Quitting work before law school

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shinobi99
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Quitting work before law school

Postby shinobi99 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:22 am

Currently I have been accepted to several law schools, but also have some concerns because I just started working for a company couple months ago. If I leave for law school this fall, I would have worked there less than a year and was wondering if that would be bad/make me a douche. I feel that the company put in quite a bit of effort to recruit me, so I feel a little bad about leaving before the company can get its full return of investment. Also, because I want to go into IP law, I was wondering whether leaving too early would somehow jeopardize my future career in IP law since the company that I work for is pretty big in the software industry.

With that said, I was wondering whether I'm overanalyzing things and blowing things out of proportion (I tend to imagine things that won't happen). Since I have an at-will employment agreement, I can legally leave at any time and be fired at any time as well. Also, I know that if I do decide to go to school this fall, I will work my ass off so they can at least get a year's worth of work out of me. I know deferring a year is also an option but I want to just focus on the consequences of leaving this year because I would prefer to go to school this year if the consequences are not that severe. It would be great if you guys could give me some advice. Thanks!

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Bronck
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby Bronck » Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:33 am

Bro, it's an at-will employment K. You're overthinking this. Assuming you have legit law school options, don't feel guilty about quitting your job.

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Davidbentley
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby Davidbentley » Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:35 am

shinobi99 wrote:I'm overanalyzing things and blowing things out of proportion.Thanks!



You are welcome, friend.

PRgradBYU
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby PRgradBYU » Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:57 am

Thousands of future law schools students are going through the same situation. I wouldn't sweat it at all, especially given your at-will employment agreement.

akasabian
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby akasabian » Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:07 am

shinobi99 wrote:Currently I have been accepted to several law schools, but also have some concerns because I just started working for a company couple months ago. If I leave for law school this fall, I would have worked there less than a year and was wondering if that would be bad/make me a douche. I feel that the company put in quite a bit of effort to recruit me, so I feel a little bad about leaving before the company can get its full return of investment. Also, because I want to go into IP law, I was wondering whether leaving too early would somehow jeopardize my future career in IP law since the company that I work for is pretty big in the software industry.

With that said, I was wondering whether I'm overanalyzing things and blowing things out of proportion (I tend to imagine things that won't happen). Since I have an at-will employment agreement, I can legally leave at any time and be fired at any time as well. Also, I know that if I do decide to go to school this fall, I will work my ass off so they can at least get a year's worth of work out of me. I know deferring a year is also an option but I want to just focus on the consequences of leaving this year because I would prefer to go to school this year if the consequences are not that severe. It would be great if you guys could give me some advice. Thanks!


It's a business, they are in the game of making money. They shouldn't get butt hurt, people have high turnover at a younger age all the time. Don't feel hurt, they will survive, and you'll be better for starting now vs. later with law school.

shinobi99
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby shinobi99 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 3:38 am

Thanks everyone. I needed this :)

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rinkrat19
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby rinkrat19 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 3:46 am

All this is true.

That said, it might be the considerate and professional thing to do to give them more than your minimum (two weeks?) notice. Unless you think they're such jackasses that if you gave them advance warning, they'd fire you immediately. Only you can judge that.

I gave my bosses 18 months warning. :P

rebexness
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby rebexness » Wed Feb 20, 2013 3:48 am

Last edited by rebexness on Mon Feb 09, 2015 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mls
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby mls » Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:44 pm

I agree with the previous poster. Also, you should really let your bosses know ASAP in order to save your reputation. As a hiring manager, I can tell you I would be PISSED if I hired someone and then found out that during the whole hiring process they KNEW they would be leaving in September and didn't tell me. I'm not a vindictive person, but if anyone else in my industry asked me about the employee I would say I had a bad experience and not recommend hiring him/her. I completely understand that my employees want to pursue higher education and that's great and I encourage them, but I have to be in the loop. If your bosses are nice people, they will be frustrated that you lied by omission to them, but then they will ensure you make good on your promise to do a "year's worth of work" in the time that you're there and send you off to law school better prepared than you are now.

This is all assuming I read your post correctly and you had plans to go to law school while you were being recruited. If you were already a few months into the job when you decided to apply to law school, that's a little bit of a different story. But I stand by my recommendation to tell them sooner rather than later.

09042014
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby 09042014 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:53 pm

What law school?

For patent prosecution a bit of work experience might be beneficial.

Worst case, lie and claim you were going to do part time law school until the school gave you a scholarship.

cynthiad
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby cynthiad » Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:56 pm

mls wrote:I agree with the previous poster. Also, you should really let your bosses know ASAP in order to save your reputation. As a hiring manager, I can tell you I would be PISSED if I hired someone and then found out that during the whole hiring process they KNEW they would be leaving in September and didn't tell me. I'm not a vindictive person, but if anyone else in my industry asked me about the employee I would say I had a bad experience and not recommend hiring him/her. I completely understand that my employees want to pursue higher education and that's great and I encourage them, but I have to be in the loop. If your bosses are nice people, they will be frustrated that you lied by omission to them, but then they will ensure you make good on your promise to do a "year's worth of work" in the time that you're there and send you off to law school better prepared than you are now.

This is all assuming I read your post correctly and you had plans to go to law school while you were being recruited. If you were already a few months into the job when you decided to apply to law school, that's a little bit of a different story. But I stand by my recommendation to tell them sooner rather than later.


I think you're assuming that OP's manager is reasonable. What if they tell OP to leave right away? If other people at OP's work have given advance notice and been fine, then go for it, but otherwise don't give more than a month's notice.

09042014
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby 09042014 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:57 pm

cynthiad wrote:
mls wrote:I agree with the previous poster. Also, you should really let your bosses know ASAP in order to save your reputation. As a hiring manager, I can tell you I would be PISSED if I hired someone and then found out that during the whole hiring process they KNEW they would be leaving in September and didn't tell me. I'm not a vindictive person, but if anyone else in my industry asked me about the employee I would say I had a bad experience and not recommend hiring him/her. I completely understand that my employees want to pursue higher education and that's great and I encourage them, but I have to be in the loop. If your bosses are nice people, they will be frustrated that you lied by omission to them, but then they will ensure you make good on your promise to do a "year's worth of work" in the time that you're there and send you off to law school better prepared than you are now.

This is all assuming I read your post correctly and you had plans to go to law school while you were being recruited. If you were already a few months into the job when you decided to apply to law school, that's a little bit of a different story. But I stand by my recommendation to tell them sooner rather than later.


I think you're assuming that OP's manager is reasonable. What if they tell OP to leave right away? If other people at OP's work have given advance notice and been fine, then go for it, but otherwise don't give more than a month's notice.


Plenty of companies would tell you to pack your bags, or try to find a replacement and then fire you. It's the smart thing to do. People coast when they know they are leaving.

mls
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby mls » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:03 pm

Well, I'm more being optimistic that OP's managers are nice. Again, assuming OP was applying for law school and the job at the same time, I wouldn't have a lot of sympathy for him/her if s/he was fired. As a hiring manager, what makes a huge difference to me is whether someone is upfront. Is there a chance I would pass an applicant over in the first place because they have plans for graduate school? Yes. If they conveniently omitted that fact in order to get the job, I would feel I was lied to. So, if I were OP's boss I would rather OP come clean sooner rather than later to potentially save the professional relationship.

And, I just want to reiterate, that I DO understand that good employees leave. Some even leave to go to law school and there are no hard feelings. Obviously, I don't know the culture of the OP's workplace, or even all the facts. Just throwing my perspective out there.

09042014
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby 09042014 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:06 pm

mls wrote:Well, I'm more being optimistic that OP's managers are nice. Again, assuming OP was applying for law school and the job at the same time, I wouldn't have a lot of sympathy for him/her if s/he was fired. As a hiring manager, what makes a huge difference to me is whether someone is upfront. Is there a chance I would pass an applicant over in the first place because they have plans for graduate school? Yes. If they conveniently omitted that fact in order to get the job, I would feel I was lied to. So, if I were OP's boss I would rather OP come clean sooner rather than later to potentially save the professional relationship.

And, I just want to reiterate, that I DO understand that good employees leave. Some even leave to go to law school and there are no hard feelings. Obviously, I don't know the culture of the OP's workplace, or even all the facts. Just throwing my perspective out there.


Don't hate the player, hate the game. You can't pause your bills because you are going to law school in a year.

A company wouldn't think twice about laying someone off after 9 months.

mls
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby mls » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:14 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
mls wrote:Well, I'm more being optimistic that OP's managers are nice. Again, assuming OP was applying for law school and the job at the same time, I wouldn't have a lot of sympathy for him/her if s/he was fired. As a hiring manager, what makes a huge difference to me is whether someone is upfront. Is there a chance I would pass an applicant over in the first place because they have plans for graduate school? Yes. If they conveniently omitted that fact in order to get the job, I would feel I was lied to. So, if I were OP's boss I would rather OP come clean sooner rather than later to potentially save the professional relationship.

And, I just want to reiterate, that I DO understand that good employees leave. Some even leave to go to law school and there are no hard feelings. Obviously, I don't know the culture of the OP's workplace, or even all the facts. Just throwing my perspective out there.


Don't hate the player, hate the game. You can't pause your bills because you are going to law school in a year.

A company wouldn't think twice about laying someone off after 9 months.


I'm not totally sure what you're getting at here. But the way I see it, the OP has two choices: tell the boss nowish about leaving in August, or tell the boss in August about leaving in August. In the first scenario there's a chance the boss will be thankful to have the information and they can still build a good relationship. I just can't imagine things ending well in the second scenario. But, maybe at another company (particularly a larger one) management won't even care and just calls it the cost of doing business.

Now I want to hear from the OP about the timing of the LS applications/job application!

09042014
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby 09042014 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:18 pm

Employers don't give 9 months warning to lay offs. Hell, most give no advanced warning.

I wonder how state unemployment agencies would treat this. "Hey, boss, I'm leaving in 9 months." "Pack your shit, you are gone now." Does that count as quitting or getting laid off?

wannabelawstudent
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby wannabelawstudent » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:43 pm

Desert Fox wrote:Employers don't give 9 months warning to lay offs. Hell, most give no advanced warning.

I wonder how state unemployment agencies would treat this. "Hey, boss, I'm leaving in 9 months." "Pack your shit, you are gone now." Does that count as quitting or getting laid off?

That would count as being laid off. At least in my state.

shock259
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby shock259 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:07 pm

Don't feel bad. Companies can predict these costs. Also, your company would surely fire you in a heartbeat without feeling any regret.

nolabreeze
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby nolabreeze » Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:50 am

If I leave for law school I'm going to tell my mentor as soon as I make the final decision to go and then maybe my boss later (my boss doesn't know what I do 90% of the time anyway). I know my company is hurting for people so I'm almost sure they'll appreciate the heads up and hopefully give me time to train someone else to take my position.

But I've had time to feel out my company and coworkers. I've seen a lot of people leave the company, some with two weeks, and others without. The ones that just up and left definitely left a bad taste in everyone's mouth. The guys that gave two weeks notice are always fondly missed, haha.

op, don't feel bad about leaving though. i've struggled a lot with that feeling when i first started working, but once you've seen managers/people/coworkers come and go you realize that it's a company/business...and that's pretty much it. our manager also once told us they plan/budget for people leaving. they just hope it's not the good ones that are leaving.

shinobi99
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby shinobi99 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:55 am

Thanks everyone for the advice. I actually applied for my job a bit earlier (like a month) than law schools, but I definitely knew going into the job that I would later apply for law schools. I applied for my job mostly because I had no money but also because I wanted to see what it was like to work for the company since it had a big presence in the tech industry. Shortly after I got the job, I applied to law schools, first of all, unsure whether I would even get into my first choice, and second, thinking that deferring would be an option if necessary. I guess at that time I wanted to keep my options open because I didn't know how the future was going to unfold. I just wanted to explore both paths and make a decision later, depending on what hand I was dealt.

Fast forward to early 2013, after I was accepted into several schools and some time had passed, I started to rethink the option of deferring since that would mean I would work for an additional year and a half from now until fall of 2014. I feel that the half a year remaining until this August is a relatively long time as it is. I already have several years (3~4) of work experience after college (I had left my previous job to study for the LSAT, then had gotten my current job), so perhaps the additional year wouldn't be essential. I do know that my company lays off people when it is in their interest, so a part of me thinks that I should just be selfish and not worry so much about my company. Since it's a billion dollar company, I know I wouldn't dent their balance sheet even a little if I leave. However, another part of me feels guilty because it feels like I'm only looking out for my interest.

At this point, I'm still deliberating and haven't reached a conclusion on what to do. But after hearing from both sides of the argument, perhaps a notice longer than two weeks would be nice if I were to leave in August. Once again, I appreciate all of the inputs! Hopefully I will make the correct diplomatic move that will be in everyone's interest.

09042014
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby 09042014 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:58 am

shinobi99 wrote:Thanks everyone for the advice. I actually applied for my job a bit earlier (like a month) than law schools, but I definitely knew going into the job that I would later apply for law schools. I applied for my job mostly because I had no money but also because I wanted to see what it was like to work for the company since it had a big presence in the tech industry. Shortly after I got the job, I applied to law schools, first of all, unsure whether I would even get into my first choice, and second, thinking that deferring would be an option if necessary. I guess at that time I wanted to keep my options open because I didn't know how the future was going to unfold. I just wanted to explore both paths and make a decision later, depending on what hand I was dealt.

Fast forward to early 2013, after I was accepted into several schools and some time had passed, I started to rethink the option of deferring since that would mean I would work for an additional year and a half from now until fall of 2014. I feel that the half a year remaining until this August is a relatively long time as it is. I already have several years (3~4) of work experience after college (I had left my previous job to study for the LSAT, then had gotten my current job), so perhaps the additional year wouldn't be essential. I do know that my company lays off people when it is in their interest, so a part of me thinks that I should just be selfish and not worry so much about my company. Since it's a billion dollar company, I know I wouldn't dent their balance sheet even a little if I leave. However, another part of me feels guilty because it feels like I'm only looking out for my interest.

At this point, I'm still deliberating and haven't reached a conclusion on what to do. But after hearing from both sides of the argument, perhaps a notice longer than two weeks would be nice if I were to leave in August. Once again, I appreciate all of the inputs! Hopefully I will make the correct diplomatic move that will be in everyone's interest.


If you have other work experience, I wouldn't worry about it.

I hope you are going to a T14 or a good regional for free though. Anything else is absolutely not worth it.

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dr123
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby dr123 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:03 am

I can understand giving like 6 mo (or w/e) notice if you've been working there for a while, like a yr plus. But if you just started you're expendable as fuck.

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arkgawilson
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby arkgawilson » Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:32 am

mls wrote:I agree with the previous poster. Also, you should really let your bosses know ASAP in order to save your reputation. As a hiring manager, I can tell you I would be PISSED if I hired someone and then found out that during the whole hiring process they KNEW they would be leaving in September and didn't tell me. I'm not a vindictive person, but if anyone else in my industry asked me about the employee I would say I had a bad experience and not recommend hiring him/her. I completely understand that my employees want to pursue higher education and that's great and I encourage them, but I have to be in the loop. If your bosses are nice people, they will be frustrated that you lied by omission to them, but then they will ensure you make good on your promise to do a "year's worth of work" in the time that you're there and send you off to law school better prepared than you are now.

This is all assuming I read your post correctly and you had plans to go to law school while you were being recruited. If you were already a few months into the job when you decided to apply to law school, that's a little bit of a different story. But I stand by my recommendation to tell them sooner rather than later.



Upon being hired, was it an implicit or explicit expectation that you would be there X amount of time? I'm going through a similar thing in accepting a full-time consulting position with a quickly growing firm and am actually fearful that the pay might be decent enough to pay off my grad school loans and thus I will re-enter the workplace for a few years...Or will quit after a year to go to law school, having known in advance they wanted me to take on a management role and open my own office. At the end of the day, do what is best for you and your career. Only you can make that call, and I think you can have your cake and eat it too (of sorts) and not burn bridges in the process.

sparty99
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby sparty99 » Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:03 am

Don't listen to anyone that says you should provide more than two-weeks notice. You shouldn't. Business is business. You have to do what is best for yourself.

nmillette
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Re: Quitting work before law school

Postby nmillette » Fri Feb 22, 2013 10:06 am

Give them one months's notice! I was in your situation last year. I had applied and been accepted to Law School but did not go and I gave my boss like 1 year notice in advance.

I was treated like an outcast after that....they constantly said things like.." well she is leaving in a few months so she should not be a part of this or that..plus when they gave a firm wide salary increase I was excluded from it!

I was treated like a outcast for an entire year! plus they worked my ass off during that time. This time around at my current job, I am only giving 1 month's notice!

Lesson Learnt!




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