FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

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thethe
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby thethe » Sat Mar 23, 2013 4:24 pm

Isn't the general unemployment rate only 8-9%?

People who are 25-30 being 95% employed isn't really all that impressive. Any strapping young lad/laddette would be a great McDonalds employee. That may not be why they spend 3 years in law school.

When someone asks a law school what %age of students get jobs, saying the general percentage including non-legal jobs that pay much less seems like an unfair and deceptive business practice unless many of your students actually go to law school hoping it will give them a boost for McDonalds employment over just going to Hamburger University.

lawschoolgiant
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby lawschoolgiant » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:01 pm

I am here to answer questions about FIU COL if you are interested. I am a 3L evening student and I will be graduating this December.

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North
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby North » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:18 pm

lawschoolgiant wrote:I am here to answer questions about FIU COL if you are interested. I am a 3L evening student and I will be graduating this December.

Do you have a new job as a lawyer or are you continuing at your current job? Salary?

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FKASunny
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby FKASunny » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:39 pm

Not to white knight FIU too vigorously, but here's my take on the situation:

1) FIU is cheap for in state students. Dirt cheap. You can't really beat $18k/year full-time or $12k/year part time. While the wisdom of opening a new law school is dubious, especially in Florida, there is a very salient argument that could be made that FIU is providing a service to South Florida by being the first and only public law school in the region. It is leagues cheaper than Miami, Nova, and St. Thomas, and it has the potential to climb in reputation as a decent regional school.

2) Many students at FIU attend because they are from Miami, want to stay in Miami, and do not seek the same large firm jobs that kappycaft1 or Yukos are going to have coming out of T6 schools, so stop bashing FIU for not placing into biglaw. They've been around for about a decade, so their LST score report is actually pretty impressive.

3) If you have family or work obligations that require you to stay in South Florida, look at the alternatives. These students would have paid oodles more to attend the private schools in the region, and their employment prospects would be way worse.

4) FIU as an institution in general receives accolades for being a positive, supportive environment for Hispanic students, and from what I've seen, the law school is perpetuating this tradition.

There are many scenarios in which FIU could be a good, viable option for local, in state students who can't or don't want to leave home. It's not a T14 and never will be, but attacking FIU like it's some kind of profiteering TTT that only exists to suck money out of students is disingenuous. We have many of those schools in Florida, but FIU is not one of them.

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Crowing
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby Crowing » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:49 pm

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:Not to white knight FIU too vigorously, but here's my take on the situation:

1) FIU is cheap for in state students. Dirt cheap. You can't really beat $18k/year full-time or $12k/year part time. While the wisdom of opening a new law school is dubious, especially in Florida, there is a very salient argument that could be made that FIU is providing a service to South Florida by being the first and only public law school in the region. It is leagues cheaper than Miami, Nova, and St. Thomas, and it has the potential to climb in reputation as a decent regional school.

2) Many students at FIU attend because they are from Miami, want to stay in Miami, and do not seek the same large firm jobs that kappycaft1 or Yukos are going to have coming out of T6 schools, so stop bashing FIU for not placing into biglaw. They've been around for about a decade, so their LST score report is actually pretty impressive.

3) If you have family or work obligations that require you to stay in South Florida, look at the alternatives. These students would have paid oodles more to attend the private schools in the region, and their employment prospects would be way worse.

4) FIU as an institution in general receives accolades for being a positive, supportive environment for Hispanic students, and from what I've seen, the law school is perpetuating this tradition.

There are many scenarios in which FIU could be a good, viable option for local, in state students who can't or don't want to leave home. It's not a T14 and never will be, but attacking FIU like it's some kind of profiteering TTT that only exists to suck money out of students is disingenuous. We have many of those schools in Florida, but FIU is not one of them.


I mean I'll agree with you that FIU is better than most TTTs because of the lower tuition. But I think a good amount of the ridicule in this thread has also sprung from some of the nonsense responses the students have made (95% employed - really?)

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FKASunny
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby FKASunny » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:55 pm

Crowing wrote:
I mean I'll agree with you that FIU is better than most TTTs because of the lower tuition. But I think a good amount of the ridicule in this thread has also sprung from some of the nonsense responses the students have made (95% employed - really?)

That was probably the number when they were admitted, back before stricter reporting standards.

The consensus on TLS is that UF is top dog in Florida. Compare FIU to UF on LST and it's not that big of a difference. Actually, FIU has a substantially lower under-employment score. My main gripe with the tone of this thread thus far is that local schools should be gauged and evaluated by different standards than large, quasi-national schools. When three years at FIU cost you less than one year at a T14, you can accept lower biglaw and prestigious job numbers.

There are many scenarios on TLS where you can come in guns blazing, ready to save the unwashed masses from their inevitable debt peonage, but a thread discussing student life at FIU isn't one of them.

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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby 20141023 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:00 pm

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:You can't really beat $18k/year full-time or $12k/year part time.

ohrly? :lol:

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:3) If you have family or work obligations that require you to stay in South Florida, look at the alternatives. These students would have paid oodles more to attend the private schools in the region, and their employment prospects would be way worse.

Yes, but someone would be foolish if they said "I have to stay in South Florida and I also have to be a lawyer." If they truly want to stay in the area, there are many other ways to find desirable employment that don't cost an arm and a leg and that have better outcomes.

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:4) FIU as an institution in general receives accolades for being a positive, supportive environment for Hispanic students, and from what I've seen, the law school is perpetuating this tradition.

It would kind of be a waste for a potential URM to use that boost here...

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:There are many scenarios in which FIU could be a good, viable option for local, in state students who can't or don't want to leave home. It's not a T14 and never will be, but attacking FIU like it's some kind of profiteering TTT that only exists to suck money out of students is disingenuous. We have many of those schools in Florida, but FIU is not one of them.

They came on "Top Law Schools Dot Com" and said that they have 95% employment... and they were getting paid to do so.

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FKASunny
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby FKASunny » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:08 pm

kappycaft1 wrote:
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:You can't really beat $18k/year full-time or $12k/year part time.

ohrly? :lol:


Going to a school that doesn't let you drink, smoke, imbibe the sweet nectar of coffee, or have premarital sex is not a school that exists in my reality.

kappycaft1 wrote:
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:3) If you have family or work obligations that require you to stay in South Florida, look at the alternatives. These students would have paid oodles more to attend the private schools in the region, and their employment prospects would be way worse.

Yes, but someone would be foolish if they said "I have to stay in South Florida and I also have to be a lawyer." If they truly want to stay in the area, there are many other ways to find desirable employment that don't cost an arm and a leg and that have better outcomes.

Really? The job market for lawyers is rough, but the job market for almost everyone else is also rough. And again, with the right scholarship package, FIU does not cost an arm and a leg. 55% of the class getting long-term, JD required work probably means you can safely assume that you could command $35-40k/year starting. Keep your debt under that much, and it's not a terrible investment. If you don't live in Miami, you don't understand just how hard it is to find a job paying that much.

kappycaft1 wrote:
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:4) FIU as an institution in general receives accolades for being a positive, supportive environment for Hispanic students, and from what I've seen, the law school is perpetuating this tradition.

It would kind of be a waste for a potential URM to use that boost here...


You obviously have no idea how URM boosts work and/or the ethnic makeup of South Florida. Cubans, Dominicans, and Venezuelans make up humongous chunks of our community, and only Puerto Ricans and Mexicans are considered for URM boosts.

kappycaft1 wrote:
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:There are many scenarios in which FIU could be a good, viable option for local, in state students who can't or don't want to leave home. It's not a T14 and never will be, but attacking FIU like it's some kind of profiteering TTT that only exists to suck money out of students is disingenuous. We have many of those schools in Florida, but FIU is not one of them.

They came on "Top Law Schools Dot Com" and said that they have 95% employment... and they were getting paid to do so.

And you called them out for it and exposed their bias. That should have been enough.

lawschoolgiant
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby lawschoolgiant » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:11 pm

North wrote:
lawschoolgiant wrote:I am here to answer questions about FIU COL if you are interested. I am a 3L evening student and I will be graduating this December.

Do you have a new job as a lawyer or are you continuing at your current job? Salary?


I currently work as a law clerk at a firm with about 10 attorneys. I started there as a file clerk before law school. As a law clerk I currently make $20 per hour, but I started at $10 as a law clerk. I expect to be offered a position at around 60k per year. I love the firm and I expect to work 45-50 hours per week. Later this year I plan to look for more options until I have an offer in writing.

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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby 20141023 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:20 pm

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:
kappycaft1 wrote:
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:4) FIU as an institution in general receives accolades for being a positive, supportive environment for Hispanic students, and from what I've seen, the law school is perpetuating this tradition.

It would kind of be a waste for a potential URM to use that boost here...

You obviously have no idea how URM boosts work and/or the ethnic makeup of South Florida. Cubans, Dominicans, and Venezuelans make up humongous chunks of our community, and only Puerto Ricans and Mexicans are considered for URM boosts.

Sounds like you need a lesson in good ol' reading comp, Mr. ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)... I said "potential URM," because "Hispanic" is vague and includes PRs and Mexicans but also other types of "Hispanic." If someone is in fact a URM, it would be smart to use that boost to apply to a better school and try to work some scholarship out of them.

Also, you are pretty much only looking at monetary cost. While monetary cost is important, temporal cost is also important. 3 years is a decent chunk of time, and if you were to spend it for a 55% chance of a desirable outcome, you could be wasting a ton of opportunity cost.

Anyway, I will concede that FIU is probably better than some other options in the area, but you don't need to white knight what the paid students previously said in this thread. :P

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FKASunny
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby FKASunny » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:26 pm

kappycaft1 wrote:Anyway, I will concede that FIU is probably better than some other options in the area, but you don't need to white knight what the paid students previously said in this thread. :P

Actually, not much was said before this thread devolved into "LOL look at this shit school! They don't even place people into firms with more than 25 lawyers!"

For my personal situation, I agree, it's not worth the opportunity cost to go to FIU and only have a 55% shot at a full-time legal job. That's why I'll be attending a more "prestigious" school outside of the state because I'm going into a field that places so much emphasis on prestige. However, most of the students at FIU law I know will be much better off after having completed their degrees. That has not been my experience in talking to St. Thomas, Nova, or Miami grads.

And "HAHA RC FAIL" is a cop out. You know exactly what you were implying.

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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby 20141023 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:50 pm

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:And "HAHA RC FAIL" is a cop out. You know exactly what you were implying.

Actually, I originally just wrote "URM" but then realized before I submitted the comment that some Hispanics can also be non-URMs, so I went back and intentionally changed it to "potential URM." Hence the "HAHA RC FAIL."

But yeah, for some people this might be an option, but it isn't one that I would wish on anyone. (Since when is a 55% placement rate into decent employment "pretty impressive"? UCI law has only been around for a few years now and look at them; the "they're new so don't bash 'em" argument just doesn't work here.)

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JamesDean1955
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby JamesDean1955 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:24 pm

Well, normally I refrain myself from TTT bashing in legit threads where current students answer prospective student questions or prospective students discuss their applications and likes/dislikes of the school.

But seeing as this isn't a legit thread...

To the guy with funky characters in his name, you are a moron. In 1 out of 1,000 cases would FIU actually be a good choice to attend, FOR ANY REASON EVEN AT FULL SCHOLARSHIP. You have friends there who are doing fine? Oh really? Well as a former Florida resident, I can tell you that for every one of your FIU buddies that are supposedly doing fine, I can find 5 people from the school I know that aren't. The same can be said for just about every school in Florida b/c 95% of them are TTT's and I know at least one person at practically all of them.

$35,000.00-$40,000.00 in Miami is a good salary and it's hard to find jobs that pay that much? Are you a retard? I lived there and I can tell you that's 100% not true. If you majored in poetry, then I apologize, you're right.

As far as it being a positive environment for Hispanic students, what T30 school isn't? Are there any top law schools that wouldn't have supportive environments? Have you seen how many Hispanic organizations and groups are at these places? What a stupid argument.

If you want to work in FL, your best bet is to go to a top law school and have strong ties there and work your connections, not some FL TTT. I don't like to see naive 0L's coming onto this site and seeing people argue that schools like FIU are a good idea under any circumstance. If FIU is your only option, I'm here to tell you its not. Even with a sub-3.0 gpa, retake the damn lsat, do better and you will be able to get into a better school. If you absolutely have to go to a FL school, for God sakes, there are better options than FIU.

TL;DR: DO NOT GO TO FIU LAW.

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FKASunny
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby FKASunny » Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:37 pm

I was just pointing out that FIU is not some festering stinkhole of a school. But please, by all means, show off how much you know about the world by bashing the choices of others. There are schools out there that deserve this type of vitriol, especially the disingenuous ones that we won't name here. However, FIU is cheap, small (fewer than 200 students) and isn't just a cash cow for the university. It doesn't deserve the type of shitslinging that happens every time someone dares to utter FIU on this forum.

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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby philosoraptor » Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:50 pm

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:I was just pointing out that FIU is not some festering stinkhole of a school. But please, by all means, show off how much you know about the world by bashing the choices of others. There are schools out there that deserve this type of vitriol, especially the disingenuous ones that we won't name here. However, FIU is cheap, small (fewer than 200 students) and isn't just a cash cow for the university. It doesn't deserve the type of shitslinging that happens every time someone dares to utter FIU on this forum.
Um, it's true that a school with relatively low tuition doesn't deserve as much vitriol as some others do, but this is the main thing that should matter to prospective students: http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=fiu

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JamesDean1955
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby JamesDean1955 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:02 pm

How is FIU not disingenuous? How does having low tuition somehow make their devious employment claims any better?

FIULaw_Admissions wrote:95% of graduates are employed within 9 months of graduation. Also, the career center at FIU is very helpful with finding jobs for current law students and graduates.


This entire thread was started with disingenuous claims by purported FIU students. They came on top-law-schools.com to do so. Any FIU student or Dean at any such TTT deserves exactly what people have been dosing out ITT. Hell, there should be even higher penalties, but hey, free market baby. As long as they can find suckers willing to buy their services and no one declares it illegal, go for it. In lieu of passing legislation to put these amoral Deans in jail, I'm trying to make sure we (the TLS community) are not convincing new 0L's to buy into said services. I really don't see why anyone is defending them. If you want to talk regional schools with low tuition that may be a good option for some, I'm sure there are far more deserving examples (UGA maybe? Idk).

Oh, and I'm one of the more optimistic people on TLS (and get into fights on here regarding the job market outlook, etc.), fwiw. But this one is a no-brainer.

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Yukos
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby Yukos » Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:03 pm

The guy with the unpronounceable name brings up some good points, and $18,000 is a pretty reasonable tuition. But paying off $150,000 of debt on the salary of a six-person law firm -- assuming you're lucky enough to get a job at all -- doesn't seem like it would lead to a pleasant existence. FIU isn't Cooley, but it ain't LSU either.

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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby BigZuck » Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:16 pm

A coin flips chance at employment really sucks. Even if its totally free there is still close to a 50 percent chance that you will have wasted 3 years and have nothing to show for it. In fact you might be worse off because that JD might preclude you from getting some non-legal jobs.

And I wouldn't exactly call 18K tuition "cheap." Still gotta eat and pay rent. Comparatively it may be cheaper than some other places but you're still betting a ton of money on a coin flip. I will be attending a truly solid regional for about 12K a year tuition and no COL costs and I am still a bit uneasy about this whole venture because there's a 25% chance I will not become a lawyer after spending all that time and money. This school is way worse than that and the idea of attending should give any rational person pause.

Just because this school isn't as festering as other festering TTTs doesn't mean it's not still festering at its core.

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FKASunny
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby FKASunny » Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:32 pm

Yukos wrote:The guy with the unpronounceable name brings up some good points, and $18,000 is a pretty reasonable tuition. But paying off $150,000 of debt on the salary of a six-person law firm -- assuming you're lucky enough to get a job at all -- doesn't seem like it would lead to a pleasant existence. FIU isn't Cooley, but it ain't LSU either.

Y U NO PRONOUNCE MY NAME

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Yukos
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby Yukos » Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:21 pm

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

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JamesDean1955
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby JamesDean1955 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:35 pm

Yeah what do the symbols in your name mean - break it down for us phonetically will ya.

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North
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby North » Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:27 pm

JamesDean1955 wrote:Yeah what do the symbols in your name mean - break it down for us phonetically will ya.

If you look at it, it kind of looks like a monster with its hands up. I thought it was something in Arabic for a while.

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Ruxin1
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby Ruxin1 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:31 pm

BigZuck wrote:A coin flips chance at employment really sucks. Even if its totally free there is still close to a 50 percent chance that you will have wasted 3 years and have nothing to show for it. In fact you might be worse off because that JD might preclude you from getting some non-legal jobs.

And I wouldn't exactly call 18K tuition "cheap." Still gotta eat and pay rent. Comparatively it may be cheaper than some other places but you're still betting a ton of money on a coin flip. I will be attending a truly solid regional for about 12K a year tuition and no COL costs and I am still a bit uneasy about this whole venture because there's a 25% chance I will not become a lawyer after spending all that time and money. This school is way worse than that and the idea of attending should give any rational person pause.

Just because this school isn't as festering as other festering TTTs doesn't mean it's not still festering at its core.


Especially when you consider UF/FSU is basically the same price for in-state.

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FKASunny
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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby FKASunny » Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:50 pm

Ruxin1 wrote:Especially when you consider UF/FSU is basically the same price for in-state.


Yeah, and between FIU and UF, guess which one gives you a marginally better shot at a job?

http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=florida
http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=fiu


But JamesDean is correct, the best option for a Floridian is to go to a better school out of state and try to come back. Although that rad law guy warns against the value of prestige once you strike out at OCI.

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Re: FIU Law Prospective Students- ask your questions here!

Postby Ruxin1 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:58 pm

ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) wrote:
Ruxin1 wrote:Especially when you consider UF/FSU is basically the same price for in-state.


Yeah, and between FIU and UF, guess which one gives you a marginally better shot at a job?

http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=florida
http://www.lstscorereports.com/?school=fiu


But JamesDean is correct, the best option for a Floridian is to go to a better school out of state and try to come back. Although that rad law guy warns against the value of prestige once you strike out at OCI.


I know this is an alt but becoming the bearsgrl equivalent for FIU isn't a good look either.




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