C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

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zman
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby zman » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:03 pm

I do think that loyola and pepperdine need to load up because they will probably have record transfers out of their program :D . Davis took the biggest hit of all california law schools unless you count thomas jefferson a law school.

Lord Randolph McDuff
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:03 pm

Dmini7 wrote:I think this is Loyola law schools new median LSAT at gpa.
LSAT=160
GPA=3.5
enrollment (340 in day 60 in evening)

http://www.lls.edu/aboutus/overview/facts/enrollment/

I could be wrong, but this is last years info which clearly uses different numbers.

--LinkRemoved--

So a drop of 1 LSAT point, .04 GPA and gain of 20 students overall if this information is right. The drop is not as bad as Pepperdines, but still is questionable to be increasing class sizes at this time.


I don't think these schools are trying to increase class size. They extend a bunch of offers and then wait. Looks like some schools (Cali schools, UF, CU, etc) thought the cycle was going to be even tougher than it was and extended too many offers.

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AT9
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby AT9 » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:15 pm

I really hope some of the Florida schools take big hits. Way too many "law schools" here.

Oh, interesting point: UF is now the only law school in the (4th most populous) state to have an LSAT median in the 160's, and it's barely hanging on AT 160.

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Vincent
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby Vincent » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:25 pm

Didn't Hastings cut their class size by 20% in 2012? Doesn't this class size increase mean that they're actually still far below historical student body size?

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jump_man
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby jump_man » Wed Sep 11, 2013 10:45 pm

Vincent wrote:Didn't Hastings cut their class size by 20% in 2012? Doesn't this class size increase mean that they're actually still far below historical student body size?


Yeah, Hastings went from ~440 entering students for the class of 2014 to ~317 for the class of 2015. I don't know too much about the school's current financial situation, but I think that the school needs to maintain enrollment at 330 or so to pay for operating expenses. There were also a TON of 1Ls that transferred out this year.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure there is much the school can do. They are trying to bring in more revenue by recruiting Masters Degree students, but these students definitely aren't coming in droves. Last I heard, Hastings only gets 5% of its operating expenses from state appropriations -- the rest comes from private fundraising. Tuition went up $3000 this year and it is scheduled to go up another $3000 next year.

In terms of pure market economics, the 330 students that signed up for the class of 2016 show that there is clearly a demand for schools like Hastings. I just hope they all have low expectations for getting top jobs.

BigZuck
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby BigZuck » Wed Sep 11, 2013 11:08 pm

jump_man wrote:Yeah, Hastings went from ~440 entering students for the class of 2014 to ~317 for the class of 2015. I don't know too much about the school's current financial situation, but I think that the school needs to maintain enrollment at 330 or so to pay for operating expenses. There were also a TON of 1Ls that transferred out this year.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure there is much the school can do. They are trying to bring in more revenue by recruiting Masters Degree students, but these students definitely aren't coming in droves. Last I heard, Hastings only gets 5% of its operating expenses from state appropriations -- the rest comes from private fundraising. Tuition went up $3000 this year and it is scheduled to go up another $3000 next year.

In terms of pure market economics, the 330 students that signed up for the class of 2016 show that there is clearly a demand for schools like Hastings. I just hope they all have low expectations for getting top jobs.


Or any jobs AMIRITE?

A part of me wants to feel bad for Hastings students. As a northern Californian I know the prestige it carries up there. But the school is clearly a sinking ship and a modicum of research would show that it's almost never a good option for anyone. If the school continues to sink I'm eventually going to stop feeling bad for people who sign on.

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Dr. Dre
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby Dr. Dre » Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:04 am

does any 1 know what UC Irvine's medians are yettt?

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jump_man
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby jump_man » Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:02 am

Dr. Dre wrote:does any 1 know what UC Irvine's medians are yettt?


This link doesn't have medians, but looking at their 25/75, the numbers are comparable to previous years.

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Dr. Dre
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby Dr. Dre » Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:10 am

jump_man wrote:
Dr. Dre wrote:does any 1 know what UC Irvine's medians are yettt?


This link doesn't have medians, but looking at their 25/75, the numbers are comparable to previous years.


No they are not. Their numbers are dropping. They can't go back to their prestigious first incoming class numbers.

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Dr. Dre
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby Dr. Dre » Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:05 am


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jingosaur
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby jingosaur » Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:31 am

We still need to wait for more relevant UCI employment statistics to come out, but it looks like UCI is now the 5th best law school in California. It's still nowhere near UCLA or USC and risks going the way of UC Hastings if students start coming out unemployed in droves, but it's scary how bad the California legal market has gotten. Even when California state gov jobs start coming back, it won't get any better because the debt that the average California law student will have won't be able to get services on a state gov't salary. It's really sad.

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altoid99
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby altoid99 » Thu Sep 12, 2013 1:53 pm

166, 3.71 for GW?? Can someone verify this?

SPerez
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby SPerez » Thu Sep 12, 2013 1:55 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:
ImNoScar wrote:
sinfiery wrote:There is zero incentive to lower tuition but some incentive to give out additional "financial aid".


I agree. There will always be students that are not cost sensitive because they do no research whatsoever.


To the notion of lowering your tuition $10. It would actually make more sense from a good PR perspective just to freeze it, no?


A LOT of different things get added together to equal the bottom line tuition & fees number at a public school. A change that small suggests to me that it is the result of fees increasing/combining/being eliminated/etc., and not any affirmative steps taken by the law school.

For example, at Texas Tech there is university tuition (which we don't control), law school tuition (which we propose, but must be approved by our Board of Regents), and non-resident tuition (which we don't control) for those who pay it. On the fees side, the majority of them (LinkRemoved) are set by the main campus, not the law school.

I read this quickly over lunch so not sure if this was already mentioned, but Univ. of Arizona Law did lower law school tuition this year.

Arizona cuts law school tuition, marking a first

By Karen Sloan

Read more: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNLJ.jsp?id=1202594883355&Arizona_cuts_law_school_tuition_marking_a_first#ixzz2ehaymsi6

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MikeSpivey
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby MikeSpivey » Thu Sep 12, 2013 3:38 pm

I see two schools in the top 25 that lowered tuition, fyi, Stanford and Berkeley. I am going to post the data from the top 25 on my blog when I can figure out how to import from excel or use grids.

Apologies for not having more schools I am pretty pressed for time and to get the tuition for this year I had to go to each webpage individually.

Speaking of --does anyone know if that supper application spreadsheet is still floating around and/or updated?

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cannibal ox
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby cannibal ox » Thu Sep 12, 2013 3:46 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:Speaking of --does anyone know if that supper application spreadsheet is still floating around and/or updated?


I believe you're talking about the spreadsheet in this topic:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=188687

And unfortunately it does not appear to be updated with information for the current application cycle.

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JCougar
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby JCougar » Thu Sep 12, 2013 3:53 pm

altoid99 wrote:166, 3.71 for GW?? Can someone verify this?


This would surprise me, because they admitted a handful of 165 LSAT splitters this year (including two accepted off the waitlist at the last minute), according to LSN. LSN isn't perfectly reliable, but I wouldn't be shocked to see a 2-point median drop.

KoolGJ
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby KoolGJ » Thu Sep 12, 2013 6:14 pm

South Carolina 155 (- 2), 3.27(-.05), 208 (-5), :(

hiltopp01
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby hiltopp01 » Fri Sep 13, 2013 12:11 am

.

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hephaestus
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby hephaestus » Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:24 am

KoolGJ wrote:South Carolina 155 (- 2), 3.27(-.05), 208 (-5), :(

I suppose this isn't surprising given their placement. But you think the only reputable school in SC could maintain better.

optimist1
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby optimist1 » Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:29 am

is 172 considered good now? is that competitive enough for a T14? i am not talking harvard, but #6 to 14.

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ScottRiqui
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby ScottRiqui » Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:34 am

optimist1 wrote:is 172 considered good now? is that competitive enough for a T14? i am not talking harvard, but #6 to 14.


Yes, a 172 is a great score, and always has been. It's at/above the median LSAT for every law school except Yale and Harvard. And that's not saying that you're locked out of Yale and/or Harvard, either; by definition, half of their students have below-median LSAT scores.

optimist1
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby optimist1 » Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:40 am

ScottRiqui wrote:
optimist1 wrote:is 172 considered good now? is that competitive enough for a T14? i am not talking harvard, but #6 to 14.


Yes, a 172 is a great score, and always has been. It's at/above the median LSAT for every law school except Yale and Harvard. And that's not saying that you're locked out of Yale and/or Harvard, either; by definition, half of their students have below-median LSAT scores.


my gpa is really bad tho 3.02

:(

if i had a 180 and 3.02 would i have had any better chance or no? just curious.

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Nova
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby Nova » Fri Sep 13, 2013 10:02 am

Optimist,

Lawschoolnumbers.com

Mylsn.info

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Nova
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby Nova » Fri Sep 13, 2013 10:03 am

Also... 172 is like the 99th percentile. Come on. Of course its a good score.

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manofjustice
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Re: C/O 2016 median lsat/gpa/class size

Postby manofjustice » Fri Sep 13, 2013 12:32 pm

Do we have a google doc to track new medians?




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