Admissions Advising

(Applications Advice, Letters of Recommendation . . . )
Paul Campos
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby Paul Campos » Mon Dec 24, 2012 2:34 pm

Somebody should write a book about this topic. Probably not an OL though.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby vanwinkle » Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:15 pm

Paul Campos wrote:Somebody should write a book about this topic. Probably not an OL though.

Or a blog. A blog might be helpful.

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wert3813
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby wert3813 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 4:08 pm

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Last edited by wert3813 on Fri Oct 31, 2014 2:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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superpippo
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby superpippo » Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:01 pm

What doesn't make this disingenuous is that the person blindly attending a TTT, TTTT, etc. (key word "blindly") is the type of person, IMO, who isn't going to put in the time to do the research even if you gave them the resources. In fact, I can think of other situations, like the above nutrition example, where people will go to an advisor rather than search the internet for publicly known information because it is easier and they enjoy the 1-1 experience.

Furthermore, if I got let's say a 176 on the LSAT (which I didn't), people would be telling me that I could and would be qualified to tutor/advise kids on the LSAT. However, I could just as easily argue that credible LSAT info is available on TLS so there are no need for personal LSAT tutors, they should just all redirect people to TLS.

For whatever reason, I feel like hearing something from, and working proactively with, an individual in person, rather than an anonymous board, increases the perceived credibility of the information for certain people. Cynics could argue, I'm "taking advantage" of those people, but if I launch this and get 3 or 4 clients, who maybe I save from blindly attending a school that might mess up their life potentially, I think its not inherently bad even if the information is available publicly.

And in regard to being qualified, I definitely don't think I'm qualified to help someone get into the HYS or CCN, because I myself didn't apply there and I don't know as much about the necessary factors when applying there. The service would be directed toward people who are engaging in the process at the base level and don't know which factors are really important to think about when applying. I feel like I'm qualified to help out these individuals to a certain extent.

Danteshek
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby Danteshek » Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:27 pm

dingbat wrote:
Danteshek wrote:This is fraud. If not fraud, it is extremely dishonest. Just that you are thinking of doing it throws into doubt your character and fitness to practice law.

Explain how it is fraud to provide a service for people?
Explain what's dishonest about it?


If you can't see how it's dishonest, maybe you should reconsider going to law school.

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laxbrah420
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby laxbrah420 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:39 pm

OP, I don't understand the point of this? How will you make money?

Here's my situation:

I go to SUNY Cortland. I've studied economics and have a 3.1 GPA. I have a job lined up next year as a temp at a corporate real estate office that will pay me $18/hour. My parents will pay for 50% of my law school or $50k, whichever is more. I got a 166 on the LSAT in October and will be applying next cycle (class of 2017). I refuse to retake. I want to study international law. What should I do?

Now how do you make money off me?

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wert3813
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby wert3813 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:48 pm

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Last edited by wert3813 on Fri Oct 31, 2014 2:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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I, Lawyer
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby I, Lawyer » Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:00 pm

laxbrah420 wrote:OP, I don't understand the point of this? How will you make money?

Here's my situation:

I go to SUNY Cortland. I've studied economics and have a 3.1 GPA. I have a job lined up next year as a temp at a corporate real estate office that will pay me $18/hour. My parents will pay for 50% of my law school or $50k, whichever is more. I got a 166 on the LSAT in October and will be applying next cycle (class of 2017). I refuse to retake. I want to study international law. What should I do?

Now how do you make money off me?


You pay him $100, and get told "retake and ED UVA"

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dingbat
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby dingbat » Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:00 pm

Danteshek wrote:
dingbat wrote:
Danteshek wrote:This is fraud. If not fraud, it is extremely dishonest. Just that you are thinking of doing it throws into doubt your character and fitness to practice law.

Explain how it is fraud to provide a service for people?
Explain what's dishonest about it?


If you can't see how it's dishonest, maybe you should reconsider going to law school.

please enlighten me. I'd like to see exactly which part of what he's proposing is dishonest.

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laxbrah420
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby laxbrah420 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:21 pm

wert3813 wrote:
laxbrah420 wrote:OP, I don't understand the point of this? How will you make money?

Here's my situation:

I go to SUNY Cortland. I've studied economics and have a 3.1 GPA. I have a job lined up next year as a temp at a corporate real estate office that will pay me $18/hour. My parents will pay for 50% of my law school or $50k, whichever is more. I got a 166 on the LSAT in October and will be applying next cycle (class of 2017). I refuse to retake. I want to study international law. What should I do?

Now how do you make money off me?


He spends an hour telling you international law isn't a thing, that you really should retake and explains that going to American isn't a great idea. Then he take 30 bucks from you. Eventually he realizes he isn't making enough and he offers to look over your PS or something. Look, this thread is a little silly, but the notion that you can't make money doing this is incorrect.

Dude I wanted to see what kind of advice I get. This wasn't a question to you, asshole

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sinfiery
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby sinfiery » Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:40 pm

I'd like to provide a service where I post the particular circumstances for a consumer in a TLS thread and then send the link to said person once the thread has come to a conclusion.

Obviously most people are far too incompetent to make an efficient and complete thread without considerable effort (Days of lurking) being put in so there is a definite need.


No one steal my idea. /patent.

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wert3813
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby wert3813 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:44 pm

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Last edited by wert3813 on Fri Oct 31, 2014 2:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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wert3813
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby wert3813 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:47 pm

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Last edited by wert3813 on Fri Oct 31, 2014 2:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Nova
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby Nova » Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:47 pm

DB and Worm make really good points. Aggregating info for others is a legit business practice.

Still, If you want to help applicants as much as possible, you wont withhold valuable resources.

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dr123
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby dr123 » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:09 pm

So you want to start a biz where u scam people out of money and give them "advice"?

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dingbat
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby dingbat » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:17 pm

Nova wrote:DB and Worm make really good points. Aggregating info for others is a legit business practice.

Still, If you want to help applicants as much as possible, you wont withhold valuable resources.

anything that would show up on a simple google query probably can't be considered withheld

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Nova
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby Nova » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:26 pm

dingbat wrote:
Nova wrote:DB and Worm make really good points. Aggregating info for others is a legit business practice.

Still, If you want to help applicants as much as possible, you wont withhold valuable resources.

anything that would show up on a simple google query probably can't be considered withheld

OP's target market probably isnt proficient with the google.

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superpippo
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby superpippo » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:37 pm

laxbrah420 wrote:
wert3813 wrote:
laxbrah420 wrote:OP, I don't understand the point of this? How will you make money?

Here's my situation:

I go to SUNY Cortland. I've studied economics and have a 3.1 GPA. I have a job lined up next year as a temp at a corporate real estate office that will pay me $18/hour. My parents will pay for 50% of my law school or $50k, whichever is more. I got a 166 on the LSAT in October and will be applying next cycle (class of 2017). I refuse to retake. I want to study international law. What should I do?

Now how do you make money off me?


He spends an hour telling you international law isn't a thing, that you really should retake and explains that going to American isn't a great idea. Then he take 30 bucks from you. Eventually he realizes he isn't making enough and he offers to look over your PS or something. Look, this thread is a little silly, but the notion that you can't make money doing this is incorrect.

Dude I wanted to see what kind of advice I get. This wasn't a question to you, asshole


First of all let me preface this by saying, in one of my above posts I mention that my service would be directed towards people who haven't considered relevant factors associated with applying to law school or people just beginning the process themselves. Obviously you have considered cost, a potential field, and are dead-set on your lsat so I would like to think you wouldn't be soliciting my service but anyway...

I would probably first talk about your LSAT. You have a 166, a nice score, you say you are dead-set on not retaking. But what sort of prep did you do to achieve this? I would say 200-300 hours would yield an accurate representation of your possible score if those hours were spent using a systematic method of practicing, e.g. studying question types, their individual strategies and doing individual games/passages/groups of 3 LR then reviewing and understanding explanations --> timing on individual games/passages/a page of LR --> individual timed sections. All this interspersed with one full practice test a week during the first month, then towards test day working up toward more full tests to build endurance. This is a general strategy, if you did anything like this and you truly feel you can't do better than we can move forward. If you just don't think you could "deal" with taking the test again than I would tell you that's not a good reason. Increasing your LSAT by 2-3+ would give you a shot at GWU, better than American, but still not risk-proof. But for min. half tuition, much less risk than many students going to law school.

Based on your answer I would move on to choosing schools and I would go over the publicly available average debt numbers and employment statistics, conveying to you that while studying international law can act as a guide for choosing a school, overall employment prospects for an area you'd like to work should be more relevant overall because "international law" is not an opportunity given to associates, really, at any university because its not a substantive field, which one can get into that easily. Nothing in your international law concentration will provide you an associates gig at an "international law firm," because that brand doesn't actually exist for associates, at least. If you did incredibly well in law school and wanted to get an LLM, possibly, at LSE, Oxbridge, IE, etc. that could actually expose you to practicing internationally if that's something you really wanted to do. This all being said, going to a school like American at half tuition (plus living expenses?) at most might not be a bad option despite an inherent risk of not making biglaw (around 10% according to 2010 figures), which would be necessary to take practice in the international sphere from the US.

But look man, like I said on the basis that you're making some kind of wise-crack about my idea on TLS suggests that you wouldn't need or be willing to pay me $15/hr to discuss these matters.

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Teflon_Don
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby Teflon_Don » Mon Dec 24, 2012 7:54 pm

superpippo wrote:This may be a little ridiculous, but here it goes.

After having an uninformative experience, actually in hindsight, a really uninformative experience, with my undergrad's law school advising program, an experience shared by many of my peers, I am thinking of starting my own advising service to make some extra cash, and genuinely, to help some of my colleagues succeed.

I am not going to divulge all the details of my idea, but I do want to ask if you think its possible to get in trouble for this from my school if I don't do any business on campus? I know there are certain qualification necessary to give legal or medical advice of certain kinds, but legally, are there qualifications necessary for giving academic advice? I would set up the business as a peer-to-peer advising session, so I wouldn't purport myself to be a professional, just a peer alternative or supplement to what the university provides.


Do whatever the hell you want dude, you're fine

JimmyHuang
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby JimmyHuang » Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:14 am

I'm an 0L. I know so many people who want to become lawyers yet don't know the first thing about law school or the career itself. I don't really need to explain to you guys but it's pretty sad.

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laxbrah420
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby laxbrah420 » Tue Dec 25, 2012 4:58 am

superpippo wrote:
laxbrah420 wrote:
wert3813 wrote:
laxbrah420 wrote:OP, I don't understand the point of this? How will you make money?

Here's my situation:

I go to SUNY Cortland. I've studied economics and have a 3.1 GPA. I have a job lined up next year as a temp at a corporate real estate office that will pay me $18/hour. My parents will pay for 50% of my law school or $50k, whichever is more. I got a 166 on the LSAT in October and will be applying next cycle (class of 2017). I refuse to retake. I want to study international law. What should I do?

Now how do you make money off me?


He spends an hour telling you international law isn't a thing, that you really should retake and explains that going to American isn't a great idea. Then he take 30 bucks from you. Eventually he realizes he isn't making enough and he offers to look over your PS or something. Look, this thread is a little silly, but the notion that you can't make money doing this is incorrect.

Dude I wanted to see what kind of advice I get. This wasn't a question to you, asshole


First of all let me preface this by saying, in one of my above posts I mention that my service would be directed towards people who haven't considered relevant factors associated with applying to law school or people just beginning the process themselves. Obviously you have considered cost, a potential field, and are dead-set on your lsat so I would like to think you wouldn't be soliciting my service but anyway...

I would probably first talk about your LSAT. You have a 166, a nice score, you say you are dead-set on not retaking. But what sort of prep did you do to achieve this? I would say 200-300 hours would yield an accurate representation of your possible score if those hours were spent using a systematic method of practicing, e.g. studying question types, their individual strategies and doing individual games/passages/groups of 3 LR then reviewing and understanding explanations --> timing on individual games/passages/a page of LR --> individual timed sections. All this interspersed with one full practice test a week during the first month, then towards test day working up toward more full tests to build endurance. This is a general strategy, if you did anything like this and you truly feel you can't do better than we can move forward. If you just don't think you could "deal" with taking the test again than I would tell you that's not a good reason. Increasing your LSAT by 2-3+ would give you a shot at GWU, better than American, but still not risk-proof. But for min. half tuition, much less risk than many students going to law school.

Based on your answer I would move on to choosing schools and I would go over the publicly available average debt numbers and employment statistics, conveying to you that while studying international law can act as a guide for choosing a school, overall employment prospects for an area you'd like to work should be more relevant overall because "international law" is not an opportunity given to associates, really, at any university because its not a substantive field, which one can get into that easily. Nothing in your international law concentration will provide you an associates gig at an "international law firm," because that brand doesn't actually exist for associates, at least. If you did incredibly well in law school and wanted to get an LLM, possibly, at LSE, Oxbridge, IE, etc. that could actually expose you to practicing internationally if that's something you really wanted to do. This all being said, going to a school like American at half tuition (plus living expenses?) at most might not be a bad option despite an inherent risk of not making biglaw (around 10% according to 2010 figures), which would be necessary to take practice in the international sphere from the US.

But look man, like I said on the basis that you're making some kind of wise-crack about my idea on TLS suggests that you wouldn't need or be willing to pay me $15/hr to discuss these matters.

I told you I fucking refused to retake. If I pre-paid, I demand my money back. But other than that, people are fucking retarded for saying you'd need to point your clients to TLS. And I didn't know there were people who used their UG's pre-law advisor but if people actually use her, go for it.

But more importantly, don't ask legal questions on this fucking website, brohammer

mr.hands
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby mr.hands » Tue Dec 25, 2012 3:17 pm

The first question people will ask is"what are you're credentials? How are you qualified to offer advice?" If you don't purport to be a professional, why are you charging money...

Getting admitted to a mediocre T1 school doesn't qualify you for anything. I'm not just being contrarian, I'm genuinely curious as to how you'll answer these questions. Seriously

Ti Malice
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby Ti Malice » Tue Dec 25, 2012 4:00 pm

mr.hands wrote:The first question people will ask is"what are you're credentials? How are you qualified to offer advice?" If you don't purport to be a professional, why are you charging money...

Getting admitted to a mediocre T1 school doesn't qualify you for anything. I'm not just being contrarian, I'm genuinely curious as to how you'll answer these questions. Seriously


Exactly what I was going to ask.

Your advice would quite likely be better than that of almost any prelaw advisor (blank stares and incoherent mumbling would probably clear that bar), but why will anyone listen to you? Because you got into Arizona or some such school?

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IAFG
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby IAFG » Tue Dec 25, 2012 4:17 pm

Wait I should do this

I am better credentialed than this clown and have a ton of free time

I was thinking of LSAT tutoring but maybe both instead

WanderingPondering
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Re: Admissions Advising

Postby WanderingPondering » Tue Dec 25, 2012 4:46 pm

laxbrah420 wrote:OP, I don't understand the point of this? How will you make money?

Here's my situation:

I go to SUNY Cortland. I've studied economics and have a 3.1 GPA. I have a job lined up next year as a temp at a corporate real estate office that will pay me $18/hour. My parents will pay for 50% of my law school or $50k, whichever is more. I got a 166 on the LSAT in October and will be applying next cycle (class of 2017). I refuse to retake. I want to study international law. What should I do?

Now how do you make money off me?


Is this really your situation or is it a hypo? We have almost identical circumstances, down to university, grades, job, lsat score and test date.




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