Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

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KevinP
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby KevinP » Wed Jul 04, 2012 2:50 pm

^
But bro, factors such as total JD enrollment, Library Materials Expenditure, Total Titles in Library, and Number of Professional Librarians are just as important as First-Time Bar Passage Percentage, Median GPA/LSAT scores, and Percentage of Graduates Employed.

"And we give each of the 40 factors equal weight (2.5% each), a decision intended to reduce the impact of any single factor on the overall rankings, which is the fundamental flaw in US News.”"

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Kikero
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Kikero » Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:08 pm

Lawquacious wrote:
fanmingrui wrote:http://www.cooley.edu/rankings/overall2010.html



Usually a peaceful-minded guy, but someone needs to burn this effing school down. Figuratively of course.

Now they rank themselves #2 nationally? No wonder so many ppl hate this school.


I remember a couple of years ago before I had any idea of the rankings of law schools I saw that list. A girl I knew from my undergrad got accepted there (no idea why she even applied since I think she ended up at Vandy) and I was like "Congratulations! They're in the top 10 or something, right?" She gave me the worst death stare ever, and I only found out later that she thought I was making fun of her.

artfuldodger23
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby artfuldodger23 » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:22 pm

whoa how is Duke constantly higher in the majority of the posters lay rankings than UPenn?!?!?

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rayiner
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby rayiner » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:24 pm

artfuldodger23 wrote:whoa how is Duke constantly higher in the majority of the posters lay rankings than UPenn?!?!?


Basketball.

lilhugsy24
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby lilhugsy24 » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:29 pm

rayiner wrote:
artfuldodger23 wrote:whoa how is Duke constantly higher in the majority of the posters lay rankings than UPenn?!?!?


Basketball.


+1 Coach K man

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Yukos
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Yukos » Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:30 pm

lilhugsy24 wrote:
rayiner wrote:
artfuldodger23 wrote:whoa how is Duke constantly higher in the majority of the posters lay rankings than UPenn?!?!?


Basketball.


+1 Coach K man


And Tucker Max.

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westinghouse60
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby westinghouse60 » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:59 pm

People were really amazed I got into Cornell, I think it's because of Andy from the office. Also I'm from NC, and while people recognize Duke as prestigious it's so hated here that that somewhat negates the effect. I think you also have to account for different types of lay prestige. People familar with higher education in general but not law school rankings per se aren't going to confuse UPenn with Penn state, are going to know UChicago is a good school, etc, even if they aren't 100% up on the US News rankings. In contrast, totally lay people are more likely to think Notre Dame law must be super prestigious, etc.

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Chucky21
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Chucky21 » Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:28 pm

westinghouse60 wrote:People were really amazed I got into Cornell, I think it's because of Andy from the office. Also I'm from NC, and while people recognize Duke as prestigious it's so hated here that that somewhat negates the effect. I think you also have to account for different types of lay prestige. People familar with higher education in general but not law school rankings per se aren't going to confuse UPenn with Penn state, are going to know UChicago is a good school, etc, even if they aren't 100% up on the US News rankings. In contrast, totally lay people are more likely to think Notre Dame law must be super prestigious, etc.


well to be honest, getting into Cornell, and any other T14 is quite a feat.

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moonman157
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby moonman157 » Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:47 pm

Chucky21 wrote:
westinghouse60 wrote:People were really amazed I got into Cornell, I think it's because of Andy from the office. Also I'm from NC, and while people recognize Duke as prestigious it's so hated here that that somewhat negates the effect. I think you also have to account for different types of lay prestige. People familar with higher education in general but not law school rankings per se aren't going to confuse UPenn with Penn state, are going to know UChicago is a good school, etc, even if they aren't 100% up on the US News rankings. In contrast, totally lay people are more likely to think Notre Dame law must be super prestigious, etc.


well to be honest, getting into Cornell, and any other T14 is quite a feat.


This is often forgotten on this site

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Greenandgold
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Greenandgold » Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:59 pm

moonman157 wrote:
Chucky21 wrote:
westinghouse60 wrote:People were really amazed I got into Cornell, I think it's because of Andy from the office. Also I'm from NC, and while people recognize Duke as prestigious it's so hated here that that somewhat negates the effect. I think you also have to account for different types of lay prestige. People familar with higher education in general but not law school rankings per se aren't going to confuse UPenn with Penn state, are going to know UChicago is a good school, etc, even if they aren't 100% up on the US News rankings. In contrast, totally lay people are more likely to think Notre Dame law must be super prestigious, etc.


well to be honest, getting into Cornell, and any other T14 is quite a feat.


This is often forgotten on this site


Not forgotten, simply irrelevant to the majority of the conversations that take place on these forums. For example, you can pat yourself on the back for scoring above a 164 on the LSAT since only 10% of test takers do, but what's the point? Without a stellar gpa that scores gonna be lucky to break the top 20. In which case you'll more than likely come out of school with more debt than your job enables you to pay back and your wonderful achievement of scoring so well on the LSAT will be meaningless. Well it's the same thing with getting into certain schools, such as Cornell. Yea, it's not easy to do, but that doesn't really mean a whole lot in the grand scheme of things. It's certainly a lot better than most other law schools, but this isn't 2006 anymore and Cornell and plenty of other T14 schools don't give you the guarantee of a high paying job that they used to.

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moonman157
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby moonman157 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:11 am

Greenandgold wrote:
moonman157 wrote:
Chucky21 wrote:
westinghouse60 wrote:People were really amazed I got into Cornell, I think it's because of Andy from the office. Also I'm from NC, and while people recognize Duke as prestigious it's so hated here that that somewhat negates the effect. I think you also have to account for different types of lay prestige. People familar with higher education in general but not law school rankings per se aren't going to confuse UPenn with Penn state, are going to know UChicago is a good school, etc, even if they aren't 100% up on the US News rankings. In contrast, totally lay people are more likely to think Notre Dame law must be super prestigious, etc.


well to be honest, getting into Cornell, and any other T14 is quite a feat.


This is often forgotten on this site


Not forgotten, simply irrelevant to the majority of the conversations that take place on these forums. For example, you can pat yourself on the back for scoring above a 164 on the LSAT since only 10% of test takers do, but what's the point? Without a stellar gpa that scores gonna be lucky to break the top 20. In which case you'll more than likely come out of school with more debt than your job enables you to pay back and your wonderful achievement of scoring so well on the LSAT will be meaningless. Well it's the same thing with getting into certain schools, such as Cornell. Yea, it's not easy to do, but that doesn't really mean a whole lot in the grand scheme of things. It's certainly a lot better than most other law schools, but this isn't 2006 anymore and Cornell and plenty of other T14 schools don't give you the guarantee of a high paying job that they used to.


I certainly don't disagree with this, and the advice that TLS dispenses is fantastic. But when you're reading through a thread about the LSAT, and everyone has scored in the 170s, it's easy to get used to those scores being thrown around a lot and forgetting what an accomplishment that is. Again, this makes sense, but it certainly can distort the reality of law school admissions.


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Samara
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Samara » Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:53 am

PDaddy wrote:
kwais wrote:
PDaddy wrote:
Neander wrote:Eh, not sure about Baylor and Purdue :P


Ask people on the street. Those names sound like hot shit! As a matter of fact, I bet people think Baylor and Purdue have hot shit law schools, just like Princeton.


really depends on where you are from. There is not a soul I knew growing up in New England who thinks that a prestigious school could exist in Texas and in whatever state Purdue is in.


Credited, but mostly because everyone, even northeasterners, pretty much assumes that the northeast is the hotbed of U.S. education. Old reputations die hard. Purdue is a bit trickier, because it is in the midwest (Indiana) and part of the Big-10. Other than the Ivy league, the midwestern schools that comprise the pre-2000 Big-10 are believed to be the most impressive academic consortium. Besides, the people you mention have to know that Notre Dame is also in Indiana.

This thread is dumb, mainly because prestige is so localized, but I am jumping in to say that the Purdue thing is totally credited. I have met several people outside the Midwest who think that Purdue is some super-preftigous private school. Even in Illinois, people talk about it like its on par with NU and UChi.

The problem with "lay prestige" is that you can't really compare schools usefully. NU earns its prestige from top 12 law, medicine and business schools. Purdue earns its prestige from its top ten engineering school, #1 ag school, #1 aerospace program, and a host of other top five programs. (Purdue doesn't even have a law or med school!) So, unless you're interested in business school (top 3 v. top 40), comparing the prestige of NU to Purdue is stupid.
Last edited by Samara on Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Samara
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Samara » Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:11 am

flem wrote:LOL @ people ranking Chicago as high as they are on lay prestige. Penn, Chicago and Northwestern have the least lay prestige of any school in the T14. The thing is, they outplace all of their peer schools that are more lay prestigious.

Which brings me back to my original point, lay prestige is worthless. Notre Dame has more lay prestige than any schools that isn't HYS

Except in Indiana, humorously enough. Notre Dame is no more prestigious than Purdue or Indiana U in the Hoosier state. In some circles, you could argue that Butler and Ball State are on par with Notre Dame.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:30 am

Agree with the posts by Bernaldiaz & lawquacious on page 2 of this thread that law school lay prestige starts with Harvard then Notre Dame & UCLA. Georgetown is also among the top five.

Harvard
Georgetown
Notre Dame
UCLA

After these law schools, lay prestige is regional, in my opinion. In The South, for example, Duke, Virginia & Vanderbilt law schools would be listed among the most prestigious, while in The West, Stanford & Berkeley impress.

TMC116
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby TMC116 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:35 am

CanadianWolf wrote:Agree with the posts by Bernaldiaz & lawquacious on page 2 of this thread that law school lay prestige starts with Harvard then Notre Dame & UCLA. Georgetown is also among the top five.

Harvard
Georgetown
Notre Dame
UCLA

After these law schools, lay prestige is regional, in my opinion. In The South, for example, Duke, Virginia & Vanderbilt law schools would be listed among the most prestigious, while in The West, Stanford & Berkeley impress.


I disagree w your top 5 and their national prestige. In the Midwest and north, ND is a big deal. Prestige diminishes outside of that. For instance, no one in the South gives a damn about Notre Dame (or UCLA for that matter)

CanadianWolf
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:40 am

Agree that UCLA is not a factor in The South, although Notre Dame will register on the lay prestige scale even in this region. Relatively speaking, do you think Southerners care about Cornell, Berkeley, Penn, NYU, Columbia, or Yale ?

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Nova
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Nova » Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:41 am

IMO, in terms of lay prestige,

National:
Harvard
Yale
Stanford
.....
Everyone else

M/V/P is probably the most under rated

TMC116
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby TMC116 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:45 am

CanadianWolf wrote:Agree that UCLA is not a factor in The South, although Notre Dame will register on the lay prestige scale even in this region. Relatively speaking, do you think Southerners care about Cornell, Berkeley, Penn, NYU, Columbia, or Yale ?


All of those names are recognizable minus Penn. People, sadly, either confuse it w Penn State or think it's just a random public university

Columbia and Yale are *definitely* well respected.

EDIT: I agree that MVP are the most underrated. Sad but true

CanadianWolf
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:11 am

"Recognizable" does not equal "prestige".

Curious1
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Curious1 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:23 am

CanadianWolf wrote:"Recognizable" does not equal "prestige".


What kind of Southerner are we talking about here? I should think that anyone with a minimum level of education should both recognize and respect Columbia and Yale more than Georgetown, UCLA, or Notre Dame.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:25 am

The grits eatin' kind. :D

Curious1
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Curious1 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:31 am

flem wrote:
Curious1 wrote:What kind of Southerner are we talking about here? I should think that anyone with a minimum level of education should both recognize and respect Columbia and Yale more than Georgetown, UCLA, or Notre Dame.


(assumes people in the south actually have a minimum level of education)


Well Yale was traditionally the school for elite southerners way back when, so I'd think that name still carries some weight down there with the general population. I agree that Columbia might not have a lot of pull for uneducated southerners.

thederangedwang
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby thederangedwang » Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:10 am

Curious1 wrote:
flem wrote:
Curious1 wrote:What kind of Southerner are we talking about here? I should think that anyone with a minimum level of education should both recognize and respect Columbia and Yale more than Georgetown, UCLA, or Notre Dame.


(assumes people in the south actually have a minimum level of education)


Well Yale was traditionally the school for elite southerners way back when, so I'd think that name still carries some weight down there with the general population. I agree that Columbia might not have a lot of pull for uneducated southerners.

pretty sure that was princeton

Curious1
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Re: Ranking of T14, from most to least prestigious

Postby Curious1 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:45 am

thederangedwang wrote:
Curious1 wrote:
flem wrote:
Curious1 wrote:What kind of Southerner are we talking about here? I should think that anyone with a minimum level of education should both recognize and respect Columbia and Yale more than Georgetown, UCLA, or Notre Dame.


(assumes people in the south actually have a minimum level of education)


Well Yale was traditionally the school for elite southerners way back when, so I'd think that name still carries some weight down there with the general population. I agree that Columbia might not have a lot of pull for uneducated southerners.

pretty sure that was princeton


Pretty sure princeton has no law school




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