Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

(Applications Advice, Letters of Recommendation . . . )

Mention my "accidental expulsion"?

Yes
1
25%
No
2
50%
Give up all hope
1
25%
 
Total votes: 4

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nooooo
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Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby nooooo » Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:34 pm

I would imagine the title of the thread is enough to have most admissions officers immediately use my application as the lining for their bird cage, but I thought I would plead my case and see what the good people of TLS think about my predicament. I'll try to be as brief as possible.

* Scroll down for tl;dr*

During my first 1-2 years of UG, my grades were not stellar. B's and C's mostly, but a flurry of DR (dropped) classes. I worked full time since I was 16, and my mother was getting sick (she's been recently diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, the culprit for the earlier illnesses) and I didn't spend the proper amount of time to excel. So, when I finally enrolled into my major my GPA hovered somewhere around a 3.3. Then I went to the registrars office to intend my major...

I was informed by the registrar that I was expelled/withdrawn due to my low GPA. I was not sure of the situation until I went to the student portal and saw my GPA was now near a 1.4. I looked over my transcript and saw that every one of my DR grades were converted to F's. The school (at the time) was switching over from one type of software to another, and that it was (as they tell me now) the reason for what happened. I also, later found out that other students were in similar predicaments, but mine was much more dire due to my large amount of DR's.

I went to the registrar to argue that I had, in fact, dropped before the deadlines, and that I even had transactions from the school showing the refund for the courses they now said I failed. They didn't budge that it was an error on their part. The only course of action I had was to prove that I had dropped in time by getting a letter from the professor stating that I wasn't there. Essentially, proving a negative (LSAT question in the making). They would not help me with contacting/finding the professors that were no longer teaching (or were visiting) at my UG and basically told me to "figure it out."

I quickly enrolled into a local Community College so I wouldn't waste a year without schooling. I did manage to find two (out of five) professors, and they both looked at me quizzically when abiding to my request. Especially since they both had no idea who I was (I dropped their classes after going only once). These two were enough to bring me back into the school, and the expulsion is no longer on my transcript, but the F's from the other DR's are. My current UG GPA now stands at a 2.85.

I have all of the paperwork submitted from this, and every time I think about the addendum I might have to write, I always feel as if it will come off really "whiny" or overly "empathetic". I always get *eye rolls* when I say that I was "accidentally expelled", but I understand completely.

I know I should have pursued it further, perhaps talked to the Dean at the time. I was overwrought with the stress of my situation and I was just happy to get back into UG. Not an excuse, just explaining why I made the decision that I did at the time.

If it's any consolation (I know it's not, but it helps me sleep at night), my M.A. GPA is 3.85.

*********
My Question: Because my transcript no longer mentions any sort of expulsion, should I mention it or not? It won't give me the avenue to explain my GPA, but going down that path is long-winded and (to an extent) hard to believe. Any advice will also be appreciated.
*********

tl:dr - Computer error at UG turned several of my Dropped classes into F's which lead to my expulsion until I was able to provide evidence from teachers that I was not in the class and they repealed the classes. They let me back in and any mention of my expulsion was removed from my transcript. but not the F's from professors I couldn't hunt down.

tl;dr the tl;dr - Glitch in UG software expelled my by accident. Ruined my GPA, but doesn't say I'm expelled anymore wooooo.

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MoMettaMonk
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby MoMettaMonk » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:31 pm

You say that they've admitted that it was a mistake on their part that happened to multiple people. If that's the case I would make an attempt to go back and get those F's removed now. I see no reason for your admission chances to suffer for something that was not your fault in any way especially if you still have the paperwork from the school saying that you dropped. If you have to, raise some hell.

If that fails for whatever reason and you do decide to write an addendum, make sure that it's short, to the point, but that it does carefully describe exactly what happened. I'm sure that you'll get some questions from people in admissions about it if they do consider admitting you.

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nooooo
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby nooooo » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:41 pm

MoMettaMonk wrote:You say that they've admitted that it was a mistake on their part that happened to multiple people. If that's the case I would make an attempt to go back and get those F's removed now. I see no reason for your admission chances to suffer for something that was not your fault in any way especially if you still have the paperwork from the school saying that you dropped. If you have to, raise some hell.

If that fails for whatever reason and you do decide to write an addendum, make sure that it's short, to the point, but that it does carefully describe exactly what happened. I'm sure that you'll get some questions from people in admissions about it if they do consider admitting you.


I went a few days actually, to no avail (took my Oct. LSAT there and decided to stop by and ask). They told me that while they understand that they were most likely at fault, what's to say that some of the F's weren't previous "DR's" and actually earned, so to say. I never received an F in a class, but they NEED a professor to vouch for every change.

So, you still recommend mentioning it? My transcript doesn't mention an expulsion anywhere.

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guano
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby guano » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:54 pm

Unless specifically asked, do not mention the default.
Do you think you can get a letter from the school explaining the software glitch and the fact that they presume an F over a DR?

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MoMettaMonk
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby MoMettaMonk » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:57 pm

guano wrote:Unless specifically asked, do not mention the default.
Do you think you can get a letter from the school explaining the software glitch and the fact that they presume an F over a DR?


The bolded is actually a great idea if you do decide to write an addendum (I would for my own personal sense of vindication, but I don't work in admissions so I can't vouch for if that's actually the best course of action). Having some sort of written proof that this happened with other courses on your transcript would help to lend credence to your story.

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guano
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby guano » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:05 pm

MoMettaMonk wrote:
guano wrote:Unless specifically asked, do not mention the default.
Do you think you can get a letter from the school explaining the software glitch and the fact that they presume an F over a DR?


The bolded is actually a great idea if you do decide to write an addendum (I would for my own personal sense of vindication, but I don't work in admissions so I can't vouch for if that's actually the best course of action). Having some sort of written proof that this happened with other courses on your transcript would help to lend credence to your story.

Realistically, most schools won't care. But if you're gonna have such a cockamamie story, having some proof is the difference between crazy/liar and unlucky / victim

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jordan15
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby jordan15 » Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:40 am

I would get a lawyer in this situation. Try to dig up as much proof of every date you registered and dropped each class as well as any proof of the drop deadlines. Try to contact every single person you can and try to get as much communication in email.

If you can, try to get in contact with any other student who had this problem.

Also you should contact LSAC. They probably won't offer to accept a letter of the computer error and expunge the grades themselves, but they might be able to refer you to a lawyer or someone else who can somehow assist you.

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Danger Zone
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby Danger Zone » Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:54 am

OUT THIS TTT

bp shinners
Posts: 3091
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby bp shinners » Wed Oct 09, 2013 11:13 am

jordan15 wrote:I would get a lawyer in this situation. Try to dig up as much proof of every date you registered and dropped each class as well as any proof of the drop deadlines. Try to contact every single person you can and try to get as much communication in email.

If you can, try to get in contact with any other student who had this problem.

Also you should contact LSAC. They probably won't offer to accept a letter of the computer error and expunge the grades themselves, but they might be able to refer you to a lawyer or someone else who can somehow assist you.


Yea, I'd definitely keep fighting. This isn't an, "I didn't realize my high school CC grades would count!" situation - you got screwed over. A few days would be a start if this happened to me - I'd be on a crusade to get this stuff changed. They're messing with the rest of your life.

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MoMettaMonk
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby MoMettaMonk » Wed Oct 09, 2013 11:18 am

Out of curiosity, do you know what your GPA would be if the Fs were changed to drops?

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DrStudMuffin
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby DrStudMuffin » Wed Oct 09, 2013 11:33 am

bp shinners wrote:
jordan15 wrote:I would get a lawyer in this situation. Try to dig up as much proof of every date you registered and dropped each class as well as any proof of the drop deadlines. Try to contact every single person you can and try to get as much communication in email.

If you can, try to get in contact with any other student who had this problem.

Also you should contact LSAC. They probably won't offer to accept a letter of the computer error and expunge the grades themselves, but they might be able to refer you to a lawyer or someone else who can somehow assist you.


Yea, I'd definitely keep fighting. This isn't an, "I didn't realize my high school CC grades would count!" situation - you got screwed over. A few days would be a start if this happened to me - I'd be on a crusade to get this stuff changed. They're messing with the rest of your life.



If the account you gave is accurate, and changing the grades would materially affect your GPA, and you actually want to go to law school, you should, as bp said, make this a crusade until it is settled. I would consult with a lawyer, gather all the evidence you can, and in the meantime look more actively for the missing professors.

Bullshit situations like these require you to be relentless.

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nooooo
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby nooooo » Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:23 pm

GPA would jump to 3.39.

Considering I'm looking to apply soon, I can only envision a drawn out process for this. If I can't get the school to fess up, or even write a letter, would anyone recommended to still write the addendum or simply skip the issue all together?

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guano
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby guano » Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:35 pm

DrStudMuffin wrote:
bp shinners wrote:
jordan15 wrote:I would get a lawyer in this situation. Try to dig up as much proof of every date you registered and dropped each class as well as any proof of the drop deadlines. Try to contact every single person you can and try to get as much communication in email.

If you can, try to get in contact with any other student who had this problem.

Also you should contact LSAC. They probably won't offer to accept a letter of the computer error and expunge the grades themselves, but they might be able to refer you to a lawyer or someone else who can somehow assist you.


Yea, I'd definitely keep fighting. This isn't an, "I didn't realize my high school CC grades would count!" situation - you got screwed over. A few days would be a start if this happened to me - I'd be on a crusade to get this stuff changed. They're messing with the rest of your life.



If the account you gave is accurate, and changing the grades would materially affect your GPA, and you actually want to go to law school, you should, as bp said, make this a crusade until it is settled. I would consult with a lawyer, gather all the evidence you can, and in the meantime look more actively for the missing professors.

Bullshit situations like these require you to be relentless.

If you want to be a lawyer, you should be this relentless. Will you give up fighting fir your client just because the other side says no?

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midwest17
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby midwest17 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:00 pm

nooooo wrote:GPA would jump to 3.39.

Considering I'm looking to apply soon, I can only envision a drawn out process for this. If I can't get the school to fess up, or even write a letter, would anyone recommended to still write the addendum or simply skip the issue all together?


This seems like it's definitely worth delaying an application by a year, if that's what it takes. I don't know what kind of LSAT you're looking at, but here are the numbers for a 169 with your current GPA:

--ImageRemoved--

And the higher GPA:

--ImageRemoved--

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jordan15
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby jordan15 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:35 pm

nooooo wrote:GPA would jump to 3.39.

Considering I'm looking to apply soon, I can only envision a drawn out process for this. If I can't get the school to fess up, or even write a letter, would anyone recommended to still write the addendum or simply skip the issue all together?


This is a HUGE DEAL. Unless your dream school is some regional school that you have ties to and have to go to for family reasons AND you get a full scholarship this cycle, you should absolutely fight this even if it means waiting a year to apply.

It would also give you more time to study and take the LSAT (and retake if you got anything less than a 175). A 3.39 + an LSAT score 5+ points higher than what you currently have will open so many more doors than a 2.85 with whatever LSAT you currently have.

This situation was 100% not your fault and you should not just go along with it.

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jordan15
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby jordan15 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:39 pm

guano wrote:
DrStudMuffin wrote:
bp shinners wrote:
jordan15 wrote:I would get a lawyer in this situation. Try to dig up as much proof of every date you registered and dropped each class as well as any proof of the drop deadlines. Try to contact every single person you can and try to get as much communication in email.

If you can, try to get in contact with any other student who had this problem.

Also you should contact LSAC. They probably won't offer to accept a letter of the computer error and expunge the grades themselves, but they might be able to refer you to a lawyer or someone else who can somehow assist you.


Yea, I'd definitely keep fighting. This isn't an, "I didn't realize my high school CC grades would count!" situation - you got screwed over. A few days would be a start if this happened to me - I'd be on a crusade to get this stuff changed. They're messing with the rest of your life.



If the account you gave is accurate, and changing the grades would materially affect your GPA, and you actually want to go to law school, you should, as bp said, make this a crusade until it is settled. I would consult with a lawyer, gather all the evidence you can, and in the meantime look more actively for the missing professors.

Bullshit situations like these require you to be relentless.

If you want to be a lawyer, you should be this relentless. Will you give up fighting fir your client just because the other side says no?


Agreed. Actually now that I think of it, if OP is able to successfully fight this, the journey could make a very convincing PS.

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Happy Gilmore
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby Happy Gilmore » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:30 pm

I don't understand why that school has not been burned down yet. Raise some hell bro.

johngreen
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Re: Odd Circumstances: Glitches, Expulsions, and GPAs

Postby johngreen » Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:38 am

nooooo wrote:I would imagine the title of the thread is enough to have most admissions officers immediately use my application as the lining for their bird cage, but I thought I would plead my case and see what the good people of TLS think about my predicament. I'll try to be as brief as possible.

* Scroll down for tl;dr*

During my first 1-2 years of UG, my grades were not stellar. B's and C's mostly, but a flurry of DR (dropped) classes. I worked full time since I was 16, and my mother was getting sick (she's been recently diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, the culprit for the earlier illnesses) and I didn't spend the proper amount of time to excel. So, when I finally enrolled into my major my GPA hovered somewhere around a 3.3. Then I went to the registrars office to intend my major...

I was informed by the registrar that I was expelled/withdrawn due to my low GPA. I was not sure of the situation until I went to the student portal and saw my GPA was now near a 1.4. I looked over my transcript and saw that every one of my DR grades were converted to F's. The school (at the time) was switching over from one type of software to another, and that it was (as they tell me now) the reason for what happened. I also, later found out that other students were in similar predicaments, but mine was much more dire due to my large amount of DR's.

I went to the registrar to argue that I had, in fact, dropped before the deadlines, and that I even had transactions from the school showing the refund for the courses they now said I failed. They didn't budge that it was an error on their part. The only course of action I had was to prove that I had dropped in time by getting a letter from the professor stating that I wasn't there. Essentially, proving a negative (LSAT question in the making). They would not help me with contacting/finding the professors that were no longer teaching (or were visiting) at my UG and basically told me to "figure it out."

I quickly enrolled into a local Community College so I wouldn't waste a year without schooling. I did manage to find two (out of five) professors, and they both looked at me quizzically when abiding to my request. Especially since they both had no idea who I was (I dropped their classes after going only once). These two were enough to bring me back into the school, and the expulsion is no longer on my transcript, but the F's from the other DR's are. My current UG GPA now stands at a 2.85.

I have all of the paperwork submitted from this, and every time I think about the addendum I might have to write, I always feel as if it will come off really "whiny" or overly "empathetic". I always get *eye rolls* when I say that I was "accidentally expelled", but I understand completely.

I know I should have pursued it further, perhaps talked to the Dean at the time. I was overwrought with the stress of my situation and I was just happy to get back into UG. Not an excuse, just explaining why I made the decision that I did at the time.

If it's any consolation (I know it's not, but it helps me sleep at night), my M.A. GPA is 3.85.

*********
My Question: Because my transcript no longer mentions any sort of expulsion, should I mention it or not? It won't give me the avenue to explain my GPA, but going down that path is long-winded and (to an extent) hard to believe. Any advice will also be appreciated.
*********

tl:dr - Computer error at UG turned several of my Dropped classes into F's which lead to my expulsion until I was able to provide evidence from teachers that I was not in the class and they repealed the classes. They let me back in and any mention of my expulsion was removed from my transcript. but not the F's from professors I couldn't hunt down.

tl;dr the tl;dr - Glitch in UG software expelled my by accident. Ruined my GPA, but doesn't say I'm expelled anymore wooooo.


tl:dr if the expulsion was removed from your transcript for the reason that it was deemed accidental then you should not report it.




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