FROSH at IU, Interested in Law School, Advice?

[JDizzle2015]

Kid was literally 2 or 3 years old when Jumanji came out.

Also, the other posters are right. Focus on your GPA, enjoy college, and wait until senior year/after UG to study for the LSAT. Don't worry about the LSAT yet. I just find it funny when anyone who hasn't taken the test says they know they can score 175+ (is this bitterness at my TLS-mediocre score? perhaps...).

[romothesavior]

That GPA isn't going to cut it.

Also, you screwed up your first semester so you recover with a 3.2? You're going to need straight As for the rest of college.

Definitely this. You better load up on easy courses and get that GPA as high as humanly possibly.

Also, if you could only swing a 2.25 first semester (that is AWFUL and likely not just the result of one class, btw) you are gonna have a hell of a time getting a 175+. Not trying to be rude, just being realistic here. They don't just let kids walk into Harvard Law. Have you taken the LSAT?

[emkay625]

Addendums are not particularly helpful unless it is for serious medical reasons or serious family emergencies - death of parent, etc. Harvard is not going to disregard your first semester just because math is difficult for you and you had a rough first semester. That's the case for probably 60 percent of college students. Your prelaw advisor is misinformed. Sorry, but it's true.

Get a 4.0 the rest of the way out. If you can, take on a second major and stay for a 5th year.

Also, saying you're sure of a 175+ is misguided without any information. There are people on this message board with very, very high IQs (much higher than my own) and over a year of prep who did not crack that threshold. It would be more helpful if you could get a diagnostic score - we could give you advice on how realistic a 175+ is then. Try to find a free diagnostic exam event - Kaplan offers them, where you can just take a real test under timed, proctored conditions, and get your score for free. Do that and then report back. (But stay away from Kaplan after that - their free events are great but classes are not so great).

[emkay625]

Also, you don't happen to be a URM, do you? That would change everything.

[iowalum]

Guys, I REALLY, REALLY appreciate all this advice. Yes, I'm young haha. And no, I'm not flaming. haha. But I must say...would Harvard frown upon a fifth year of college? I am sure I could get a better GPA with a fifth year...but are they going to look at it and say: "Oh he couldn't graduate in five years, he can't handle HLS" or "he took the fifth year just to pad his stats"...could this hurt me somehow? And btw...if I DID take a fifth year, would I need to write a letter of addendum explaining why it took an extra year?

I wouldn't worry about the 5th year thing - as long as you're not taking basket weaving or something. Get a minor or take some classes in another area aside from your major or a language or something (as long as you can get a good grade in it, obv.) Lots of people take an extra year and as long as you aren't obviously slacking off they probably won't notice.

[hookem7]

Dude, just focus on your grades, the LSAT is a loooong way away for you. I'm glad you are aiming for the top but getting straight As for 3 years and a 175+ LSAT isn't something that just happens. I know I took some "easy" classes where I should have gotten an A and ended up with an A- or B+ because I rationalized that I didn't need to try hard to get that A. Just get that GPA up, it will help no matter what you decide to do.

[llachans]

lol bro try back when your a senior because everything right now is just speculative

+1

You're speculating way too much. Just do the best you can and see what your GPA ends up as. Since you have no LSAT score and nowhere close to a GPA guess (it's not reasonable to assume you'll have that much of an increase), there's nothing you can really do right now.

Just slow down and enjoy undergrad. It's 4 years you won't get back.

[JDizzle2015]

I'm sure you know this already, but ratemyprofessors.com should be your best friend from here on out. (Specifically, avoid any class with less than a 4 on easiness.)

[llachans]

And just to clarify, Harvard is my goal and my #1. I am using the scores of that school as a measuring stick for myself. If I fall short of Harvard, then I obviously will go somewhere else haha...but I DO want T14. Not settling for outside T14.

Do you have any valid reasoning why you're so fond of Harvard or do you like it just because it sounds good? If you're going to be this unrealistic (not trying to be rude), it makes sense that you'd gun for Yale.

[aekea]

No, they will not overlook your first semester or calculate your GPA without it. You could still get into some really good schools with a good enough LSAT, but probably not the top 3, and even top 6 will be tough.

Most pre-law advisors are idiots with only the vaguest notion of how to apply to law school, by the way.

Why do you say that, Rink?

And you don't think a letter of addendum explaining the circumstances will help? If I got a 177 on the LSAT, or even a 178, with a 3.75 cumulative excluding S1, you don't think they'll overlook it? Especially with strong internships and extracurriculars?

If you've only worked hard enough to earn a 2.5 or whatever first semester at IU it's a presumption to think you can get an LSAT of 177.

This is presumptuous for anyone, really.

[HarvardHopeful93]

Heyyyyy...I liked Jumanji
And I'm gunning for Harvard because the prestige IS appealing to me. But mainly, since it is a very high standard, it is one that I wish to judge myself by. I am the type of person that strives to be the best. And S1 of FR years happened for many different reasons: personal issues, college adjustment, etc.

I am not an URM. White Irish kid from Indiana. Not exactly gonna get a break in that department. By no means am I being arrogant though...I realize 175+ is just a goal. I am not saying I WILL get that, I'm saying I believe I CAN. I really appreciate all this advice. I've been working my ass off for the past month. I did not take school seriously at all last semester. With the level of work I've been doing, and the VAST changes I've made in my life as of late, straight A's are completely and utterly achievable, no doubt in my mind. Not arrogance, confidence. I pulled up 3 B-'s to A's and a D to a C range. I should have between a 3.2 and 3.4 this semester. Next semester, I'll get off to a hot start and won't look back.

I am gonna shoot for the stars. Maybe I'll come up with the prize.

[HarvardHopeful93]

But I must say it is disappointing to hear S1 can't be discounted..admissions would at least notice the trends right? What about other T14's?

[Mr. Pancakes]

I like your attitude. Stay away from the cocaine parties at the Tri Delt outta house and you should be fine.

[Tom Joad]

You should also realize college gets harder as you go on.

[woeisme]

No, they will not overlook your first semester or calculate your GPA without it. You could still get into some really good schools with a good enough LSAT, but probably not the top 3, and even top 6 will be tough.

Most pre-law advisors are idiots with only the vaguest notion of how to apply to law school, by the way.

Why do you say that, Rink?

And you don't think a letter of addendum explaining the circumstances will help? If I got a 177 on the LSAT, or even a 178, with a 3.75 cumulative excluding S1, you don't think they'll overlook it? Especially with strong internships and extracurriculars?

I mean the GPA that they will see and consider is going to include your first semester grades. Whether they find mitigating factors or give you some leeway is hard to really say. But the general rule is that law school is a numbers game and everything else is really just a "soft factor." If you're not an under represented minority, you're probably going to have to end up with at least a 3.75 cumulative (i.e., including first semester). Yale is better than Harvard by the way.

Edit: nevermind... i'm late to the party.

[mattviphky]

Yale is better than Harvard by the way.

Yeah, this all seems like heavy gunning for a silver medal (snickers between the tears of being shut out of t14)

[bernaldiaz]

You should also realize college gets harder as you go on.

Although this kid is a dunce and has overlooked many things, this just really isn't true.

[Wart]

This isn't nearly as important as the GPA/LSAT stuff that's already been said, but you're going to need some great softs too. Get involved, start a non-profit, become the president of something, etc. Also, start building relationships with professors early.

Admittedly, I tend to be more optimistic than most TLSers, but I think it's possible. Either way, there is absolutely no downside to shooting for it.

[Tom Joad]

You should also realize college gets harder as you go on.

Although this kid is a dunce and has overlooked many things, this just really isn't true.

I guess it depends on how you like general studies. I like all sorts of stuff, so my first few years were probably a little easier than my last ones.

[Richie Tenenbaum]

Another thing to keep in mind if you are planning on finishing in 4 years and going K-JD (well actually two):
1) You will be initially applying your senior year of high school without your fall and spring grades (though you can update the schools on your grades when you get them--but spring grades will really only have an affect, if any, on waitlists). Thus, you need to recalculate the highest grade possible you can have when you first apply.

2) Harvard, at least the trend was a year or so ago, is starting to emphasis work experience between undergrad and law school much more. Consider planning a year or two of work between undergrad and law school. (Not just for Harvard, but others schools value it and I believe it makes having the right perspective in law school easier.)

[Da1andOnlyPharo]

Wow, for the most part, you guys really took it easy on him.

[Richie Tenenbaum]

Wow, for the most part, you guys really took it easy on him.

He's a freshmen in college. Gentle guidance seems more helpful than harsh warnings. Btw- still waiting on your response in the other thread (the one filled mostly with harsh warnings).

[blurbz]

But I must say it is disappointing to hear S1 can't be discounted..admissions would at least notice the trends right? What about other T14's?

No. They'll only care if you have a good reason for doing terribly in a given semester and, as others have pointed out, you do not.

Why do you believe you can get 175 on the LSAT? Is that just some sort of affirmation? Is it because you printed out 175 copies of the number 175 and pasted them on your bathroom mirror to look at every morning? Do you chew every bite of food 175 times? I had a friend who was certain she could score a 170+ on the LSAT just by telling herself she was a special snowflake...Do you know what she got? 151. Sure, she's an idiot--but she was damn surprised all of her positive affirmations and vision boards didn't make it so. Don't end up like her.

I recommend you look at the test in about 2 years and figure out what's a reasonable goal for you after a few months of studying. Until then, stop talking such a big game and start producing. You have a C+ average in college so far; You have a long way to go. (Also, get drunk a lot.)

[Tom Joad]

Didn't the 180asBreath guy get like a 168? Good score, but it would keep somebody out of the T14 unless they had a 3.7 maybe.

[bernaldiaz]

Wow, for the most part, you guys really took it easy on him.

He's a freshmen in college. Gentle guidance seems more helpful than harsh warnings. Btw- still waiting on your response in the other thread (the one filled mostly with harsh warnings).

He doesn't really need harsh warnings, just a reality check. He is a below average student at an average state school and hasn't done one thing to prove he can do what he is saying he will. Backing up a 2.5 with a 3.2 isn't too impressive. Basically he is just asking a group of strangers on the internet whether he can get 4.0's for the rest of college and get in the upper 99th percentile on a test that he hasn't prepared for. So far, he has shown neither the requisite work ethic nor intelligence to be competitive for Harvard.