So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

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RedBirds2011
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby RedBirds2011 » Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:54 pm

LSAT Blog wrote:
notaznguy wrote:
Paul Campos wrote:I'm sincerely curious as to how the OP thinks he/she is going to service $180K of high interest non-dischargeable debt on a $60K salary (btw looking at their stats there's no way even half the class at Loyola LA was making as much as $60K a year after graduation, while maybe 10% of the class was making the $90K or more which most people who study these things would tell you is the absolute bare minimum salary that would justify incurring a $180K debt).

When you add to this that the O doesn't really have any particular desire to be a lawyer besides thinking for some unknown reason that these numbers add up to making a law degree at sticker from Loyola a good investment, well . . .


60k would just be starting...I'm sure eventually after a few years it'd be much higher. Come on, nobody is going to be hired at 60k and stuck at 60k for 40 years.

In terms of being a lawyer, it's not that I don't want to do it or hate it or anything like that. I just view work as work. Unless someone hired me as a professional Starcraft player, I don't think I have a real desire to work any job. I'd rather just lounge around and drink coconuts all day if it were up to me. Being a lawyer seems to fit some of the work environment I want - I am a History major and I enjoyed reading and writing and researching stuff. Being a lawyer seems to be like that, except you're getting paid to do it. I've interned at a law firm before and I've written some IRAC memos. It's boring, but I'd prefer it much over doing some chemistry problems.

Anyways like I said, the prospect of starting at 60k and gradually moving my way up to 90k is just so much more glorious than staring down at a 50k-60k salary as a social worker for the rest of my life.



http://www.nalp.org/salarydistrib

Graph of data for the Class of 2010:

(sure, these are starting salaries, but how much room for growth can you assume there will really be if you start off in the 35-65k track?)


Image


I didnt read much of this thread, but if you are a good lawyer/rainmaker (required to make good money in anything by the way), it is pretty dumb to assume ones starting salary would be the same the rest of his or her life, even adjusted for inflation. Starting salaries are starting salaries. There is no way to tell what someones long time earnings would be. However, I did see somewhere in this thread about not wanting to be a lawyer and a high level of debt. If this is true, don't go. LS is not a fall back plan and you certainly need to try to limit debt.

notaznguy
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby notaznguy » Sat Apr 21, 2012 6:23 pm

I have to admit, the weirdest thing by all of this is that I'm actually basing my life decisions off an internet forum. What I mean by this is I've actually let TLS influence me so heavily in making a decision to go to law school or not. According to TLS, it's T-14 or nothing, which I think is grossly exaggerated. I do think there are shortcomings to going to a lesser known school, but the 99% chance of doom makes me rationalize, "Of course, it is the internet after all....ha.....take it with a grain of salt." When I tell my relatives I can't go to law school unless it's T-14, they look at me like an idiot or as if I just told them something unrealistic. It's like telling someone, "I'm only going to date super models and super hot actresses, even though I'm just a normal looking guy."

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Ludo!
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby Ludo! » Sat Apr 21, 2012 6:39 pm

notaznguy wrote:I have to admit, the weirdest thing by all of this is that I'm actually basing my life decisions off an internet forum. What I mean by this is I've actually let TLS influence me so heavily in making a decision to go to law school or not. According to TLS, it's T-14 or nothing, which I think is grossly exaggerated. I do think there are shortcomings to going to a lesser known school, but the 99% chance of doom makes me rationalize, "Of course, it is the internet after all....ha.....take it with a grain of salt." When I tell my relatives I can't go to law school unless it's T-14, they look at me like an idiot or as if I just told them something unrealistic. It's like telling someone, "I'm only going to date super models and super hot actresses, even though I'm just a normal looking guy."


Nobody said T-14 or nothing and nobody said there was a 99% chance of failure. It's just generally a bad idea to go to a TT at sticker in a crowded market. Maybe it would make more sense if you had a burning passion to be a lawyer and you just couldn't envision doing anything else for a career, but sounds like you're fine doing something else

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El_Gallo
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby El_Gallo » Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:11 pm

Do you really think you would like being a lawyer as much as being a social worker? My wife works for Child Protective Services and she likes her job way more than I can ever imagine myself liking law.

It is common TLS wisdom that a JD is not the versatile degree that lay society thinks it is. However, (and I may be wrong) it seems like a MSW opens a lot of doors. Besides CPS you could work for a hospital, nursing home, school, non-profit, etc. It seems like a MSW may even be able to get your foot in the door for some human resource jobs in the private sector. There are also other ways to make a good income besides management. For example, you could open your own counseling practice.

I don't know dude. TLS is obviously pretty debbie downer on law school hopefuls outside of the T14. I don't think you should let that discourage you if being a lawyer is what you want to do. However, I think getting a MSW could be a pretty sweet career choice for somebody with your interests.

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presh
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby presh » Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:25 pm

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Last edited by presh on Sun Dec 27, 2015 11:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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nigeriansiberian
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby nigeriansiberian » Sun Apr 22, 2012 3:07 am

Honestly dude.

Go to LSE and get a masters in Economic History. Its way more BA than law school. plus british chicks are dank.

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dingbat
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby dingbat » Sun Apr 22, 2012 3:08 am

nigeriansiberian wrote:Honestly dude.

Go to LSE and get a masters in Economic History. Its way more BA than law school. plus british chicks are dank.

dank or skank?

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nigeriansiberian
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby nigeriansiberian » Sun Apr 22, 2012 3:38 am

dank and skank

notaznguy
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby notaznguy » Sun Apr 22, 2012 4:46 pm

Yes...from what I've been told anyways, and from what I've seen, a MSW is pretty flexible in the sense that you can work in many places. I only have a few friends that have MSWs, but some are working in hospitals while others are working for CPS. I also know a few others working nonprofits. Still, the main concern with MSWs is just the salary, sigh. I enjoy working with youth and families, but it's just a struggle to stomach that I'll only be making 50-70k most of my life O_O (I live in a high cost of living city, so salaries are a bit higher). On the bright side, at least there are good benefits and the job is mainly 9-5 and no weekends.

Oh jeez...and no I didn't know CoA for Loyola was going to be like 210k...wow. It just keeps going up every year. This is like the stupid housing bubble in the mid 2000s. Houses that were once 600k have dropped down to 300k. Crazy. I wonder if anything like that will happen to law school tuition. I just don't see how anyone would go to law school if tuition ever went up to like 80k or 100k a year.

Paul Campos
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby Paul Campos » Sun Apr 22, 2012 5:05 pm

notaznguy wrote:Yes...from what I've been told anyways, and from what I've seen, a MSW is pretty flexible in the sense that you can work in many places. I only have a few friends that have MSWs, but some are working in hospitals while others are working for CPS. I also know a few others working nonprofits. Still, the main concern with MSWs is just the salary, sigh. I enjoy working with youth and families, but it's just a struggle to stomach that I'll only be making 50-70k most of my life O_O (I live in a high cost of living city, so salaries are a bit higher). On the bright side, at least there are good benefits and the job is mainly 9-5 and no weekends.

Oh jeez...and no I didn't know CoA for Loyola was going to be like 210k...wow. It just keeps going up every year. This is like the stupid housing bubble in the mid 2000s. Houses that were once 600k have dropped down to 300k. Crazy. I wonder if anything like that will happen to law school tuition. I just don't see how anyone would go to law school if tuition ever went up to like 80k or 100k a year.


Yes something like that is going to happen to law school tuition. It's going to crater . . . whether in two or five or ten years nobody knows, but it will.

The reason it will is that enough people in your position will realize it makes no sense to go to a school like Loyola given that there's an excellent chance you won't end up making any more money than you would have as a social worker, except you'll work 50% more hours at work that isn't as satisfying, and have $200K in debt in the bargain.

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dingbat
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Re: So...I'm still considering my options, what do you think?

Postby dingbat » Sun Apr 22, 2012 5:08 pm

Paul Campos wrote:Yes something like that is going to happen to law school tuition. It's going to crater . . . whether in two or five or ten years nobody knows, but it will.

Not with loans available to anyone who wants to give it a go.




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