The Law School Scam

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Larry David
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Larry David » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:52 pm

MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:
Medmal Cap was just struck down by Georgia supreme court if anyone cares


On the flipside, states like TX and MS have capped PI damages to around 500k, last I heard.
'

Yea a lot are going to state supreme for decision as to whether it violates right to trial

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MTal
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby MTal » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:52 pm

Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?


If they're going into significant debt, the smart ones drop out.

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Larry David
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Larry David » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:53 pm

MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?


If they're going into significant debt, the smart ones drop out.


You think that people who drop out of 3L year are intelligent?

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whuts4lunch
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby whuts4lunch » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:54 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:Yes. Yes, they will. Mainly because they're not going to think you'd be a valuable asset to the firm if your grades suck.

Obviously they're not going to say "oops you're 1 slot below 50%, so no dice" in most cases, but like it or not, firms care about grades.


Crazy. It just seems odd to me that a firm would think the ability to spot a bunch of issues in a short period of time matters a whole lot. I get it as a litmus test, but once they've already spent time/effort evaluating you, it seems like that evaluation should be what matters most, maybe with grades as a tie-breaker. But, it is what it is.

HeavenWood
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby HeavenWood » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:54 pm

Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?

What else can we do? I thought I cheated the system by reverse-splitting and still sneaking into a lower T14. Now I wish I had at least tried retaking and doing better. I wonder if it would have been easier to end up top 10% at Temple or Villanova. Competition isn't quite as fierce there, and my LSAT would be above their 75th %iles. Obviously I'm jumping the gun here... it's just such a stressful time. :|
Last edited by HeavenWood on Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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whuts4lunch
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby whuts4lunch » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:55 pm

Larry David wrote:
MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:
Medmal Cap was just struck down by Georgia supreme court if anyone cares


On the flipside, states like TX and MS have capped PI damages to around 500k, last I heard.
'

Yea a lot are going to state supreme for decision as to whether it violates right to trial


Good thing I go to school in GA!

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Larry David
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Larry David » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:55 pm

MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?


If they're going into significant debt, the smart ones drop out.


Also you think the only legal jobs are the ones people get at OCI. I am asking this question directly as it pertains to southern schools in large markets where the NALP only list 10 firms?

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whuts4lunch
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby whuts4lunch » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:56 pm

HeavenWood wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?

What else can we do? I thought I cheated the system by reverse-splitting and still sneaking into a lower T14. Now I wish I had at least tried retaking and doing better. I wonder if it would have been easier to end up top 10% at Temple or Villanova. Competition isn't quite as fierce there, and my LSAT would be above their 75th %iles. Obviously I'm jumping the gun here... it's just such a stressful time. :|


Not sure I understand. Do you mean by retaking you would have increased your reasoning abilities to that of your peers? Why would retaking and doing better have helped you if you feel outmatched as it is?

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Veyron
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Veyron » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:57 pm

-
Last edited by Veyron on Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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MTal
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby MTal » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:58 pm

Larry David wrote:
MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?


If they're going into significant debt, the smart ones drop out.


Also you think the only legal jobs are the ones people get at OCI. I am asking this question directly as it pertains to southern schools in large markets where the NALP only list 10 firms?


Obviously not, but the jobs that will let grads pay off their massive 6 figure loans, will come through OCI, yes.

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Grizz
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Grizz » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:58 pm

Larry David wrote:
MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?


If they're going into significant debt, the smart ones drop out.


Also you think the only legal jobs are the ones people get at OCI. I am asking this question directly as it pertains to southern schools in large markets where the NALP only list 10 firms?

Sometimes it means there is minimal 2L hiring. FL probably has a hundred or so 2L SA spots.

HeavenWood
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby HeavenWood » Wed Nov 16, 2011 4:58 pm

whuts4lunch wrote:
HeavenWood wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?

What else can we do? I thought I cheated the system by reverse-splitting and still sneaking into a lower T14. Now I wish I had at least tried retaking and doing better. I wonder if it would have been easier to end up top 10% at Temple or Villanova. Competition isn't quite as fierce there, and my LSAT would be above their 75th %iles. Obviously I'm jumping the gun here... it's just such a stressful time. :|


Not sure I understand. Do you mean by retaking you would have increased your reasoning abilities to that of your peers? Why would retaking and doing better have helped you if you feel outmatched as it is?

I mean if I had scored higher, I could have gotten a scholarship and thereby mitigated some of the risk. Sticker sucks.

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MTal
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby MTal » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:00 pm

HeavenWood wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?

What else can we do? I thought I cheated the system by reverse-splitting and still sneaking into a lower T14. Now I wish I had at least tried retaking and doing better. I wonder if it would have been easier to end up top 10% at Temple or Villanova. Competition isn't quite as fierce there, and my LSAT would be above their 75th %iles. Obviously I'm jumping the gun here... it's just such a stressful time. :|


All you can do now is buckle down, focus, give it your best, and let the chips fall where they may. Then once the grades come in, make the decision. That is what I did.

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Veyron
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Veyron » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:01 pm

MTal wrote:
HeavenWood wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?

What else can we do? I thought I cheated the system by reverse-splitting and still sneaking into a lower T14. Now I wish I had at least tried retaking and doing better. I wonder if it would have been easier to end up top 10% at Temple or Villanova. Competition isn't quite as fierce there, and my LSAT would be above their 75th %iles. Obviously I'm jumping the gun here... it's just such a stressful time. :|


All you can do now is buckle down, focus, give it your best, and let the chips fall where they may. Then once the grades come in, make the decision. That is what I did.


What about my case where I landed a job after OCI was over at a small firm that does car accident litigation and such?

HeavenWood
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby HeavenWood » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:02 pm

MTal wrote:
HeavenWood wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?

What else can we do? I thought I cheated the system by reverse-splitting and still sneaking into a lower T14. Now I wish I had at least tried retaking and doing better. I wonder if it would have been easier to end up top 10% at Temple or Villanova. Competition isn't quite as fierce there, and my LSAT would be above their 75th %iles. Obviously I'm jumping the gun here... it's just such a stressful time. :|


All you can do now is buckle down, focus, give it your best, and let the chips fall where they may. Then once the grades come in, make the decision. That is what I did.

It's tough to focus when one is so worried, but I'll try my best. I have a contracts practice exam Friday, so I'm gonna try and get my outline caught up. Maybe if I do well on that, I'll feel better/subsequently do better come exam time.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:02 pm

whuts4lunch wrote:
ToTransferOrNot wrote:Yes. Yes, they will. Mainly because they're not going to think you'd be a valuable asset to the firm if your grades suck.

Obviously they're not going to say "oops you're 1 slot below 50%, so no dice" in most cases, but like it or not, firms care about grades.


Crazy. It just seems odd to me that a firm would think the ability to spot a bunch of issues in a short period of time matters a whole lot. I get it as a litmus test, but once they've already spent time/effort evaluating you, it seems like that evaluation should be what matters most, maybe with grades as a tie-breaker. But, it is what it is.


Do not understand this logic. Time to evaluate you? They do a 20-30 minute screening interview of you and several dozen other people. Grades are a lot more indicative than that setting in most cases.

Once you make it past the screener to a callback, the game obviously changes (though grades still matter - just not as much).

And Veyron - what do you expect MTal to tell you? You're probably not going to be able to leverage that into a biglaw gig. Would the job you're referencing let you pay off your loans were you to get an offer (by no means certain from those small firms, by the way).

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Larry David
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Larry David » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:03 pm

MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:
MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:So what do TLS people do when they strike out of OCI? Slit wrist?


If they're going into significant debt, the smart ones drop out.


Also you think the only legal jobs are the ones people get at OCI. I am asking this question directly as it pertains to southern schools in large markets where the NALP only list 10 firms?


Obviously not, but the jobs that will let grads pay off their massive 6 figure loans, will come through OCI, yes.


So only attorneys who got jobs straight from OCI pay off their loans? Also the only successful attorneys out there are hired only through OCI coming out of Law School?

HeavenWood
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby HeavenWood » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:04 pm

Larry David wrote:
MTal wrote:
Larry David wrote:
MTal wrote:If they're going into significant debt, the smart ones drop out.


Also you think the only legal jobs are the ones people get at OCI. I am asking this question directly as it pertains to southern schools in large markets where the NALP only list 10 firms?


Obviously not, but the jobs that will let grads pay off their massive 6 figure loans, will come through OCI, yes.


So only attorneys who got jobs straight from OCI pay off their loans? Also the only successful attorneys out there are hired only through OCI coming out of Law School?

That's what I've gotten from TLS. Is that wrong?

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:05 pm

Sigh. Take issue with MTal all you want, but setting up these kind of silly strawmen ("oh so people who don't get biglaw never pay their loans huh????") makes you look ridiculous.

If you have $160k in debt and you get a job making $40k a year, that's going to be a fairly meager life, IBR or not. Does that outcome make sense vs. what you could have done sans law school? People will have different answers to that question.

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MTal
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby MTal » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:06 pm

HeavenWood wrote:It's tough to focus when one is so worried, but I'll try my best. I have a contracts practice exam Friday, so I'm gonna try and get my outline caught up. Maybe if I do well on that, I'll feel better/subsequently do better come exam time.


Knowing how to work under pressure is an important skill to have, for both lawyers and students; it's also one that can be improved upon. Things that can help with this are exercise, socializing/partying on weekends, and getting laid.

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Larry David
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Larry David » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:06 pm

HeavenWood wrote:
Larry David wrote:
So only attorneys who got jobs straight from OCI pay off their loans? Also the only successful attorneys out there are hired only through OCI coming out of Law School?

That's what I've gotten from TLS. Is that wrong?


wow

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Veyron
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Veyron » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:06 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:
whuts4lunch wrote:
ToTransferOrNot wrote:Yes. Yes, they will. Mainly because they're not going to think you'd be a valuable asset to the firm if your grades suck.

Obviously they're not going to say "oops you're 1 slot below 50%, so no dice" in most cases, but like it or not, firms care about grades.


Crazy. It just seems odd to me that a firm would think the ability to spot a bunch of issues in a short period of time matters a whole lot. I get it as a litmus test, but once they've already spent time/effort evaluating you, it seems like that evaluation should be what matters most, maybe with grades as a tie-breaker. But, it is what it is.


Do not understand this logic. Time to evaluate you? They do a 20-30 minute screening interview of you and several dozen other people. Grades are a lot more indicative than that setting in most cases.

Once you make it past the screener to a callback, the game obviously changes (though grades still matter - just not as much).

And Veyron - what do you expect MTal to tell you? You're probably not going to be able to leverage that into a biglaw gig. Would the job you're referencing let you pay off your loans were you to get an offer (by no means certain from those small firms, by the way).


I mean, its not like it pays 160 or anything so its going to be tough. But then again, if I drop out now I'm stuck with lots of debt and I lose the 25k that I'd otherwise make over the summer.

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D-hops
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby D-hops » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:06 pm

Larry David wrote:
So only attorneys who got jobs straight from OCI pay off their loans? Also the only successful attorneys out there are hired only through OCI coming out of Law School?


While it is obviously overstated, it is a pretty good rule of thumb.

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whuts4lunch
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby whuts4lunch » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:09 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:Do not understand this logic. Time to evaluate you? They do a 20-30 minute screening interview of you and several dozen other people. Grades are a lot more indicative than that setting in most cases.

Once you make it past the screener to a callback, the game obviously changes (though grades still matter - just not as much).


There is plenty to evaluate. Resume, foreign language ability, sales ability, personality, business savvy, recommendations from previous employers, maybe a writing sample.

You can test the interviewee. You ask them questions, you see how they would respond to certain situations, you attempt to gain an insight into how they think and what they are capable of. A good interviewer can learn a ton about a person in 20-30 minutes. A good interviewee can make sure that the interviewer is familiar with what the interviewee is capable of, just from having had that conversation.

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Larry David
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Re: The Law School Scam

Postby Larry David » Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:09 pm

D-hops wrote:
Larry David wrote:
So only attorneys who got jobs straight from OCI pay off their loans? Also the only successful attorneys out there are hired only through OCI coming out of Law School?


While it is obviously overstated, it is a pretty good rule of thumb.


You people are retarded if you believe this. This generation is such a failure has anyone ever heard of perseverance? You do realize that some things in life are not handed to you. Also just because you make shit for a few years and struggle does not mean your entire career you will be making what you made coming out of any school not just law school.




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