Tulane v. American

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dtig
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Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:09 pm

Ok guys and gals, it's decision time. I'm considering Tulane v American. Tulane is giving me 25k, but the money doesn't matter that much- I am going into public interest law and can do the 10 year loan forgiveness route after school. I have two major considerations:

1) I want to go to a school that will give me opportunities to stand out and thrive in the law school specifically and in PI generally.
2) I want to live in a city that offers professional contacts to break into the PI field.

I think Tulane fits the first consideration better and American the second. I will say that I've always wanted to go to DC, but I think it is silly to go to law school to get there. I am currently working for a non-profit and could easily just apply to a job and get there much cheaper.

Currently my head is saying Tulane my heart American. Thoughts?

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Mr. Somebody
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby Mr. Somebody » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:32 pm

Is American giving you any money? Don't go there at sticker.

Also money is still a factor, as public interest jobs are very difficult to obtain and if you don't end up with one you'll be responsible for paying all that debt.

As it is now, I'd say Tulane. What's total COA for you there?

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:38 pm

COA at Tulane is 60k- so it's still super expensive even with the scholarship, but American is the same price and no money (which is a surprise and bummer).

That is a good point about not getting a job, but can't I just defer the loan if I am unemployed?

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Mr. Somebody
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby Mr. Somebody » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:41 pm

dtig wrote:COA at Tulane is 60k- so it's still super expensive even with the scholarship, but American is the same price and no money (which is a surprise and bummer).

That is a good point about not getting a job, but can't I just defer the loan if I am unemployed?


What do you mean American is the same price? Same price as 60K? What's your COA at American? If there's no scholarship than its 220k+.

I think 60k for Tulane is a good deal and you can probably pay that off if you end up working in shitlaw (which there's a high chance of). Are you from Louisiana or the south at least?

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:50 pm

To be exact Tulane's is 64k and American's is 70k- so a 6k difference, but that's not substantial I don't think.

I am from the south (Texas)- and as far as name recognition goes in the south, Tulane is far and above American, but I want to work- at least for a time-in DC, so American might be a better choice in that regard. BUT American, while highly ranked for PI, is the third ranked school in DC, so it might actually hurt me overall- who knows. I guess at least Tulane would be something different/interesting on an application, and NOLA has lots of PI opportunities with less competition to get my feet wet while in school. So....as I type it seems like I've made up my mind, but when I started this process American was my first choice so it's hard to let it go.

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Mr. Somebody
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby Mr. Somebody » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:52 pm

If that's total COA including cost of living, both are fairly good deals. What are your numbers are where else have you gotten in?

Otherwise, it's a tossup dependent on where you want to work.

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:59 pm

That's including cost of living.

GPA: 3.41
LSAT: 165

In at Tulane (25K), American, University of Houston (10k and in-state), and Northeastern (13K)
WL'd: Hastings, William and Mary, Washington and Lee, Emory, and George Mason
Still waiting: Georgetown, University of Maryland

I applied in Feb, so there is also a consideration of waiting until next cycle, but I am pretty set on going this year.

I have no desire at all to work in Louisiana, but Tulane has fairly decent national reach- 60% of the student body is out of state, but I think American certainly has more national reach being in DC. My goal is to work in DC straight out and eventually come back to Texas.

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AntipodeanPhil
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby AntipodeanPhil » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:11 pm

To get this out the way first: you should retake. Even a couple of points in the high-160 range make a huge difference.

Neither will give you a good chance of getting an interesting public interest job, but Tulane is better - so long as you are willing to work outside of DC.

I know a recent American grad who wanted DC public interest. She currently works at Old Navy, after spending two years applying for basically any DC PI job that would pay her more than $0. She says the same thing eveyone else here says: that with UVA, Georgetown, George Washington, and George Mason all higher ranked and with better reputations in the DC area, American grads get passed over.

Tulane is the best law school in its state, and has a good reputation throughout the South.

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:18 pm

So here's a question, I am currently building a resume that will give me a good shot of landing in DC in the next couple of years not doing law, but still in the field of public interest. If my goal is to work at a national non-profit, ideally as an attorney- but I might could be convinced otherwise, would I be better off not going to law school?

Or do I have a decent shot of starting to work in the south post school, get some experience, and then apply to DC area PIs?

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paratactical
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby paratactical » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:22 pm

You have the chance to work in the field you want and in the city you want now. Law school will only make that more difficult. If I were you, I would can the idea of law school for a while.

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AntipodeanPhil
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby AntipodeanPhil » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:28 pm

dtig wrote:So here's a question, I am currently building a resume that will give me a good shot of landing in DC in the next couple of years not doing law, but still in the field of public interest. If my goal is to work at a national non-profit, ideally as an attorney- but I might could be convinced otherwise, would I be better off not going to law school?

Or do I have a decent shot of starting to work in the south post school, get some experience, and then apply to DC area PIs?

If you can get a decent (or even semi-decent) PI job straight from UG then TAKE IT TAKE IT TAKE IT.

Going to those schools might make you less employable.

If you still want law school in a couple of years, you would have valuable work experience and time to study for a better LSAT score. There are a lot of schools at which work experience makes a significant difference. With a few more LSAT points and decent work experience you would have a great shot at the T14.

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:31 pm

paratactical wrote:You have the chance to work in the field you want and in the city you want now. Law school will only make that more difficult. If I were you, I would can the idea of law school for a while.


The only thing is, just to give a little background on my situation, that I am currently doing grassroots/public affairs work and have been for 2 years now (I'm already not going straight through). It's a section in the field that I want to be in, but it's limiting work. It's mostly running around like a chicken with your head cut off organizing people. It's not what I want to do for the rest of my life. I think law is an opportunity for me to stay in my field but change jobs.

Unfortunately, you are right, getting into law is much harder, but I've thus far had really good luck at breaking into the field where others haven't, so I'm crossing my fingers that my luck doesn't run out--or at least thats what I think I'm going to do.

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:33 pm

AntipodeanPhil wrote:
dtig wrote:So here's a question, I am currently building a resume that will give me a good shot of landing in DC in the next couple of years not doing law, but still in the field of public interest. If my goal is to work at a national non-profit, ideally as an attorney- but I might could be convinced otherwise, would I be better off not going to law school?

Or do I have a decent shot of starting to work in the south post school, get some experience, and then apply to DC area PIs?

If you can get a decent (or even semi-decent) PI job straight from UG then TAKE IT TAKE IT TAKE IT.

Going to those schools might make you less employable.

If you still want law school in a couple of years, you would have valuable work experience and time to study for a better LSAT score. There are a lot of schools at which work experience makes a significant difference. With a few more LSAT points and decent work experience you would have a great shot at the T14.


You really think that a couple of more lsat points will land me in the t14 even with my GPA?

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paratactical
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby paratactical » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:37 pm

You are making a mistake. You are extremely unlikely to end up as an attorney at a national PI in DC from either of these schools. Have you done any research into what it takes to be an attorney at a nationally recognized PI group?

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:43 pm

I have. It's highly competitive, but what I've seen is that they mostly are concerned about experience. While I wont get it right out of school, five years after school what I'm getting is that your school doesn't really matter.

I currently work for an affiliate of a national, very high profile non-profit, and I know that all the lawyers that work for us are not t14 graduates. So far what I've experienced working 2 years in the field is that PIs care about what you've done more than your pedigree.

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paratactical
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby paratactical » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:47 pm

I don't disagree but how will you find your first job out of law school to help with that "what you've done" bit?

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:53 pm

I mean, isn't that everyone's question regardless of if you are graduating from law school? I don't know, I am flying under the assumption that the formula I applied in undergraduate- getting involved building a resume and getting meaningful experience when I don't need to get paid will help me get a job after law school as well. Do you think that it's a different situation post law school then post UG

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AntipodeanPhil
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby AntipodeanPhil » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:57 pm

dtig wrote:You really think that a couple of more lsat points will land me in the t14 even with my GPA?

Well, if you can get up around 170/171 you would stand a very good chance at Northwestern with work experience. You could apply ED to other schools - Georgetown and UVA, in particular - and there is a chance that a school like Cornell might bite. I think you would have a great shot at getting one of those schools

170 might sound difficult, but you would have a lot of time to study. If you are missing any points on the LG section, you haven't studied enough.

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:03 pm

AntipodeanPhil wrote:
dtig wrote:You really think that a couple of more lsat points will land me in the t14 even with my GPA?

Well, if you can get up around 170/171 you would stand a very good chance at Northwestern with work experience. You could apply ED to other schools - Georgetown and UVA, in particular - and there is a chance that a school like Cornell might bite. I think you would have a great shot at getting one of those schools

170 might sound difficult, but you would have a lot of time to study. If you are missing any points on the LG section, you haven't studied enough.


In fact I missed like 9 points on LG....sigh-taking the lsat again sounds horrible, but getting into georgetown would be awesome. Food for thought- thanks!

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ColtsFan88
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby ColtsFan88 » Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:03 pm

dtig wrote:
AntipodeanPhil wrote:
dtig wrote:So here's a question, I am currently building a resume that will give me a good shot of landing in DC in the next couple of years not doing law, but still in the field of public interest. If my goal is to work at a national non-profit, ideally as an attorney- but I might could be convinced otherwise, would I be better off not going to law school?

Or do I have a decent shot of starting to work in the south post school, get some experience, and then apply to DC area PIs?

If you can get a decent (or even semi-decent) PI job straight from UG then TAKE IT TAKE IT TAKE IT.

Going to those schools might make you less employable.

If you still want law school in a couple of years, you would have valuable work experience and time to study for a better LSAT score. There are a lot of schools at which work experience makes a significant difference. With a few more LSAT points and decent work experience you would have a great shot at the T14.


You really think that a couple of more lsat points will land me in the t14 even with my GPA?


I had a 3.1 and snagged Gtown. Definitely doable.

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:05 pm

ColtsFan88 wrote:
dtig wrote:
AntipodeanPhil wrote:
dtig wrote:So here's a question, I am currently building a resume that will give me a good shot of landing in DC in the next couple of years not doing law, but still in the field of public interest. If my goal is to work at a national non-profit, ideally as an attorney- but I might could be convinced otherwise, would I be better off not going to law school?

Or do I have a decent shot of starting to work in the south post school, get some experience, and then apply to DC area PIs?

If you can get a decent (or even semi-decent) PI job straight from UG then TAKE IT TAKE IT TAKE IT.

Going to those schools might make you less employable.

If you still want law school in a couple of years, you would have valuable work experience and time to study for a better LSAT score. There are a lot of schools at which work experience makes a significant difference. With a few more LSAT points and decent work experience you would have a great shot at the T14.


You really think that a couple of more lsat points will land me in the t14 even with my GPA?


I had a 3.1 and snagged Gtown. Definitely doable.


What was your lsat? and do you like it?

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AntipodeanPhil
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby AntipodeanPhil » Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:06 pm

dtig wrote:Do you think that it's a different situation post law school then post UG

Post DC law school, you are graduating with many hundreds of people with the same qualifications and background as you (JD, some PI experience) all looking for PI work in DC, but some of them went to much better law schools. Post UG in Texas, you are graduating with a relatively small number of people in the same situation as you, and the ranking of your school is much less important than the other aspects of your CV.

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AntipodeanPhil
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby AntipodeanPhil » Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:11 pm

dtig wrote:In fact I missed like 9 points on LG....sigh-taking the lsat again sounds horrible, but getting into georgetown would be awesome. Food for thought- thanks!

RETAKE RETAKE RETAKE. I'm sorry for chat-shouting but this is such a big deal. Even after learning how to diagram and practicing, I was awful at logic games, missing over half. It took me 3 months of full-time study (literally), but at the end I was getting perfect scores. If I can get a perfect LG score, you can.

dtig
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby dtig » Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:12 pm

AntipodeanPhil wrote:
dtig wrote:Do you think that it's a different situation post law school then post UG

Post DC law school, you are graduating with many hundreds of people with the same qualifications and background as you (JD, some PI experience) all looking for PI work in DC, but some of them went to much better law schools. Post UG in Texas, you are graduating with a relatively small number of people in the same situation as you, and the ranking of your school is much less important than the other aspects of your CV.


What about post law school at Tulane? Do you think it's a decent decision to go to Tulane break into PI in the south and then move to DC? Or even trying to go to DC from NOLA right after school? My thought is that being in New Orleans, maybe with some post Katrina work experience or other pro-bono PI in NOLA might make my resume more intriguing then a cookie cutter DC school would regardless of ranking. What do you think?

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ColtsFan88
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Re: Tulane v. American

Postby ColtsFan88 » Fri Mar 30, 2012 3:42 pm

ColtsFan88 wrote:
dtig wrote:
AntipodeanPhil wrote:
dtig wrote:So here's a question, I am currently building a resume that will give me a good shot of landing in DC in the next couple of years not doing law, but still in the field of public interest. If my goal is to work at a national non-profit, ideally as an attorney- but I might could be convinced otherwise, would I be better off not going to law school?

Or do I have a decent shot of starting to work in the south post school, get some experience, and then apply to DC area PIs?

If you can get a decent (or even semi-decent) PI job straight from UG then TAKE IT TAKE IT TAKE IT.

Going to those schools might make you less employable.

If you still want law school in a couple of years, you would have valuable work experience and time to study for a better LSAT score. There are a lot of schools at which work experience makes a significant difference. With a few more LSAT points and decent work experience you would have a great shot at the T14.


You really think that a couple of more lsat points will land me in the t14 even with my GPA?


I had a 3.1 and snagged Gtown. Definitely doable.


What was your lsat? and do you like it?

----------------------------------------------------

177, and I haven't attended yet. I just went to the ASW though and really liked it, so ill likely attend.




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