Never been so depressed in my life-

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Clearly
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Clearly » Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:12 am

Retakers, I jumped one point on my retake. Then 11 more on my third try. Unless you've hit the retake limit, do what you have to do.

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thejerseykid
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby thejerseykid » Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:25 am

ManoftheHour wrote:
inlovewithpiper wrote:
This is an interesting story... May I ask what you would have done if, on that second re-take, you had scored a 165 instead of a 163?

Would you still have re-taken for a 3rd (and waited another year in the process)?


I probably would have retaken until I could no more. I found out that some people use the June LSAT for leverage for their current offers. As in, I would have taken the June LSAT regardless because I already had offers on the table. Remember, at the time, I was set on going that year. However, if I got a better score, I could use it for scholly negotiations. I found a decent job soon afterwards to support myself and some up some cash while I was at it. Even though I had decreased study time the next time around, I still knew I knew the material well enough. It was just a matter of controlling my nerves and pulling it together for just one time.


This right here. I took a year off from school as well and ended up scoring lower this second time around (luckily it was only by one point). While I would feel much better applying with a higher score than my first one, that's obviously not going to happen. So the plan is to apply with my current scores which should be enough to at least get my foot in the door at some places I'm interested in, retake in June, hopefully do better and then use that to negotiate.

All this is to say: OP, I agree with those who say you've got to keep going until you hit your limit. This time didn't work out for you, there's nothing to be done about that. Now you've got to come up with a new plan (i.e. retake) and try to use that to your advantage. As you can see from the stories you've read on here, there's always a risk for disappointment in the law school admissions game but, sometimes, if you're willing to make the effort, you can get a second shot.

Best of luck moving forward. Maybe I'll see you around the June 2014 prep thread.

Hoping4Happiness
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Hoping4Happiness » Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:36 am

ManoftheHour wrote:Hey OP, here's my story:

I took the October 2011 LSAT. Scored a 162. I knew I could do better so I took a year off to study. I took the December 2012 LSAT and you know what happened? I effing bombed it. Bombed the shit out of it. Section 1 was a LG and I couldn't do Game 2 and Game 4 at all. I spent so much time on Game 1 and was so confused by Game 2 that I flipped back and forth before settling on Game 3. I finished that one and ran out of time. Had to guess D for ALL of Game 2 and Game 4. I was pretty dejected and was hoping that it was experimental. I couldn't focus on Section 2 (Reading Comp). Section after section went by and there were no more LGs to be found. After studying for AN ENTIRE YEAR, I CANCELLED my score. I was never more depressed than that in my life. Then I applied with my TTT 162 and almost went to NDLS at sticker. I thought I was done with the LSAT and would just go. Then one day while mopping the floor during a closing shift at a cafe that I worked at, I realized that I still had something left in the tank. I knew from all my PTs I was better than a 162. So you know what I did? That night in late March, I decided to just take the June LSAT for fun. Why not? I had nothing to lose. If I succeed, I'll take another year. If I fail, I'll just go to ND (at sticker, that's a fucking awful decision and I'm so glad people on TLS convinced me otherwise).

I took the June LSAT, and do you know what happened? I got a 163. A. Fucking. One. Sixty. Three. That's one point higher than the 162 that I got on my FIRST LSAT. After all that studying?! Dafuq.

So you know, with 3 shots at the LSAT and the highest score I got was a 163, you figured I'd just quit right? I don't know. I was pretty depressed but I just KNEW that it wasn't my best. I knew in my heart that I could do better. Do you know what I did next?

I took a year off. lol. Gun for that December LSAT. Going to get my 170 one way or another. I had to prove my PTs weren't a fluke. I knew I knew the stuff. I just had to deliver on test day. So I studied and well....

I still didn't get a 170. But today, I got a 167, and that's a hell whole lot better than that TTT 162. Plus, with falling apps, my score is even more valuable now than it was back in 2011.

If you worked hard and you know you know the material, don't give up hope. I wish I got the 170. I still know I could do it but atlas, I am out of retakes. I am disappointed but I am pretty happy at the same time. I put myself in a better position (and gained a bunch of work experience as well as life experience while doing it).

http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... 1&t=203182


WOW.That is the most amazing story I have ever read.

+10000000

ManOfTheHour, THANK YOU for sharing that nugget of inspiration with me. Much respect. On that T14 vibe... I am so happy for you! Just wow. Right in the FEELZ.

Hoping4Happiness
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Hoping4Happiness » Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:43 am

thejerseykid wrote:
ManoftheHour wrote:
inlovewithpiper wrote:
This is an interesting story... May I ask what you would have done if, on that second re-take, you had scored a 165 instead of a 163?

Would you still have re-taken for a 3rd (and waited another year in the process)?


I probably would have retaken until I could no more. I found out that some people use the June LSAT for leverage for their current offers. As in, I would have taken the June LSAT regardless because I already had offers on the table. Remember, at the time, I was set on going that year. However, if I got a better score, I could use it for scholly negotiations. I found a decent job soon afterwards to support myself and some up some cash while I was at it. Even though I had decreased study time the next time around, I still knew I knew the material well enough. It was just a matter of controlling my nerves and pulling it together for just one time.


This right here. I took a year off from school as well and ended up scoring lower this second time around (luckily it was only by one point). While I would feel much better applying with a higher score than my first one, that's obviously not going to happen. So the plan is to apply with my current scores which should be enough to at least get my foot in the door at some places I'm interested in, retake in June, hopefully do better and then use that to negotiate.

All this is to say: OP, I agree with those who say you've got to keep going until you hit your limit. This time didn't work out for you, there's nothing to be done about that. Now you've got to come up with a new plan (i.e. retake) and try to use that to your advantage. As you can see from the stories you've read on here, there's always a risk for disappointment in the law school admissions game but, sometimes, if you're willing to make the effort, you can get a second shot.

Best of luck moving forward. Maybe I'll see you around the June 2014 prep thread.


Thank you 'jersey kid'. Man... I NEVER considered re-taking a THIRD time, but you guys are certainly making an appealing case... I suppose applying this cycle and re-taking in June couldn't hurt me. I'm not sure if I am up to go through all the material again, but it could certainly be worth it.

dosto
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby dosto » Fri Jan 03, 2014 4:00 am

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Last edited by dosto on Tue Aug 25, 2015 3:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Amity
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Amity » Fri Jan 03, 2014 4:26 am

Never saw your GPA...what is it? I have a T-14 friend with a 163 who was accepted to a T-14 (but she also had a killer GPA).
Maybe I am wrong but I thought schools accepted the highest LSAT score. Right?

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ratfukr
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby ratfukr » Fri Jan 03, 2014 4:37 am

a top 5 consensus poster said u could use some help so i ran 2 the on-topics 2 post this
i'm new @ advice so inb4 "don't listen 2 ratfukr she is a vulgar rake w <1000 posts & doesn't even use commas so how would she kno about comma moving school"
anyway it seems 2 b the case that u can take the lsats a bunch & nobody cares but that's about the only useful info this hivemind can give u on this topic
the important point is that there is so much fuckin striver neurosis here and u cannot let it eat u alive. ur goal of minimal debt is commendable and a year isn't shit
in 1 year some posters on this board will b 1 year closer 2 rotting away in a golden cage servicing sticker debt doing a job they hate if they're lucky
u will b pretty much in the same exact place as b4 & maybe u'll have a few more lsat points under ur belt & u will have had a year 2 think about life/work
just take like 5 seconds 2 breathe a lil bit & get perspective & just take lsats til ur bored of em & just enjoy ur life while u can
the basketball avi poster seemed like he had some cr comments but tbh they were tl;dr

shout out 2 ron mexico much love

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Blumpbeef
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Blumpbeef » Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:02 am

Hoping4Happiness wrote:WOW.That is the most amazing story I have ever read.

+10000000


I retook after studying for another year and got the exact same score I got the first time. I was incredibly depressed. I was convinced I wasn't going to be able to get into a T14 (or T30) school. I pretty much gave up on law school and started trying to figure out how to get my shit together and find some sort of job. But first I studied some more and retook a 3rd time. When I got home from the test I was convinced that I had failed it. I seriously considered canceling my score because I didn't want to end up with a worse one than I had the first two times. I stopped coming on TLS or even thinking about law school at this point and just started looking for any job that would let me not have to live with my parents. Three weeks later, I'm back on TLS to see if scores are supposed to be coming out soon. I was just in time to catch the waiting thread at its most neurotic and scores came out I think the next day. Went up seven points.

It sure as fuck wasn't easy, but it's doable.

Hoping4Happiness
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Hoping4Happiness » Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:15 am

Blumpbeef wrote:
Hoping4Happiness wrote:WOW.That is the most amazing story I have ever read.

+10000000


I retook after studying for another year and got the exact same score I got the first time. I was incredibly depressed. I was convinced I wasn't going to be able to get into a T14 (or T30) school. I pretty much gave up on law school and started trying to figure out how to get my shit together and find some sort of job. But first I studied some more and retook a 3rd time. When I got home from the test I was convinced that I had failed it. I seriously considered canceling my score because I didn't want to end up with a worse one than I had the first two times. I stopped coming on TLS or even thinking about law school at this point and just started looking for any job that would let me not have to live with my parents. Three weeks later, I'm back on TLS to see if scores are supposed to be coming out soon. I was just in time to catch the waiting thread at its most neurotic and scores came out I think the next day. Went up seven points.

It sure as fuck wasn't easy, but it's doable.


"and just started looking for any job that would let me not have to live with my parents" +1000 I understand the struggle.

But wow what a turn around... would have loved to see your face when you saw your score. Are you going to apply this cycle? Did you spend time on your personal statement yet?

Hoping4Happiness
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Hoping4Happiness » Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:21 am

ratfukr wrote:a top 5 consensus poster said u could use some help so i ran 2 the on-topics 2 post this
i'm new @ advice so inb4 "don't listen 2 ratfukr she is a vulgar rake w <1000 posts & doesn't even use commas so how would she kno about comma moving school"
anyway it seems 2 b the case that u can take the lsats a bunch & nobody cares but that's about the only useful info this hivemind can give u on this topic
the important point is that there is so much fuckin striver neurosis here and u cannot let it eat u alive. ur goal of minimal debt is commendable and a year isn't shit
in 1 year some posters on this board will b 1 year closer 2 rotting away in a golden cage servicing sticker debt doing a job they hate if they're lucky
u will b pretty much in the same exact place as b4 & maybe u'll have a few more lsat points under ur belt & u will have had a year 2 think about life/work
just take like 5 seconds 2 breathe a lil bit & get perspective & just take lsats til ur bored of em & just enjoy ur life while u can
the basketball avi poster seemed like he had some cr comments but tbh they were tl;dr

shout out 2 ron mexico much love


lol you guys are quite comical. I THINK l understand what you said, and thank you. Thank you to athletic hipster dude too, good looking out. Reading everyones responses helped ground me again to realize that it's 'just a test' to a certain extent at least... and that it's not over until it's over l guess... maybe i'm just vulnerable right now but your stories are really inspiring..

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Blumpbeef
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Blumpbeef » Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:23 am

This was two years ago now. I had tried writing a PS but didn't get very far. I didn't have a lot of motivation for working on apps with my old score, so I spent 2-3 weeks doing all my apps after I got my score back. I think the first thing I did was email all the schools I wanted to apply to and asked for fee waivers because I hadn't gotten any after the October test.

In hindsight, my cycle worked out, but it didn't go as well as I would have liked, and I think a lot of that came down to me having somewhat sloppy apps.

Hoping4Happiness
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Hoping4Happiness » Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:34 am

Blumpbeef wrote:This was two years ago now. I had tried writing a PS but didn't get very far. I didn't have a lot of motivation for working on apps with my old score, so I spent 2-3 weeks doing all my apps after I got my score back. I think the first thing I did was email all the schools I wanted to apply to and asked for fee waivers because I hadn't gotten any after the October test.

In hindsight, my cycle worked out, but it didn't go as well as I would have liked, and I think a lot of that came down to me having somewhat sloppy apps.


Oh thats great. Congrats on being half way done with law school!
Then can I ask you in your opinion do you think it would be better to apply sooner (3/4 days after scores come out) with sloppy apps, or for me to just apply in mid Jan probably close to the 14th but with more time to go over my PS/resume/ supplementary material? I feel like my PS still needs a LOT of work... but I also know there will be a huge influx of people sending in their apps once they get their scores... :L
Last edited by Hoping4Happiness on Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

Hoping4Happiness
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Hoping4Happiness » Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:34 am

Amity wrote:Never saw your GPA...what is it? I have a T-14 friend with a 163 who was accepted to a T-14 (but she also had a killer GPA).
Maybe I am wrong but I thought schools accepted the highest LSAT score. Right?


It's a bit above a 3.7

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Blumpbeef
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Blumpbeef » Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:47 am

Hoping4Happiness wrote:
Blumpbeef wrote:This was two years ago now. I had tried writing a PS but didn't get very far. I didn't have a lot of motivation for working on apps with my old score, so I spent 2-3 weeks doing all my apps after I got my score back. I think the first thing I did was email all the schools I wanted to apply to and asked for fee waivers because I hadn't gotten any after the October test.

In hindsight, my cycle worked out, but it didn't go as well as I would have liked, and I think a lot of that came down to me having somewhat sloppy apps.


Oh thats great. Congrats on being half way done with law school!
Then can I ask you in your opinion do you think it would be better to apply sooner (3/4 days after scores come out) with sloppy apps, or for me to just apply in mid Jan probably close to the 14th but with more time to go over my PS/resume/ supplementary material? I feel like my PS still needs a LOT of work... but I also know there will be a huge influx of people sending in their apps once they get their scores... :L


You should think about whether you want to apply at all. I decided not to apply after my first LSAT because I didn't want to get rejected and just waited until the next cycle.

This is just my theory, I'm not sure if it is true, but I think if you are a splitter or have "reach" numbers it doesn't hurt to apply late because you are going to end up on a waitlist anyway. That said, in my cycle applying late Jan. I got waitlisted at schools I probably could have expected to be straight admitted to because by that point the classes were largely filled.

Your GPA is really good, you can go to any school in the country if you kill the LSAT. You probably shouldn't settle for any school that is willing to take you with your current score if you know that you can do better. You should set your sights higher than a partial scholarship at a T2 school.

inlovewithpiper
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby inlovewithpiper » Fri Jan 03, 2014 12:26 pm

ratfukr wrote:a top 5 consensus poster said u could use some help so i ran 2 the on-topics 2 post this
i'm new @ advice so inb4 "don't listen 2 ratfukr she is a vulgar rake w <1000 posts & doesn't even use commas so how would she kno about comma moving school"
anyway it seems 2 b the case that u can take the lsats a bunch & nobody cares but that's about the only useful info this hivemind can give u on this topic
the important point is that there is so much fuckin striver neurosis here and u cannot let it eat u alive. ur goal of minimal debt is commendable and a year isn't shit
in 1 year some posters on this board will b 1 year closer 2 rotting away in a golden cage servicing sticker debt doing a job they hate if they're lucky
u will b pretty much in the same exact place as b4 & maybe u'll have a few more lsat points under ur belt & u will have had a year 2 think about life/work
just take like 5 seconds 2 breathe a lil bit & get perspective & just take lsats til ur bored of em & just enjoy ur life while u can
the basketball avi poster seemed like he had some cr comments but tbh they were tl;dr

shout out 2 ron mexico much love


This was extremely difficult to read.

But, I think it is semi-problematic to think this way. Almost the whole of TLS will recommend re-takes very quickly, but that doesn't necessarily mean one year "isn't shit." It's important to remember that you are giving up time. And, if you end up in biglaw, that one year could cost you 150k+ in addition to delaying your career. I'm of course not saying that waiting a year and re-taking (something that I am considering doing myself) isn't a very valid (even the most valid) option in many cases, but don't downplay the bad consequences in order to bolster the good.

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Clearly
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby Clearly » Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:15 pm

inlovewithpiper wrote:
ratfukr wrote:a top 5 consensus poster said u could use some help so i ran 2 the on-topics 2 post this
i'm new @ advice so inb4 "don't listen 2 ratfukr she is a vulgar rake w <1000 posts & doesn't even use commas so how would she kno about comma moving school"
anyway it seems 2 b the case that u can take the lsats a bunch & nobody cares but that's about the only useful info this hivemind can give u on this topic
the important point is that there is so much fuckin striver neurosis here and u cannot let it eat u alive. ur goal of minimal debt is commendable and a year isn't shit
in 1 year some posters on this board will b 1 year closer 2 rotting away in a golden cage servicing sticker debt doing a job they hate if they're lucky
u will b pretty much in the same exact place as b4 & maybe u'll have a few more lsat points under ur belt & u will have had a year 2 think about life/work
just take like 5 seconds 2 breathe a lil bit & get perspective & just take lsats til ur bored of em & just enjoy ur life while u can
the basketball avi poster seemed like he had some cr comments but tbh they were tl;dr

shout out 2 ron mexico much love


This was extremely difficult to read.

But, I think it is semi-problematic to think this way. Almost the whole of TLS will recommend re-takes very quickly, but that doesn't necessarily mean one year "isn't shit." It's important to remember that you are giving up time. And, if you end up in biglaw, that one year could cost you 150k+ in addition to delaying your career. I'm of course not saying that waiting a year and re-taking (something that I am considering doing myself) isn't a very valid (even the most valid) option in many cases, but don't downplay the bad consequences in order to bolster the good.

This is a distortion as well, the average biglaw career is only a handful of years, and you'd still have all those years whether you start now or next year.

rebexness
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby rebexness » Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:58 pm

inlovewithpiper wrote:
But, I think it is semi-problematic to think this way. Almost the whole of TLS will recommend re-takes very quickly, but that doesn't necessarily mean one year "isn't shit." It's important to remember that you are giving up time. And, if you end up in biglaw, that one year could cost you 150k+ in addition to delaying your career. I'm of course not saying that waiting a year and re-taking (something that I am considering doing myself) isn't a very valid (even the most valid) option in many cases, but don't downplay the bad consequences in order to bolster the good.


Except it is very unlikely that you will have $160k of big law monies to worry about unless you retake.

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cron1834
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby cron1834 » Fri Jan 03, 2014 2:10 pm

rebexness wrote:
inlovewithpiper wrote:
But, I think it is semi-problematic to think this way. Almost the whole of TLS will recommend re-takes very quickly, but that doesn't necessarily mean one year "isn't shit." It's important to remember that you are giving up time. And, if you end up in biglaw, that one year could cost you 150k+ in addition to delaying your career. I'm of course not saying that waiting a year and re-taking (something that I am considering doing myself) isn't a very valid (even the most valid) option in many cases, but don't downplay the bad consequences in order to bolster the good.


Except it is very unlikely that you will have $160k of big law monies to worry about unless you retake.


No doubt. More likely, the opportunity cost of sitting out a year is a 50/50 shot at a $50k job. You can beat that expected value ($25k) with a cubicle job while studying nights & weekends.

NYstate
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby NYstate » Fri Jan 03, 2014 2:19 pm

inlovewithpiper wrote:
ratfukr wrote:a top 5 consensus poster said u could use some help so i ran 2 the on-topics 2 post this
i'm new @ advice so inb4 "don't listen 2 ratfukr she is a vulgar rake w <1000 posts & doesn't even use commas so how would she kno about comma moving school"
anyway it seems 2 b the case that u can take the lsats a bunch & nobody cares but that's about the only useful info this hivemind can give u on this topic
the important point is that there is so much fuckin striver neurosis here and u cannot let it eat u alive. ur goal of minimal debt is commendable and a year isn't shit
in 1 year some posters on this board will b 1 year closer 2 rotting away in a golden cage servicing sticker debt doing a job they hate if they're lucky
u will b pretty much in the same exact place as b4 & maybe u'll have a few more lsat points under ur belt & u will have had a year 2 think about life/work
just take like 5 seconds 2 breathe a lil bit & get perspective & just take lsats til ur bored of em & just enjoy ur life while u can
the basketball avi poster seemed like he had some cr comments but tbh they were tl;dr

shout out 2 ron mexico much love


This was extremely difficult to read.

But, I think it is semi-problematic to think this way. Almost the whole of TLS will recommend re-takes very quickly, but that doesn't necessarily mean one year "isn't shit." It's important to remember that you are giving up time. And, if you end up in biglaw, that one year could cost you 150k+ in addition to delaying your career. I'm of course not saying that waiting a year and re-taking (something that I am considering doing myself) isn't a very valid (even the most valid) option in many cases, but don't downplay the bad consequences in order to bolster the good.


I can't think of a single bad consequence of waiting a year and retaking. You aren't delaying your career, you are trying to begin your career in the best possible circumstances. No one can count on getting biglaw, but if you don't get into a school where a significant number of people have a shot at big law, you shouldn't even think of biglaw as a possibility. Maybe if you somehow end up at that top of your class you might have have a shot at biglaw, but I wouldn't count on it.

Bottom line: retake until you can get into a solid school for your goals or don't go to law school. The employment market is too tough to do otherwise. Not going is always an option, and it the option that at least half of admitted students should take because they will never practice law.

OP: you need to learn to protect your mental health. Lots of stuff will come up in law - it is incredibly stressful. You can't let doing worse than you expected on the LSAT get you too depressed. Yes it is disappointing, but it is in no way the end of the world. Do what you need to do, put things in perspective and learn to be flexible and adapt. As I said, another year will only benefit you in the long run.

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ManoftheHour
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby ManoftheHour » Fri Jan 03, 2014 2:24 pm

Hoping4Happiness wrote:
Amity wrote:Never saw your GPA...what is it? I have a T-14 friend with a 163 who was accepted to a T-14 (but she also had a killer GPA).
Maybe I am wrong but I thought schools accepted the highest LSAT score. Right?


It's a bit above a 3.7


Dude, you have even more to gain than I do. Medians are falling like crazy right now. Just retake until you can't anymore. A high LSAT score is a rarer commodity right now. Penn's median LSAT just DROPPED to 169! Top schools are scrambling like crazy to preserve their medians.

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finnandjake2
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Re: Never been so depressed in my life-

Postby finnandjake2 » Fri Jan 03, 2014 2:36 pm

I waited two years and hit my target score on my third try. I was also a splitter so you have even more to gain with that GPA. Anecdotal evidence is what it is, but know that it is possible and there are success stories and well as tales of woe abound on these forums.




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