably not a good sign either from my understanding of local clerkships
- Mack.Hambleton
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Re: Latest employment data
pamphleteer wrote:Can we stop calling it the T14 now?
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Re: Latest employment data
Disparity in outcomes between Georgetown and the rest of the T14 is starting to really be huge.
- Winston1984
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Re: Latest employment data
Is it the T12, or the T13?
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- Desert Fox
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Re: Latest employment data
I wonder if the Chicago market was poor in 2014. At northwestern, rumor was 2013 was a better year than 2014. I wonder if that was just because of the Chicago market and if it impacted Michigan as well.
IMO the "prestige" hypothesis is least convincing. I'd assume self selection is a much bigger factor in school to school variance.
IMO the "prestige" hypothesis is least convincing. I'd assume self selection is a much bigger factor in school to school variance.
Last edited by Desert Fox on Sat Jan 27, 2018 4:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
- zombie mcavoy
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Re: Latest employment data
T13 for now, because 0Ls are not going to assume the excluded school is Michigan if it were T12. But now we begin the push for T12. Has to be incremental.Winston1984 wrote:Is it the T12, or the T13?
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Re: Latest employment data
Now is the time to strike, UTMack.Hambleton wrote:pamphleteer wrote:Can we stop calling it the T14 now?
(comes in with <40% big law/clerkships)
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Re: Latest employment data
At least Michigan had 81.8% LTFTBR - SFJ, compared to GULC's 69.65% (which is worse than a bunch of non-T14 schools).Winston1984 wrote:Is it the T12, or the T13?
Last edited by hoos89 on Tue Apr 14, 2015 1:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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