Distinctions between T-14 cultures

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bobbyh1919
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Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby bobbyh1919 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:06 pm

Not exactly sure how to phrase this question, but I'm just trying to get a sense of what each T-14 school is really known for (whether it be a pro or a con of attending the school). For example, it seems like Northwestern prides itself on professionalism based on their strong preference for work experience. Surely that influences the culture there. So basically,

What schools are the most laid back? The most intense? Which are known for being more social? Where is the standard of life highest/lowest ?(although obviously this will vary from person to person)

Getting more jobs focused, which have endured this economy better? Which ones are currently struggling more than usual? Which place surprisingly well/poorly in academia, clerkships, public interests, etc.?

Lots of questions, feel free to just answer any part. Thanks!

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emkay625
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby emkay625 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:19 pm

As a person who isn't a law student, I have no clue. I have visited 1 top-14 school - Northwestern. My impression was that people were very friendly but also very professional. I felt a little intimidated. I also felt YOUNG, and I am 3 1/2 years out of undergrad at this point. (I'm 24). I'm not sure if I'd feel that way everywhere.

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bk1
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby bk1 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:36 pm

There's a million different threads on this. Learn to use the search function. But since I'm bored I'll answer:

The difference between the T14's in their student body is fairly minimal. Even though NU is viewed as older and more laid back compared to UChi which is seen as all about the rigor, the reality is that these schools, like all of the T14, are mainly filled with similar people. All of the T14 are filled with people who scored in the 99th percentile on the LSAT or got a 3.8+ in undergrad and decided to go to law school. In general, law students are miserable human beings who you really wouldn't want to be around anyways.

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bk1
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby bk1 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:42 pm

emkay625 wrote:As a person who isn't a law student, I have no clue. I have visited 1 top-14 school - Northwestern. My impression was that people were very friendly but also very professional. I felt a little intimidated. I also felt YOUNG, and I am 3 1/2 years out of undergrad at this point. (I'm 24). I'm not sure if I'd feel that way everywhere.


I'm younger than you and don't feel this way at NU. Having been a 0L once, I think it's easy for 0L's to be intimidated by law students but there really is no basis for it since law students are only removed from 0L's by a single year. I also think that it is natural for people to talk up their accomplishments when talking to strangers so that when you speak to other law students their background sounds more impressive than it might otherwise be.

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Grizz
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby Grizz » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:45 pm

bk1 wrote: In general, law students are miserable human beings who you really wouldn't want to be around anyways.

Credited. I wouldn't want to be around me.

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beachbum
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby beachbum » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:46 pm

bk1 wrote:There's a million different threads on this. Learn to use the search function. But since I'm bored I'll answer:

The difference between the T14's in their student body is fairly minimal. Even though NU is viewed as older and more laid back compared to UChi which is seen as all about the rigor, the reality is that these schools, like all of the T14, are mainly filled with similar people. All of the T14 are filled with people who scored in the 99th percentile on the LSAT or got a 3.8+ in undergrad and decided to go to law school. In general, law students are miserable human beings who you really wouldn't want to be around anyways.


Yessir

09042014
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby 09042014 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:47 pm

Northwestern is more professional in the sense that most of us know how to communicate with professors, employers, etc etc. That doesn't mean we sit around handing each other business cards. There are probably more people in serious relations/ marriages than other schools. Our school is older, it's just not that much older. The vast majority are 24-30, with the plurality being about 25.

Most people are old enough that they don't act like college kids, but young enough so that they are still mid twenties and are looking to have fun. It's got a very young urban dweller feeling, because we are in a big city. There aren't strong cliques that form, and people seem generally willing to hang out with everyone else. Social life is more bar based than large party based. Though pre bar parties are really common.

The lack of the kindergarten through JD students means there are less gunner DBags. People tend to view schools as a means to an end, not the end themselves.

My section was the opposite of competitive. One of my friends claims her section was competitive, but who knows. Generally, it's pretty laid back, people share outlines, notes, etc etc.

Also, I think there is great difference class to class culture wise. And absent significant reasons (Northwestern tending old, UChi tending rigor!) there probably isn't much you can do to tell how your class will be.

bobbyh1919
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby bobbyh1919 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:53 pm

Thanks for the responses guys. I've found it interesting that so many of the T-14 school profiles on this site talk about how non-competitive the school is. Is this just a talking point to encourage people to come, or are there some schools that really emphasize this, and how? I know that UVA doesn't do rankings, which I imagine eases the tension. Can anyone speak more to this?

shoeshine
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby shoeshine » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:54 pm

Not many of the T14 law schools have personalities that specifically stand out but here is what I have heard from people around my T14.

Yale - academics and general geniuses
NU - lots of formers professionals and TLS regulars
Chicago - All gunners, all the time
NYU - Split between public interest liberals and future 1%ers
Berkeley - liberals who are laid back
Duke - dedicated academics that drink a ton

Not sure if any of that is true but those are the reputations I have heard about.
Last edited by shoeshine on Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bk1
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby bk1 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:55 pm

Desert Fox wrote:Also, I think there is great difference class to class culture wise. And absent significant reasons (Northwestern tending old, UChi tending rigor!) there probably isn't much you can do to tell how your class will be.


This cannot be stressed enough. NU class of 2013 is as DF described but NU class of 2014 is definitely less laid back and more gunnerish.

bobbyh1919
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby bobbyh1919 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:56 pm

shoeshine wrote:Not many of the T14 law schools have personalities that specifically stand out but here is what I have heard from people around my T14.

Yale - academics and general geniuses
NU - lots of formers professionals and TLS regulars
Chicago - All gunners, all the time
NYU - Split between public interest liberals and future 1%ers
Berkeley - liberals who are laid back
Duke - dedicated academics that drink a ton

Not sure if any of that is true but those are the reputations I have heard about.


Hmm interesting, this is roughly what I had in mind when I created the thread so thanks for posting.

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hyakku
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby hyakku » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:58 pm

Desert Fox wrote:Northwestern is more professional in the sense that most of us know how to communicate with professors, employers, etc etc. That doesn't mean we sit around handing each other business cards. There are probably more people in serious relations/ marriages than other schools. Our school is older, it's just not that much older. The vast majority are 24-30, with the plurality being about 25.

Most people are old enough that they don't act like college kids, but young enough so that they are still mid twenties and are looking to have fun. It's got a very young urban dweller feeling, because we are in a big city. There aren't strong cliques that form, and people seem generally willing to hang out with everyone else. Social life is more bar based than large party based. Though pre bar parties are really common.

The lack of the kindergarten through JD students means there are less gunner DBags. People tend to view schools as a means to an end, not the end themselves.

My section was the opposite of competitive. One of my friends claims her section was competitive, but who knows. Generally, it's pretty laid back, people share outlines, notes, etc etc.

Also, I think there is great difference class to class culture wise. And absent significant reasons (Northwestern tending old, UChi tending rigor!) there probably isn't much you can do to tell how your class will be.


Thanks for the post fox and shoehine. It's funny because people keep telling people to search, but over the past few weeks I've searched for various threads pertaining to things like social life, personality of the student body, etc. Every thread I find, has someone telling someone to fucking search. I went back a couple of years until I just decided to say screw it and just read posts from the students who go to school there in the Law Student section. Normally I'm one of those search guys too, but this particular subject pertaining to quality of life / social life is like a paradox.

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AreJay711
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby AreJay711 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:00 pm

bk1 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:Also, I think there is great difference class to class culture wise. And absent significant reasons (Northwestern tending old, UChi tending rigor!) there probably isn't much you can do to tell how your class will be.


This cannot be stressed enough. NU class of 2013 is as DF described but NU class of 2014 is definitely less laid back and more gunnerish.


I wonder if that is just a temporary thing though. My section was super gunner mode first semester and second semester was pretty chill.

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby crumpetsandtea » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:04 pm

bk1 wrote:
emkay625 wrote:As a person who isn't a law student, I have no clue. I have visited 1 top-14 school - Northwestern. My impression was that people were very friendly but also very professional. I felt a little intimidated. I also felt YOUNG, and I am 3 1/2 years out of undergrad at this point. (I'm 24). I'm not sure if I'd feel that way everywhere.

I'm younger than you and don't feel this way at NU.

+1. My experiences with NU and the students from NU have all felt as though they were my peers, or at the most maybe upperclassmen to my freshman/sophomore (if that makes sense).

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emkay625
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby emkay625 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:12 pm

crumpetsandtea wrote:
bk1 wrote:
emkay625 wrote:As a person who isn't a law student, I have no clue. I have visited 1 top-14 school - Northwestern. My impression was that people were very friendly but also very professional. I felt a little intimidated. I also felt YOUNG, and I am 3 1/2 years out of undergrad at this point. (I'm 24). I'm not sure if I'd feel that way everywhere.

I'm younger than you and don't feel this way at NU.

+1. My experiences with NU and the students from NU have all felt as though they were my peers, or at the most maybe upperclassmen to my freshman/sophomore (if that makes sense).


Cool. I also am not sure if everyone I saw that day was a student. There were a TON of people who appeared to be 30-ish mulling around in the commons/mall area and a buffet was set up, so I'm wondering if there was some kind of special event going on with people who weren't students.

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JDizzle2015
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby JDizzle2015 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:19 pm

shoeshine wrote:Not many of the T14 law schools have personalities that specifically stand out but here is what I have heard from people around my T14.

Yale - academics and general geniuses
NU - lots of formers professionals and TLS regulars
Chicago - All gunners, all the time
NYU - Split between public interest liberals and future 1%ers
Berkeley - liberals who are laid back
Duke - dedicated academics that drink a ton

Not sure if any of that is true but those are the reputations I have heard about.


Harvard - All types, all smart.
Stanford - I've only had contact with alums (all in the entertainment industry or tax law). The ones I've met were pretty average people, imo... I wouldn't have pegged them to be "HYS" if I didn't know they went to S.
Columbia - See NYU.
Mich - Wildcards? I'm most likely attending next year so I'm biased but the people there seem like they're from extremely diverse backgrounds and don't seem to be "biglaw or bust"-types like many other T14 students.
Penn - Don't know anything about Penn other than it's a good/great? Ivy and NYC firms seems to really like their alums. A partner at Wachtell I know seems to love Penn kids. Paul Hastings (for those interested in "international law") also seems to really like Penn alum.
UVA - Government types? They probably ED'd to UVA.
NU - I loved the atmosphere when I visited. Professional vibe. I sat in on a Civ Pro class where the professor said people can take the midterm whenever they felt ready during midterm week--you were on your own schedule. I had never heard of anything like that before. 1Ls were really friendly (even around midterm time) to the point where the person I sat next to while I was visiting actually bought me lunch afterwards to talk about how awesome NU is/how they loved it there.
Cornell - Totally a different feeling compared to NU. I felt that the students were more "gunnerish"/loved library nooks more than the students at other schools I've visited (NU/Vandy/Boalt/BU/BC/USC/UCLA). I felt like the administration also treats students like children (during the tour, our tour guide said that they purposely block internet in their classrooms to avoid people being distracted ie going on facebook). The tour guide said "it wasn't an issue because I can just walk outside the doorway with my laptop to send an email and then return to class". I felt meh about it (full disclosure, I got deferred a couple days ago from Cornell).
Georgetown - ???

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Gecko of Doom
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby Gecko of Doom » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:28 pm

JDizzle2015 wrote:UVA - Government types? They probably ED'd to UVA.

We actually have relatively few of those. I think that's more Georgetown's thing.

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JDizzle2015
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby JDizzle2015 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:32 pm

Gecko of Doom wrote:
JDizzle2015 wrote:UVA - Government types? They probably ED'd to UVA.

We actually have relatively few of those. I think that's more Georgetown's thing.

Yea, I wasn't sure how accurate "government types" was either. I don't have any insight into UVA's culture except that the president of our college republican's group at my UG is now at UVA. He's likely not the "norm"/there might not be a "norm" at UVA.

ETA: For Stanford... when I said average I don't mean they're not brilliant--just that with social interaction alone, I wouldn't have been able to tell that studying/law/some type of academia is what the person is all about.

My experience with YLS students, on the other hand, was different. We went to support a friend of ours for the Miss USA pageant and these guys were so stoked on the fact that they were on their way to become senators and that these would be the only types of women they were going to date from now on. It's totally possible that my Yalie friends are just oddballs but, socially, they were just banking on YLS to change their lives (which it most likely will).

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hyakku
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby hyakku » Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:51 pm

Nice, thanks for the posts dizzle. I know they aren't telling or representative as a whole, but for those of us that can't afford to visit schools getting opinions like this is a small alternative to have.

I seem to see the sentiment about Mich students a lot throughout the board. I'm kind of disappointed I didn't apply to Penn., after so many people told me to look into while I was looking at Mich it really does seem like a solid school, and over the past few days people I've read many instances in which people praise their alum and the school in general. A bit late for that now though.

I'm also interested in Georgetown. I'm sure there are alot of the big government types, but I feel like that's the common thing said about students from there just because of it's location. Been making my way through the ask a student threads but haven't gotten through G Towns yet.

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JDizzle2015
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby JDizzle2015 » Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:11 am

hyakku wrote:I know they aren't telling or representative as a whole, but for those of us that can't afford to visit schools getting opinions like this is a small alternative to have.

Np. You're absolutely right, my experiences are purely anecdotal and most likely aren't representative of each school as a whole. Current students, like Gecko, are in a far better position than I am to accurately access the culture of a law school. All in all, I'm sure most top law schools do their best to fill their respective classes with a well rounded group of people.

Why not submit a late app to Penn? I think they were pretty generous with fee waivers... you might email and ask for one if you haven't gotten one already.

09042014
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby 09042014 » Wed Dec 21, 2011 5:39 am

bk1 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:Also, I think there is great difference class to class culture wise. And absent significant reasons (Northwestern tending old, UChi tending rigor!) there probably isn't much you can do to tell how your class will be.


This cannot be stressed enough. NU class of 2013 is as DF described but NU class of 2014 is definitely less laid back and more gunnerish.


You fuckers gunned a pie eating contest. It was sad.

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Holly Golightly
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby Holly Golightly » Thu Dec 22, 2011 5:35 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
bk1 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:Also, I think there is great difference class to class culture wise. And absent significant reasons (Northwestern tending old, UChi tending rigor!) there probably isn't much you can do to tell how your class will be.


This cannot be stressed enough. NU class of 2013 is as DF described but NU class of 2014 is definitely less laid back and more gunnerish.


You fuckers gunned a pie eating contest. It was sad.

This. I am disappoint with your class.

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bk1
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby bk1 » Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:09 pm

Holly Golightly wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:You fuckers gunned a pie eating contest. It was sad.

This. I am disappoint with your class.


*Vainly tries to dissociate himself from his class.*

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rinkrat19
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby rinkrat19 » Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:20 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
bk1 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:Also, I think there is great difference class to class culture wise. And absent significant reasons (Northwestern tending old, UChi tending rigor!) there probably isn't much you can do to tell how your class will be.


This cannot be stressed enough. NU class of 2013 is as DF described but NU class of 2014 is definitely less laid back and more gunnerish.


You fuckers gunned a pie eating contest. It was sad.
Did they hire Kobayashi or something? How does one gun a pie-eating contest?

Transferthrowaway
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Re: Distinctions between T-14 cultures

Postby Transferthrowaway » Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:25 pm

At least when NU offers pie, students aren't neurotic enough to request more logistical information in such numbers that it requires a follow-up e-mail.

/Your cross-town neighbors

EDIT: Typo
Last edited by Transferthrowaway on Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.




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