Veterans Thread

(Applications Advice, Letters of Recommendation . . . )
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Ex Cearulo
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby Ex Cearulo » Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:29 pm

matthewsean85 wrote:Jesus, it's scary how similar a situation we are in, regardless of the fact that we're in completely different services. Once they have their hooks in you, they refuse to let go.

That being said, I'm still holding out the remaining ~1% chance that the Navy will take care of me, even though I realize how ridiculous that will be. I hope you get posted in a job you can use to leverage positions in the future though. I'm not sure it's universal across services, but from what I know in the Navy, the right billet can make all the difference in leveraging positions after the fact!

Don't lose hope, you're setting up your life for success!

Thanks man, appreciate the words of encouragement. I keep trying to look on the bright side by telling myself now I'll apply with 12 years of work experience instead of 6 (which will help put my mediocre GPA ever further in my past) and I'll have a clean slate with which to attack the LSAT b/c I simply wasn't able to prep as much as I would have liked due to training and job duties. It may turn out for the best if I get into an insanely good school when I finally apply.

Anecdotally, I think you have a better chance than I did. The Navy seems to be better at "out of the ordinary" stuff than the Air Force and is more interested/capable of working to honor requests like yours. Maybe this is because their manning is more stable or they do a better job managing it. Who knows? Unfortunately, the assignment I receive next won't change anything or provide me any leverage. I'll still have two years left on my commitment after the next assignment is over which means they can really send me anywhere they want.

But best of luck to you dude. Hope the Navy lets you follow your dream.

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Ex Cearulo
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby Ex Cearulo » Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:38 pm

TheJanitor6203 wrote:I may catch some crap for this but next week I'm going to talk to legal about any chance I may have at a voluntary early seperation from the Army. I've got 7 1/2 years in with just over a year left and I'm dying inside. I can't take it anymore and I want nothing more than to just get out so I can finish my bachelor degree without the Army continusly screwing with me. I think I've had to drop more classes in the past 2 years than I've actually taken because I keep having to go do some b.s. training or some other crap. I have no hope of anything coming out of my meeting next week but I can't stop thinking that it just might work...

It's funny you mention voluntarily trying to leave early. With the Air Force's "retention rates are at a 17-year high" problem, they've occasionally offered a VSP (Voluntary Separation Program). Of course, we had a few pilots in our squadron apply to the last one a couple years ago, but they got denied for the same reason I got denied from applying to law school - low manning in the fighter pilot career fields.

While I can sympathize with how training and deployments can throw wrenches into plans, I know dozens of people who have been able to finish degrees on Active Duty. I'm currently three classes short of finishing my Masters degree, and that's with a deployment and countless trips for training duty. It often takes longer because of the heavy requirements the military places on your time, but it's certainly doable.

I'd say stick it out, brother. You made the commitment, and it's only a year. I wasn't trying to leave the Air Force early, just change career fields.

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Ramius
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby Ramius » Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:45 pm

HawgDriver wrote:
TheJanitor6203 wrote:I may catch some crap for this but next week I'm going to talk to legal about any chance I may have at a voluntary early seperation from the Army. I've got 7 1/2 years in with just over a year left and I'm dying inside. I can't take it anymore and I want nothing more than to just get out so I can finish my bachelor degree without the Army continusly screwing with me. I think I've had to drop more classes in the past 2 years than I've actually taken because I keep having to go do some b.s. training or some other crap. I have no hope of anything coming out of my meeting next week but I can't stop thinking that it just might work...

It's funny you mention voluntarily trying to leave early. With the Air Force's "retention rates are at a 17-year high" problem, they've occasionally offered a VSP (Voluntary Separation Program). Of course, we had a few pilots in our squadron apply to the last one a couple years ago, but they got denied for the same reason I got denied from applying to law school - low manning in the fighter pilot career fields.

While I can sympathize with how training and deployments can throw wrenches into plans, I know dozens of people who have been able to finish degrees on Active Duty. I'm currently three classes short of finishing my Masters degree, and that's with a deployment and countless trips for training duty. It often takes longer because of the heavy requirements the military places on your time, but it's certainly doable.

I'd say stick it out, brother. You made the commitment, and it's only a year. I wasn't trying to leave the Air Force early, just change career fields.


Amen, Hawg. While working within the confines of a strict system like the U.S. military, it's a commitment you have to engage 100%, even if your plans at the end of it involve a suit and tie. Give the country your best and trust that the training they've given you will help you succeed for the rest of your life (whether you realize it or not).

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TheJanitor6203
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby TheJanitor6203 » Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:50 pm

HawgDriver wrote:
TheJanitor6203 wrote:I may catch some crap for this but next week I'm going to talk to legal about any chance I may have at a voluntary early seperation from the Army. I've got 7 1/2 years in with just over a year left and I'm dying inside. I can't take it anymore and I want nothing more than to just get out so I can finish my bachelor degree without the Army continusly screwing with me. I think I've had to drop more classes in the past 2 years than I've actually taken because I keep having to go do some b.s. training or some other crap. I have no hope of anything coming out of my meeting next week but I can't stop thinking that it just might work...

It's funny you mention voluntarily trying to leave early. With the Air Force's "retention rates are at a 17-year high" problem, they've occasionally offered a VSP (Voluntary Separation Program). Of course, we had a few pilots in our squadron apply to the last one a couple years ago, but they got denied for the same reason I got denied from applying to law school - low manning in the fighter pilot career fields.

While I can sympathize with how training and deployments can throw wrenches into plans, I know dozens of people who have been able to finish degrees on Active Duty. I'm currently three classes short of finishing my Masters degree, and that's with a deployment and countless trips for training duty. It often takes longer because of the heavy requirements the military places on your time, but it's certainly doable.

I'd say stick it out, brother. You made the commitment, and it's only a year. I wasn't trying to leave the Air Force early, just change career fields.


I get what you mean but with the Army trying to cut 80,000 soldiers over the next 6 years, I just thought I'd try to do my part to help them out. I'm on track to finish my ba about a month after I ETS at this point. I'll have it done in order to apply to LS next cycle regardless but I'd REALLY like to get out now if I can. I'm not going to do some crazy stuff to get out. I've seen people do all kinds of things to get out.. fake their wife leaving so they have to get out because they have no way to care for the kids, failing pt tests on purpose, getting fat and failing weight and tape on purpose, etc etc. I'm not trying to do any of that. I'm basically just going to ask legal, since the Army is working so hard to downsize, if there isn't something they can do to let me out early. I know what the answer is already but it's worth a shot.

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Ex Cearulo
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby Ex Cearulo » Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:58 pm

TheJanitor6203 wrote:
HawgDriver wrote:
TheJanitor6203 wrote:I may catch some crap for this but next week I'm going to talk to legal about any chance I may have at a voluntary early seperation from the Army. I've got 7 1/2 years in with just over a year left and I'm dying inside. I can't take it anymore and I want nothing more than to just get out so I can finish my bachelor degree without the Army continusly screwing with me. I think I've had to drop more classes in the past 2 years than I've actually taken because I keep having to go do some b.s. training or some other crap. I have no hope of anything coming out of my meeting next week but I can't stop thinking that it just might work...

It's funny you mention voluntarily trying to leave early. With the Air Force's "retention rates are at a 17-year high" problem, they've occasionally offered a VSP (Voluntary Separation Program). Of course, we had a few pilots in our squadron apply to the last one a couple years ago, but they got denied for the same reason I got denied from applying to law school - low manning in the fighter pilot career fields.

While I can sympathize with how training and deployments can throw wrenches into plans, I know dozens of people who have been able to finish degrees on Active Duty. I'm currently three classes short of finishing my Masters degree, and that's with a deployment and countless trips for training duty. It often takes longer because of the heavy requirements the military places on your time, but it's certainly doable.

I'd say stick it out, brother. You made the commitment, and it's only a year. I wasn't trying to leave the Air Force early, just change career fields.


I get what you mean but with the Army trying to cut 80,000 soldiers over the next 6 years, I just thought I'd try to do my part to help them out. I'm on track to finish my ba about a month after I ETS at this point. I'll have it done in order to apply to LS next cycle regardless but I'd REALLY like to get out now if I can. I'm not going to do some crazy stuff to get out. I've seen people do all kinds of things to get out.. fake their wife leaving so they have to get out because they have no way to care for the kids, failing pt tests on purpose, getting fat and failing weight and tape on purpose, etc etc. I'm not trying to do any of that. I'm basically just going to ask legal, since the Army is working so hard to downsize, if there isn't something they can do to let me out early. I know what the answer is already but it's worth a shot.

That's all valid, I guess. I actually learned about the Army's reduction in force plan today from an instructor at the Army Maneuver Course at Ft. Benning who visited our Squadron Officer School class today. You're right, there's definitely a difference in saying "you're aggressively trying to draw down forces and I'm willing to leave early...what say you?" versus doing some shady, unethical things to get out. Best of luck to you, regardless of what they tell you. Either way, you'll still be applying to law school waaaay before I can.

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MT Cicero
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby MT Cicero » Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:11 pm

Fought with some Hawgs today, HawgDriver. We had 3 of them join us and go all Red Baron on the 4-ship DCA upgrade. Ended up being 4v7...all kinds of fun!

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Ex Cearulo
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby Ex Cearulo » Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:04 pm

Roll in from the sun and circle the hawgs! Sounds awesome man, hopefully they were respectable! It's always fun to do pure BFM with other airframes b/c they tend to underestimate what we can do with our turn radius and airspeed.

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Rotor
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Re: .

Postby Rotor » Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:10 am

I always found it funny that we had a fixed wing v helo 1v1 in our training pipeline. Like anything we did would save our butts if we didn't have our chaff/flares (...and even then... :roll: ). So would have loved getting some real ACM.

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Re: .

Postby bjsesq » Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:15 am

Rotor wrote:I always found it funny that we had a fixed wing v helo 1v1 in our training pipeline. Like anything we did would save our butts if we didn't have our chaff/flares (...and even then... :roll: ). So would have loved getting some real ACM.


Flechettes: if do right, no can defense?

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Ex Cearulo
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Re: .

Postby Ex Cearulo » Sun Dec 09, 2012 12:58 am

Rotor wrote:I always found it funny that we had a fixed wing v helo 1v1 in our training pipeline. Like anything we did would save our butts if we didn't have our chaff/flares (...and even then... :roll: ). So would have loved getting some real ACM.

It's funny you say that because as new wingmen we're told not to take helos for granted (at least not ones with guns). We get warned that a decent helo pilot can make you pay big time for getting cocky and overconfident and screwing up your attack.

Unrelated: Why did the name of this thread get changed to "."?

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Rotor
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Re: .

Postby Rotor » Sun Dec 09, 2012 5:09 pm

HawgDriver wrote:
Rotor wrote:I always found it funny that we had a fixed wing v helo 1v1 in our training pipeline. Like anything we did would save our butts if we didn't have our chaff/flares (...and even then... :roll: ). So would have loved getting some real ACM.

It's funny you say that because as new wingmen we're told not to take helos for granted (at least not ones with guns). We get warned that a decent helo pilot can make you pay big time for getting cocky and overconfident and screwing up your attack.

Unrelated: Why did the name of this thread get changed to "."?

Yeah. I felt a wee bit better once we got hellfire. If someone was coming at me fat dumb and happy I could lase him and at least try and make him CFIT as he's dodging the missile down low. :twisted:
Last edited by Rotor on Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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TheJanitor6203
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Re: .

Postby TheJanitor6203 » Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:14 pm

Would anyone like to post/PM me their email so I could email you my resume and personal statements (I have two and I can't decide which I like better so I'd like anyones opinion on which they think is best and why). I know there is a section for this but since we're all military here and I'd prefer to have someone with similar experiences look it over to see if I'm relating my military experience well.

txtochitown
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Re: .

Postby txtochitown » Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:46 pm

I have a question about benefits. does anyone know that if you exhaust ch. 33 if you could use full benefits under ch. 31??

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ScottRiqui
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Re: .

Postby ScottRiqui » Wed Dec 12, 2012 12:16 am

txtochitown wrote:I have a question about benefits. does anyone know that if you exhaust ch. 33 if you could use full benefits under ch. 31??


I'm not 100% certain, but I think you can only have a combined 48 months of benefits. So if you used up all three years of your Post-9/11 GI Bill (Chapter 33), then you would only have 12 months left for the Vocational Rehabilitation & Employment (Chapter 31).

But, it appears that the 48-month limit may be waiverable. Here's an article that talks a little about using both the GI Bill and VRE.

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TheJanitor6203
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Re: .

Postby TheJanitor6203 » Wed Dec 12, 2012 1:30 am

txtochitown wrote:I have a question about benefits. does anyone know that if you exhaust ch. 33 if you could use full benefits under ch. 31??


From your username I'm guessing you're from Texas. If that is the case once you've used up all the GI Bill you can try and use the Hazzlewood Act if you're going to a state school.

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SemperLegal
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby SemperLegal » Wed Dec 12, 2012 3:09 am

HawgDriver wrote:Well, I received the official answer this evening that the Air Force is not releasing me from flying to apply to law school. While I've heard the party line enough over the last few years to know that a release would be difficult, it's still very disappointing. I wanted this so bad and I've spent the last several months going through the application process so I wouldn't be behind if the answer was yes.

On top of that, my commander simultaneously dropped the news that the move date for my next assignment is being moved up by about 6 months and that they need my requests for jobs/bases by next week.

So I won't be applying to law school for about 6 more years. Maybe by 9 years from now when I graduate one of you will be a hiring partner and can hook me up. :)

It's been real, TLS. I've gotta go figure out a prioritized request list of where to move my family...



Sorry to hear this. On the bright side:

1. Legal field is only getting better, maybe by 2018 hiring will be at 2008 levels
2. You will probably be a shoe-in for biglaw, especially if you pick up.
3. Military is most fun when you realize that you are not a careerist and can truly give no fucks about the dumb shit.

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SemperLegal
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Re: .

Postby SemperLegal » Wed Dec 12, 2012 3:11 am

Also, should we get a mod to give our thread a new title?

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TripTrip
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Re: .

Postby TripTrip » Wed Dec 12, 2012 5:01 am

Hey guys.

I'm National Guard, E-4, applying this cycle.

I've a question for y'all: to what extent did you work your military experience into your personal statement?

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SemperLegal
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Re: .

Postby SemperLegal » Wed Dec 12, 2012 5:31 am

TripTrip wrote:Hey guys.

I'm National Guard, E-4, applying this cycle.

I've a question for y'all: to what extent did you work your military experience into your personal statement?


2 paragraphs, depends on how much you have to say.

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Ramius
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Re: .

Postby Ramius » Wed Dec 12, 2012 7:05 am

TripTrip wrote:Hey guys.

I'm National Guard, E-4, applying this cycle.

I've a question for y'all: to what extent did you work your military experience into your personal statement?


It framed my entire PS, but as stated before, it really depends on how formative your experience in the military was. In my case, the military has encompassed the entirety of my adult life. If you're in the Naval Reserve washing graffiti off of a horse's ass in Lubbock, TX, it would be exceedingly difficult to tie that into a passable PS.

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TripTrip
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Re: .

Postby TripTrip » Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:12 am

Thanks for the input.

My experience did change me, during the eight months I spent in training. However, I've never deployed (I volunteered, but I came back from training three days too late to sign the paperwork) and haven't been activated since then. Even though I've shown leadership in my unit (NCOIC of an M9 range for the brigade during AT, for example), I'm not sure it's substantive enough to talk about at length in my PS.

Do you think it will look superficial if I just put in two sentences about how training helped shape my perspectives and the way I interact with people?

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TheJanitor6203
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Re: .

Postby TheJanitor6203 » Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:37 am

matthewsean85 wrote:
TripTrip wrote:Hey guys.

I'm National Guard, E-4, applying this cycle.

I've a question for y'all: to what extent did you work your military experience into your personal statement?


It framed my entire PS, but as stated before, it really depends on how formative your experience in the military was. In my case, the military has encompassed the entirety of my adult life. If you're in the Naval Reserve washing graffiti off of a horse's ass in Lubbock, TX, it would be exceedingly difficult to tie that into a passable PS.


I also framed my entire PS around my service but also like matthewsean85, I've spent my entire adult like on active duty.

TripTrip wrote:Thanks for the input.

My experience did change me, during the eight months I spent in training. However, I've never deployed (I volunteered, but I came back from training three days too late to sign the paperwork) and haven't been activated since then. Even though I've shown leadership in my unit (NCOIC of an M9 range for the brigade during AT, for example), I'm not sure it's substantive enough to talk about at length in my PS.

Do you think it will look superficial if I just put in two sentences about how training helped shape my perspectives and the way I interact with people?


That really all depends on how it is written.

rvadog
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby rvadog » Wed Dec 12, 2012 8:36 pm

You guys have room for Coast Guard in this thread?

I've got 4 years AD with either one left or 4 left depending on where they try and send me this summer.

Hoping the military thing carries some water because my GPA blows (hence the reason I enlisted in the coast guard instead of finishing college)>

karich
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby karich » Wed Dec 12, 2012 9:19 pm

rvadog wrote:You guys have room for Coast Guard in this thread?






Welcome.
Last edited by karich on Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Zoomie
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Re: ITT: Military Veterans

Postby Zoomie » Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:49 pm

TheJanitor6203 wrote:
HawgDriver wrote:Well, I received the official answer this evening that the Air Force is not releasing me from flying to apply to law school. While I've heard the party line enough over the last few years to know that a release would be difficult, it's still very disappointing. I wanted this so bad and I've spent the last several months going through the application process so I wouldn't be behind if the answer was yes.

On top of that, my commander simultaneously dropped the news that the move date for my next assignment is being moved up by about 6 months and that they need my requests for jobs/bases by next week.

So I won't be applying to law school for about 6 more years. Maybe by 9 years from now when I graduate one of you will be a hiring partner and can hook me up. :)

It's been real, TLS. I've gotta go figure out a prioritized request list of where to move my family...


I may catch some crap for this but next week I'm going to talk to legal about any chance I may have at a voluntary early seperation from the Army. I've got 7 1/2 years in with just over a year left and I'm dying inside. I can't take it anymore and I want nothing more than to just get out so I can finish my bachelor degree without the Army continusly screwing with me. I think I've had to drop more classes in the past 2 years than I've actually taken because I keep having to go do some b.s. training or some other crap. I have no hope of anything coming out of my meeting next week but I can't stop thinking that it just might work...


I have FIVE punitive w's because having to drop classes due to being TDY or work load. I dropped past the drop date and they say lsac doesn't count w's, but mine are showing up as F's on my CAS academic report. :( they are w's on my transcript and my lsac gpa is lower than my transcript from my undergrad school. I feel ya.




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