Early Admissions, how important is it?

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JohnV
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Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby JohnV » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:32 pm

I'm studying for the LSAT and plan to take it in October. I know I can apply for early admissions with this test date but the problem is I might not have my LORs or my PS ready in time and it's likely that this last semester (Fall 2012 is my last semester) will raise my GPA a few points so I'd like admissions to see my updated GPA rather than my current one (3.76 to possible 3.79). Should I try to get these LR's quickly and start working on my PS (while studying for the LSAT) or should I wait to apply during the regular session?

Also, I'm trying to get LORs and I hear they like professors to give them more than anything but that is going to be tough for me. I could probably get some from my supervisors/co-workers (I work as a staff member of a T20 law school and I could probably get LORs from people who work with students as I've done projects with them) so I'm hoping that could actually work in my favor even though they aren't professors.

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cutecarmel
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby cutecarmel » Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:30 pm

I think applying ED would be good for your reach schools. If I were you, I wouldn't hold off on the application for only a .02 GPA increase.

As for your timing, unless you have a really intense work schedule over the summer, you should have plenty of time to write your PS. And if you ask for LORs now, your recommenders have enough time to submit them. So, I don't think you should wait.

As for who writes your LORs, remember that what your recommenders say is more important than their prestige, so getting an LOR from someone that works at a T20 law school isn't valuable unless they really have something impressive to say about you. And I wouldn't recommend getting co-workers to write them for you; only supervisors.
Also, you really should get LORs from professors, since your are still in school. Unless you have pissed off all of your professors, there has to be someone who was impressed with you, or at least thinks enough of you to write an LOR.

JohnV
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby JohnV » Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:12 am

cutecarmel wrote:I think applying ED would be good for your reach schools. If I were you, I wouldn't hold off on the application for only a .02 GPA increase.

As for your timing, unless you have a really intense work schedule over the summer, you should have plenty of time to write your PS. And if you ask for LORs now, your recommenders have enough time to submit them. So, I don't think you should wait.


Well the problem is I do have a pretty intense work schedule. I'm working 20 - 30 hours a week + summer school + all remaining time to LSAT studying. Also, I'm not sure if I can get the LORs I need yet. The people I want to ask I'd still like to log more time with because I'm still new-ish at the job and the 2nd one is not so much a sure thing and I may need to try to log more time with professors I'm going to take (for a second time, but it's been a semester in-between seeing them) before I ask.

Also, ED might be out of the question for me because I'd like to be able to negotiate financially with different schools, it's going to be an important part of my decision process (assuming I score well enough to be able to expect any sort of aid in any first tier school).

As for who writes your LORs, remember that what your recommenders say is more important than their prestige, so getting an LOR from someone that works at a T20 law school isn't valuable unless they really have something impressive to say about you. And I wouldn't recommend getting co-workers to write them for you; only supervisors.


Ok good advice, I pick them because I think they'd have good things to say about me but I just wanted to see if people thought non-professor LORs were worth it in any case.

Also, you really should get LORs from professors, since your are still in school. Unless you have pissed off all of your professors, there has to be someone who was impressed with you, or at least thinks enough of you to write an LOR.


Eeehhh... I do well in school, especially the last 2 years, but my classes are large and I'm quite in the classroom and I tend to sit in the middle/back and rarely speak to the professor. I go to a very large school. I have talked to a few in the past about it and I get the same response (from teachers who I get A's from): "I could/will write an LOR for you but I can't write anything particularly personal because the class hasn't afforded me/us the chance to work together or to get to know each other very well".

It really has been quite a struggle for me to make any progress on this part of my application, I have a lot of things to do and it doesn't come natural for me to chat up the professors and make me someone they 'want' to write an LOR for. I don't think I just have a shitty personality... I just don't think they are comfortable writing for a guy they don't know just because he got an A in the class which was (in almost every case) graded entirely by their TA.

The other option I have is postponing it a year but I'm already a 5th year senior and already started studying pretty regularly for it... I could maybe take the test Oct, Dec '12, and Feb/June '13 if necessary but postponing law school a second year (from the norm) is not something I'd like to do and it could complicate other things in my life.

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2014
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby 2014 » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:45 am

No excuse to not have your PS or LORs ready. Ask your LOR providers now, or as soon as you can after school starts if you must and work on your PS in the 3 weeks you wait for your LSAT score to come back. It's not worth waiting for your GPA like the other poster said and ED is probably a bad idea since you could be in for a lot of money if you hit 170+ which you have plenty of time to do.

JohnV
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby JohnV » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:54 am

2014 wrote:No excuse to not have your PS or LORs ready. Ask your LOR providers now, or as soon as you can after school starts if you must and work on your PS in the 3 weeks you wait for your LSAT score to come back. It's not worth waiting for your GPA like the other poster said and ED is probably a bad idea since you could be in for a lot of money if you hit 170+ which you have plenty of time to do.


Hmmm, I will try to get them as soon as possible... it's just I go to one of the biggest universities in the country (and a huge major/school to boot) and it's hard for teachers to even remember the names of their students here much less be ok with giving them an LOR. But I'll try to get it squared away. Just not sure how I'm going to ask someone else to give me one by mid-late September.

bp shinners
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby bp shinners » Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:16 pm

JohnV wrote:Hmmm, I will try to get them as soon as possible... it's just I go to one of the biggest universities in the country (and a huge major/school to boot) and it's hard for teachers to even remember the names of their students here much less be ok with giving them an LOR. But I'll try to get it squared away. Just not sure how I'm going to ask someone else to give me one by mid-late September.


Any of those professors will be OK with writing an LoR for you, providing you did well in their class. I guarantee you they've written hundreds of glowing letters for students they couldn't pick out in a lineup. Just go in, be polite, have information for them (resume, best work for their class, why you want to go to law school), and you'll be fine.

To another point, you mentioned above that you're getting one from your work. You're still in undergrad, right? If that's the case, use the employer letter as a third letter. There's no reason for a current student to not have 2 letters from professors - if you don't have those 2 academic letters, it will raise questions.

bp shinners
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby bp shinners » Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:48 pm

Wormfather wrote:
bp shinners wrote:To another point, you mentioned above that you're getting one from your work. You're still in undergrad, right? If that's the case, use the employer letter as a third letter. There's no reason for a current student to not have 2 letters from professors - if you don't have those 2 academic letters, it will raise questions.


Not to hijack the thread but would this advice hold for someone who worked for 10 years out of high school but who for the last three years has been doing their undergrad exclusively? I prefer letters from professors, but I dont want to look bad for not having ones from work, especially because I dont trust anyone that I used to work for.


You'll be fine with just academic letters.

JohnV
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby JohnV » Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:05 pm

bp shinners wrote:
JohnV wrote:Hmmm, I will try to get them as soon as possible... it's just I go to one of the biggest universities in the country (and a huge major/school to boot) and it's hard for teachers to even remember the names of their students here much less be ok with giving them an LOR. But I'll try to get it squared away. Just not sure how I'm going to ask someone else to give me one by mid-late September.


Any of those professors will be OK with writing an LoR for you, providing you did well in their class. I guarantee you they've written hundreds of glowing letters for students they couldn't pick out in a lineup. Just go in, be polite, have information for them (resume, best work for their class, why you want to go to law school), and you'll be fine.

To another point, you mentioned above that you're getting one from your work. You're still in undergrad, right? If that's the case, use the employer letter as a third letter. There's no reason for a current student to not have 2 letters from professors - if you don't have those 2 academic letters, it will raise questions.


Fair enough. I guess it doesn't hurt to try and let them know that I can supply any information they'd like me to. Just the last 2 I've asked did seem to have reservations about doing it, even though they said they'd do it, seemed like they were going to write pretty lack-luster letters and it worried me that they both had pretty similar responses.

Should I ask people from Spring semester or wait until this coming Fall semester? Any experiences with asking people who you haven't seen few a month or 2?

bp shinners
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby bp shinners » Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:32 am

JohnV wrote:
bp shinners wrote:
JohnV wrote:Hmmm, I will try to get them as soon as possible... it's just I go to one of the biggest universities in the country (and a huge major/school to boot) and it's hard for teachers to even remember the names of their students here much less be ok with giving them an LOR. But I'll try to get it squared away. Just not sure how I'm going to ask someone else to give me one by mid-late September.


Any of those professors will be OK with writing an LoR for you, providing you did well in their class. I guarantee you they've written hundreds of glowing letters for students they couldn't pick out in a lineup. Just go in, be polite, have information for them (resume, best work for their class, why you want to go to law school), and you'll be fine.

To another point, you mentioned above that you're getting one from your work. You're still in undergrad, right? If that's the case, use the employer letter as a third letter. There's no reason for a current student to not have 2 letters from professors - if you don't have those 2 academic letters, it will raise questions.


Fair enough. I guess it doesn't hurt to try and let them know that I can supply any information they'd like me to. Just the last 2 I've asked did seem to have reservations about doing it, even though they said they'd do it, seemed like they were going to write pretty lack-luster letters and it worried me that they both had pretty similar responses.

Should I ask people from Spring semester or wait until this coming Fall semester? Any experiences with asking people who you haven't seen few a month or 2?


Exactly what you've been doing - meet with them, have the information, and feel them out. You were completely in the right to decide that they would write lackluster letters; some professors are like that. Just keep asking until you find a few who seem more 'excited' by the prospect (within reason - no one's revels in writing LoRs).

JohnV
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby JohnV » Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:16 pm

bp shinners wrote:
JohnV wrote:
bp shinners wrote:
JohnV wrote:Hmmm, I will try to get them as soon as possible... it's just I go to one of the biggest universities in the country (and a huge major/school to boot) and it's hard for teachers to even remember the names of their students here much less be ok with giving them an LOR. But I'll try to get it squared away. Just not sure how I'm going to ask someone else to give me one by mid-late September.


Any of those professors will be OK with writing an LoR for you, providing you did well in their class. I guarantee you they've written hundreds of glowing letters for students they couldn't pick out in a lineup. Just go in, be polite, have information for them (resume, best work for their class, why you want to go to law school), and you'll be fine.

To another point, you mentioned above that you're getting one from your work. You're still in undergrad, right? If that's the case, use the employer letter as a third letter. There's no reason for a current student to not have 2 letters from professors - if you don't have those 2 academic letters, it will raise questions.


Fair enough. I guess it doesn't hurt to try and let them know that I can supply any information they'd like me to. Just the last 2 I've asked did seem to have reservations about doing it, even though they said they'd do it, seemed like they were going to write pretty lack-luster letters and it worried me that they both had pretty similar responses.

Should I ask people from Spring semester or wait until this coming Fall semester? Any experiences with asking people who you haven't seen few a month or 2?


Exactly what you've been doing - meet with them, have the information, and feel them out. You were completely in the right to decide that they would write lackluster letters; some professors are like that. Just keep asking until you find a few who seem more 'excited' by the prospect (within reason - no one's revels in writing LoRs).


Slight necro, but didn't want to make a new topic for just this question. I have a spanish teacher from a community college who got to know me better than most, but I'm wondering if a community college (only took 3 classes there) will look bad or not. Also, his english is passable, but you can tell it's his second language. Should I pursue this or try to find a professor at my main school who doesn't know me as well but speaks english better.

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2014
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby 2014 » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:30 pm

Being from a CC probably isn't too bad assuming he has some sort of credibility (Like he's taught there for several years and can evaluate you compared to many other students). If he is in his first semester and is teaching because he has a B.A. and is fluent in Spanish, that's different.

What would be a red flag to me is that he is ESL and his letter might end up poorly written.

JohnV
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Re: Early Admissions, how important is it?

Postby JohnV » Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:06 pm

2014 wrote:Being from a CC probably isn't too bad assuming he has some sort of credibility (Like he's taught there for several years and can evaluate you compared to many other students). If he is in his first semester and is teaching because he has a B.A. and is fluent in Spanish, that's different.

What would be a red flag to me is that he is ESL and his letter might end up poorly written.


He's an older man, has worked there and at other schools for decades. His english isn't bad but I can't attest to his writing abilities. He sometimes had trouble understanding me and my classmates when speaking in English.




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