Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

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jdwillas
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Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby jdwillas » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:28 pm

College dropout looking to return and pursue law path.

I'm passionate about politics and learning how the legal system would function in an anarcho-capitalist society. I will return to the U.S. in 2015 after my wife has finished her medical residency here in France, at which point I plan to enter law school.

Before I apply to law school, I have to get my Bachelor's of course. Since I live in France, my options are limited to online American degree programs. There are number of decent brick and mortar institutions offering bachelor courses online in poli-sci, business, english, etc. I'd like to do the dirty part as quickly and cheaply as possible, but at the same time I don't want to hurt my chances at a top 14 school by submitting a weak degree.

Can anyone offer me a full rundown of what you would do in my position? Don't worry about the bachelor's and just focus on nailing the LSAT? Any recommendations for cheap, accelerated online degree programs from respectable brick and mortar colleges?
Last edited by jdwillas on Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:50 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:32 pm

jdwillas wrote:These days, I'm passionate about politics and learning how the legal system would function in an anarcho-capitalist society


Law school wont help you in this pursuit. Why do you want to go to law school and what legal job do you want after school?

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Mr. Pancakes
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Mr. Pancakes » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:33 pm

tagging.

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gaud
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby gaud » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:34 pm

Mr. Pancakes wrote:tagging.


oh yes

jdwillas
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby jdwillas » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:43 pm

I'm a member of the Libertarian Free State Project, which is a movement to create a strong Libertarian presence in the state of NH. I have committed to living in NH and would like to offer legal services to the community as well as a qualified legal expert's perspective on issues addressed by Libertarian think tanks such as Cato Institute. In short, the legal system is a key aspect of the anarcho-capitalist society and I would like to help develop that. So, it's more of an academic motivation as opposed to practice.
Last edited by jdwillas on Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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dproduct
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby dproduct » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:44 pm

Mr. Pancakes wrote:tagging.


This is going to be good.

rad lulz
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby rad lulz » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:45 pm

.
Last edited by rad lulz on Sun Apr 21, 2013 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JoeMo
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby JoeMo » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:47 pm

dproduct wrote:
Mr. Pancakes wrote:tagging.


This is going to be good.


credited

jdwillas
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby jdwillas » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:48 pm

Like every other law student out there, yes.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:49 pm

jdwillas wrote:I'm a member of the Libertarian Free State Project, which is a movement to create a strong Libertarian presence in the state of NH. I have committed to living in NH and would like to offer legal services to the community as well as a qualified legal expert's perspective on issues addressed by Libertarian think tanks such as Cato Institute. In short, the legal system is a key aspect of the anarcho-capitalist society and I would like to help develop that. So, it's more of an academic motivation as opposed to practice.


A PhD in political science might be better in terms of content as well as cheaper (they pay you to attend instead of vice-versa). If your career goals involve doing pro bono community work and trying to work for a think tank, I would make sure you go to law school on a full ride.

In light of your post law school motivations, why are you T-14 or bust? Vanity?

lsatcrazy
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby lsatcrazy » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:51 pm

epistemizer, is that you?

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Mr. Pancakes
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Mr. Pancakes » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:52 pm

how much college do you have left? What is your GPA so far? How will you fund law school? How much school debt do you have right now? If you went into the 2013 cycle, which isn't likely, you would be getting out of law school around 33. You could probably spend the next five years doing other things that would put you in a better position to do what you want to do.
Also, I wouldn't assume that you would be getting a 170+, just because you think you have a high IQ doesn't mean you are promised a high LSAT score.

jdwillas
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby jdwillas » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:56 pm

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
jdwillas wrote:I'm a member of the Libertarian Free State Project, which is a movement to create a strong Libertarian presence in the state of NH. I have committed to living in NH and would like to offer legal services to the community as well as a qualified legal expert's perspective on issues addressed by Libertarian think tanks such as Cato Institute. In short, the legal system is a key aspect of the anarcho-capitalist society and I would like to help develop that. So, it's more of an academic motivation as opposed to practice.


A PhD in political science might be better in terms of content as well as cheaper (they pay you to attend instead of vice-versa). If your career goals involve doing pro bono community work and trying to work for a think tank, I would make sure you go to law school on a full ride.

In light of your post law school motivations, why are you T-14 or bust? Vanity?


I would like posters to consider my dilemma as if getting into a top 14 were my only option, because those are the types of responses I'd be more interested in receiving.

jdwillas
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby jdwillas » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:57 pm

This is a tough crowd. I modified my original post to be less "friendly."
Last edited by jdwillas on Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

goodthings
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby goodthings » Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:58 pm

...
Last edited by goodthings on Sat Apr 05, 2014 1:54 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:00 pm

jdwillas wrote:
Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
jdwillas wrote:I'm a member of the Libertarian Free State Project, which is a movement to create a strong Libertarian presence in the state of NH. I have committed to living in NH and would like to offer legal services to the community as well as a qualified legal expert's perspective on issues addressed by Libertarian think tanks such as Cato Institute. In short, the legal system is a key aspect of the anarcho-capitalist society and I would like to help develop that. So, it's more of an academic motivation as opposed to practice.


A PhD in political science might be better in terms of content as well as cheaper (they pay you to attend instead of vice-versa). If your career goals involve doing pro bono community work and trying to work for a think tank, I would make sure you go to law school on a full ride.

In light of your post law school motivations, why are you T-14 or bust? Vanity?


I would like posters to consider my dilemma as if getting into a top 14 were my only option, because those are the types of responses I'd be more interested in receiving.


Well my advice for your "dilemma" would be to limit debt and target schools with faculty who might take you under their wing. Example: Going to George Mason on a full ride compared to paying sticker at Northwestern makes much more sense for your career goals.

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bk1
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby bk1 » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:00 pm

jdwillas wrote:I would like posters to consider my dilemma as if getting into a top 14 were my only option, because those are the types of responses I'd be more interested in receiving.


Why is a T14 your only option? You implied by your response to Rad that you would have to take out loans to make it happen:

1. NH Legal Aid - Don't need a T14 degree to do this and I'm not sure how much it would help. You'd be forced to use LRAP to pay back your debt since your salary will be abysmal, and it would likely dovetail with IBR (also not sure how okay you are with taking a handout from the government in the form of IBR). Seems like going to some school on the cheap would be a better idea but I don't know much about legal services for the poor type hiring.

2. Cato Institute Legal Expert Genius Wunderkind- Going to a T14 isn't going to make you a legal expert so I'm not sure how this helps you either. If you're bad at the laws then I you're going to be useless to them.

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danielhay11
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby danielhay11 » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:01 pm

I don't know much anything about anachro-capitalist societies, but I doubt they require attorneys to have graduated from accredited schools of law. So if your live-free-or-freer movement works, just read some books and your should be set.

If you want to pursue this topic as an intellectual exercise, it's a free country (or, at least I think it is). But you should pursue it in a way that doesn't require taking out a mortgage. Read some books. Watch online lectures. Audit relevant classes. Law school is not the place to ponder the metaphysical underpinnings of the legal system.

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Samara
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Samara » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:02 pm

jdwillas wrote:
Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
jdwillas wrote:I'm a member of the Libertarian Free State Project, which is a movement to create a strong Libertarian presence in the state of NH. I have committed to living in NH and would like to offer legal services to the community as well as a qualified legal expert's perspective on issues addressed by Libertarian think tanks such as Cato Institute. In short, the legal system is a key aspect of the anarcho-capitalist society and I would like to help develop that. So, it's more of an academic motivation as opposed to practice.


A PhD in political science might be better in terms of content as well as cheaper (they pay you to attend instead of vice-versa). If your career goals involve doing pro bono community work and trying to work for a think tank, I would make sure you go to law school on a full ride.

In light of your post law school motivations, why are you T-14 or bust? Vanity?


I would like posters to consider my dilemma as if getting into a top 14 were my only option, because those are the types of responses I'd be more interested in receiving.

Oh, so you don't actually want advice.

Get your GPA as high as you can, get your LSAT as high as you can. That's all the advice you're going to get within your parameters.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:04 pm

goodthings wrote:Doesn't Cato offer a qualified legal perspective on issues addressed by think tanks like Cato? They even publish their own Supreme Court Review. Not sure there's a need you're filling here.


CATO and other think tanks hire lawyers, but my understanding is they hire top applicants. While I haven't browsed the profiles for the lawyers they have on staff, I would think their credentials would be oozing with prestige and these positions should not be the intended goal of law school, even if you get into a T14 school, since they're hard to land. I could be completely wrong on this though.

jdwillas
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby jdwillas » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:05 pm

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
jdwillas wrote:
Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
jdwillas wrote:I'm a member of the Libertarian Free State Project, which is a movement to create a strong Libertarian presence in the state of NH. I have committed to living in NH and would like to offer legal services to the community as well as a qualified legal expert's perspective on issues addressed by Libertarian think tanks such as Cato Institute. In short, the legal system is a key aspect of the anarcho-capitalist society and I would like to help develop that. So, it's more of an academic motivation as opposed to practice.


A PhD in political science might be better in terms of content as well as cheaper (they pay you to attend instead of vice-versa). If your career goals involve doing pro bono community work and trying to work for a think tank, I would make sure you go to law school on a full ride.

In light of your post law school motivations, why are you T-14 or bust? Vanity?


I would like posters to consider my dilemma as if getting into a top 14 were my only option, because those are the types of responses I'd be more interested in receiving.


Well my advice for your "dilemma" would be to limit debt and target schools with faculty who might take you under their wing. Example: Going to George Mason on a full ride compared to paying sticker at Northwestern makes much more sense for your career goals.


That's good advice, thank you.

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Mr. Pancakes
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Mr. Pancakes » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:05 pm

if you have to go to law school then you need to get a degree in something that will get you the highest GPA possible. It doesn't matter what.
You also need to focus on getting your LSAT as high as you can.
Do these, but decide if this is a good idea first.

edit: scooped by samara, but yea, that's the credited response.

goodthings
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby goodthings » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:08 pm

...
Last edited by goodthings on Sat Apr 05, 2014 1:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.

FloridaCoastalorbust
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby FloridaCoastalorbust » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:23 pm

As a friend to several lawyer and nonlawyer employees working in Cato and other free-market based civil lit firms (Institute for Justice, Pacific Legal) and having interned/clerked in the "liberty industry", an internship with Cato/IJ/PacLegal would be more valuable than a t6 degree. They care much more about your commitment to the field than the prestige of the JD. For example, the founder of IJ got his degree from Denver and several senior attorneys got TT degrees.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Top 14 or Bust: quickest, most effective route

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:26 pm

Yeah, I don't have too much knowledge about think tank work. I will step aside for those that do.




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