Veterans Thread

(Applications Advice, Letters of Recommendation . . . )
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Cobretti
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Cobretti » Fri Jun 13, 2014 1:07 pm

Sicsofs wrote:Sup Fellow Vets. Just got in to Georgetown Law as a transfer. TTTT 3.54 top 10% URM. 35M, two deployments totaling 27 months, govt contractor in Cuba and AFG for 30 months. I feel like coming from a TTTT, the vet edge got me over the top. Climb to glory.

Kai

Congrats, hope you kill it at OCI!

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TheSpanishMain
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby TheSpanishMain » Fri Jun 13, 2014 8:58 pm

Sicsofs wrote:Sup Fellow Vets. Just got in to Georgetown Law as a transfer. TTTT 3.54 top 10% URM. 35M, two deployments totaling 27 months, govt contractor in Cuba and AFG for 30 months. I feel like coming from a TTTT, the vet edge got me over the top. Climb to glory.

Kai


Hey man, when/where were your deployments? PM me, we might have crossed paths at some point. I'm starting at Georgetown this fall.

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FairchildFLT
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby FairchildFLT » Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:11 am

Will I find a huge difference between the 2010 PowerScore logical reasoning bible and the 2014 version? Besides the $40 difference?

Dondarrion
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Dondarrion » Mon Jun 23, 2014 5:51 pm

Glad to find this forum and thread.

I still have to sift through this thread but I am going to try to take the LSAT (dec) in Okinawa on my upcoming deployment.

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FairchildFLT
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby FairchildFLT » Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:17 pm

Dondarrion wrote:Glad to find this forum and thread.

I still have to sift through this thread but I am going to try to take the LSAT (dec) in Okinawa on my upcoming deployment.


Welcome aboard, Lord of Blackhaven!

Dondarrion
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Dondarrion » Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:34 pm

My EAS is March 1, 2015 and I am going to be taking the LSAT in Okinawa on my upcoming deployment.

Will I have a shot to attend law school in the fall of 2015?

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ScottRiqui
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby ScottRiqui » Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:39 pm

Random non-law post, but I only discovered a year ago that our DoD ID number (on the back of the CAAC, or the front of retired/dependent IDs) serves as a "TSA Known Traveler ID number" when you're booking a flight, and gets you the TSA Pre-Check benefits (separate line, don't have to remove shoes/belt, can leave your laptop in your bag, etc).

Dondarrion
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Dondarrion » Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:09 am

Here is an introduction:

Marine Corps O-2 (artillery) with 3 years AD, 1 deployment
LSAT: Taking it in December
Undergrad: 3.4 GPA - B.A. Political Science (UTk)
100% GI Bill and Yellow Ribbon eligible

Schools:
Vanderbilt
Emory
Georgetown
George Washington
University of Tennessee
University of Texas

If I crush the LSAT I will send in applications to more t-14 including HYS

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TheSpanishMain
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby TheSpanishMain » Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:58 pm

Dondarrion wrote:Here is an introduction:

Marine Corps O-2 (artillery) with 3 years AD, 1 deployment
LSAT: Taking it in December
Undergrad: 3.4 GPA - B.A. Political Science (UTk)
100% GI Bill and Yellow Ribbon eligible

Schools:
Vanderbilt
Emory
Georgetown
George Washington
University of Tennessee
University of Texas

If I crush the LSAT I will send in applications to more t-14 including HYS


You may be aware of this, so I apologize if I'm telling you something you already know, but keep in mind that those schools (with the possible exception of Georgetown) are regional. For, say, Texas to be a good idea, you really need to have ties to Texas and want to work in Texas, because the degree won't be that portable. That's not to say that Texas isn't a great school, particularly if you're going for free with dat GI Bill, but it's only a good idea if it aligns with your goals.

Your GPA probably means you're out at HYS even with a 180, unfortunately. Still, apply broadly. I had roughly the same GPA as you and with a 168 got Georgetown, UVA, and Northwestern. If you are targeting the South, as you seem to be, I'd strongly consider EDing UVA. They grant in-state tuition to all veterans, so with your GI Bill you're 100% covered.

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FairchildFLT
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby FairchildFLT » Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:36 pm

TheSpanishMain wrote:
Dondarrion wrote:Here is an introduction:

Marine Corps O-2 (artillery) with 3 years AD, 1 deployment
LSAT: Taking it in December
Undergrad: 3.4 GPA - B.A. Political Science (UTk)
100% GI Bill and Yellow Ribbon eligible

Schools:
Vanderbilt
Emory
Georgetown
George Washington
University of Tennessee
University of Texas

If I crush the LSAT I will send in applications to more t-14 including HYS


You may be aware of this, so I apologize if I'm telling you something you already know, but keep in mind that those schools (with the possible exception of Georgetown) are regional. For, say, Texas to be a good idea, you really need to have ties to Texas and want to work in Texas, because the degree won't be that portable. That's not to say that Texas isn't a great school, particularly if you're going for free with dat GI Bill, but it's only a good idea if it aligns with your goals.

Your GPA probably means you're out at HYS even with a 180, unfortunately. Still, apply broadly. I had roughly the same GPA as you and with a 168 got Georgetown, UVA, and Northwestern. If you are targeting the South, as you seem to be, I'd strongly consider EDing UVA. They grant in-state tuition to all veterans, so with your GI Bill you're 100% covered.


As a guy who's also looking into UT (I want to practice in Texas, I'm a Texas resident so 10K housing stipend, 100% GI Bill, low COL, close to home but not too close, ethnically diverse etc...) What is the definition of "ties." Do you mean I need to know someone who works in a law firm there? Or will being a resident/having been stationed in multiple locations around Texas count? I have spoken to a prior-Air Force guy who is Senior Council, I'll reconnect if/when I decide on UT, but I would hate to be SOL from day 1 because I don't know a lot of attorneys.

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TheSpanishMain
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby TheSpanishMain » Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:58 pm

FairchildFLT wrote:What is the definition of "ties."


(0L here as well, just to be clear)

"Ties" usually means a reason you can articulate for wanting to be in the state/region. Firms don't want to spend the time and resources training you, only to see you peace out in two years when you're finally becoming useful because you want to go back to wherever you're from. They want to be reasonably confident that you're planning on sticking around for awhile. It doesn't mean having an inside connection with attorneys, although that doesn't hurt. If you're a Texas resident who has lived/served there for awhile, those are solid ties and going to UT for free is a great way to go. Even better would be if you grew up there. Could also be something like "We love the area, and my spouse's career is here, so we're looking to settle here long term", etc. Basically just putting their mind at ease that you're not a flight risk.

Dondarrion
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Dondarrion » Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:04 pm

TheSpanishMain wrote:
You may be aware of this, so I apologize if I'm telling you something you already know, but keep in mind that those schools (with the possible exception of Georgetown) are regional. For, say, Texas to be a good idea, you really need to have ties to Texas and want to work in Texas, because the degree won't be that portable. That's not to say that Texas isn't a great school, particularly if you're going for free with dat GI Bill, but it's only a good idea if it aligns with your goals.

Your GPA probably means you're out at HYS even with a 180, unfortunately. Still, apply broadly. I had roughly the same GPA as you and with a 168 got Georgetown, UVA, and Northwestern. If you are targeting the South, as you seem to be, I'd strongly consider EDing UVA. They grant in-state tuition to all veterans, so with your GI Bill you're 100% covered.


I am from Tennessee and I am targeting the South + Texas + DC. I am from TN, worked in DC before the USMC, and I would like to settle in the southeast + Texas long term. My wife and I have spent time in Texas and we would definitely settle there long term. I am aware those schools are regional.

After reading through this site, I am definitely not one of the "OMG, if I don't get into a t-14 my life is over". I am going to send in some applications to some of the top schools because hey, why the hell not? You never know. I had a 4.0 in my major and my freshman year I jacked up a few grades. Maybe they will decide to overlook that.

Next step is getting in touch with LSAC to find out how I can take the LSAT while I am deployed :shock:

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FairchildFLT
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby FairchildFLT » Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:19 pm

TheSpanishMain wrote:
FairchildFLT wrote:What is the definition of "ties."


(0L here as well, just to be clear)

"Ties" usually means a reason you can articulate for wanting to be in the state/region. Firms don't want to spend the time and resources training you, only to see you peace out in two years when you're finally becoming useful because you want to go back to wherever you're from. They want to be reasonably confident that you're planning on sticking around for awhile. It doesn't mean having an inside connection with attorneys, although that doesn't hurt. If you're a Texas resident who has lived/served there for awhile, those are solid ties and going to UT for free is a great way to go. Even better would be if you grew up there. Could also be something like "We love the area, and my spouse's career is here, so we're looking to settle here long term", etc. Basically just putting their mind at ease that you're not a flight risk.


Copy all thanks.

CoffeeLuvr
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby CoffeeLuvr » Thu Jun 26, 2014 2:59 pm

Howdy to all! Hoping for some insight from my fellow vets who are applying or who have applied to law school already. I'm still getting up to speed on everything, but perhaps some of you could give me your opinion regarding my situation.

I'm waiting on my LSAT score (hopefully next week), but if I score between 155 - 159 (Thats what I was hitting during practice tests) Anyone think any of the top 50 law schools would be willing to give me a chance? Are some law schools more veteran friendly than others? Below are the stats for my grades.

Cumulative GPA = 3.01 (167 credits) (186 total - 19 unconverted)
School 1 GPA = 1.73 (71 credits)
School 2 GPA = 3.80 (30 Credits)
School 3 GPA = 4.0 (6 credits)
School 4 GPA = 3.87 (31 credits)
Degree Granting GPA = 4.0 (48 credits)

The bad grades I have are my my first years in college from 2000 - 2004. I failed out and enlisted in the military in 2005, worked my way up to E-6 and have been a paralegal for the JAG corps for the last 6 years. I have several letters of recommendation from the attorneys I worked for and my resume shows all of my legal work since 2008, specifically when I deployed to Iraq to work for an JAG and when I worked in the legal office onboard an aircraft carrier. When I wasn't deployed I took classes online and on the bases to finish my degree. From 2005 (Schools 2 and up), my cumulative GPA is a 3.91. However, I have to submit a statement to each law school because I was suspeneded over those horrible grades and, believe me, I take full responsibility for my actions in my statement. Anyone think I have any chance or will all of the top 50 law schools just look at my cumulative GPA/LSAT and say No way?

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Cobretti
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Cobretti » Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:21 pm

Is that the GPA you got from using a LSAC GPA calculator or just from doing your own math? LSAC counts things differently than most schools (withdrawls count as Fs, retaking a class does not remove the original grade, A+ is worth 4.3). You can calculate it here if you haven't. Generally speaking though it seems even for veterans its mostly a numbers game, my cycle played out pretty much how everyone predicted it would based on my numbers without considering veteran status... so I wouldn't expect too much of a boost (i think this is more true for prior enlisted based on my own experience and speaking to former officers at my school).

Is this your first LSAT? And how much did you study? Assuming you score in that range you still have a ton of room for improvement. If you haven't already done 40+ PTs and exhausted all Manhattan/Powerscore guides you should probably retake.

CoffeeLuvr
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby CoffeeLuvr » Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:40 pm

Cobretti wrote:Is that the GPA you got from using a LSAC GPA calculator or just from doing your own math? LSAC counts things differently than most schools (withdrawls count as Fs, retaking a class does not remove the original grade, A+ is worth 4.3). You can calculate it here if you haven't. Generally speaking though it seems even for veterans its mostly a numbers game, my cycle played out pretty much how everyone predicted it would based on my numbers without considering veteran status... so I wouldn't expect too much of a boost (i think this is more true for prior enlisted based on my own experience and speaking to former officers at my school).

Is this your first LSAT? And how much did you study? Assuming you score in that range you still have a ton of room for improvement. If you haven't already done 40+ PTs and exhausted all Manhattan/Powerscore guides you should probably retake.


Yes...thats my GPA from LSAC website. I've been to that particular law school calculator website...I know my GPA is what it is. Frankly, I'm extatic that I broke 3.0. I'm really hoping that my softs can help me more than usual, especially with all of my experience in legal and maybe there would be a school or two that the military factor would go farther with.

As for studying...I took two weeks of leave and spent 8-10 hours everyday at the library. I finished the 2014 Kaplan LSAT guide and all 4 of the PTs there as well as a another book and the three tests in there. I thoght about just going in everyday and just doing PTs, but I read in several places that most people dont get better that way. So I broke up my time between studying the questions I got wrong and PTs. If I need to retake in September I will, but it seems that most people have better luck with acceptance letters by applying early (August/Setember) than by putting it off...

Dondarrion
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Dondarrion » Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:50 pm

Cobretti wrote:Is that the GPA you got from using a LSAC GPA calculator or just from doing your own math? LSAC counts things differently than most schools (withdrawls count as Fs, retaking a class does not remove the original grade, A+ is worth 4.3). You can calculate it here if you haven't.


Wait what? How can you count W's as F's? I had to withdraw from a few classes one semester because I had to increase my work hours in order to pay for school. We also didn't have A+, just A and A-.

I am looking at my college transcripts and there is no way for me to enter my grades into the calculator. It just simple says the number of hours earned and the letter grade according to the grading scale.

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TheSpanishMain
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby TheSpanishMain » Thu Jun 26, 2014 4:08 pm

Dondarrion wrote:
Wait what? How can you count W's as F's? I had to withdraw from a few classes one semester because I had to increase my work hours in order to pay for school. We also didn't have A+, just A and A-.



I think it depends on how the school codes it. Some withdrawals are considered punitive (i.e will count as F's to LSAC) and some are non-punitive (won't count as F's). I withdrew from a class in college due to scheduling issues, but because I withdrew right at the beginning of the semester, I was in my school's grace period and got a non-punitive withdrawal. At least, that's how I think it all works.

CoffeeLuvr wrote:Anyone think any of the top 50 law schools would be willing to give me a chance?


Just my two cents: try not to get too wrapped up in the whole "Top 50" or "Top 100" or "Top Whatever" thing that the US News and World Report rankings peddle. You basically have Top 14 (national/semi-national) schools, and then you have your regionals (everything else.) Obviously, some regionals are better than others, but the point is most law schools are focused on a particular geographic area. If you're from, say, North Carolina and want to practice there, don't pick Boston College over UNC because Boston College is higher in the rankings. Focus more on where you want to work and target the best schools for that particular area.

CoffeeLuvr wrote:I thoght about just going in everyday and just doing PTs, but I read in several places that most people dont get better that way. So I broke up my time between studying the questions I got wrong and PTs. .


Personally, I don't think you should be taking a lot of PTs until you've gotten the fundamentals down solidly. Take one just to get a baseline, and then just drill questions (with a special focus on whatever your weaknesses are) until you can really recognize the type of question and how to attack it. For example, "Ok, this is a sorting game, so step 1 is..." or "Ok, this a flaw question, so I look for..." Once you have mastered the basics, that's when you start doing PTs to work on timing.
Last edited by TheSpanishMain on Thu Jun 26, 2014 4:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Dondarrion
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Dondarrion » Thu Jun 26, 2014 4:17 pm

TheSpanishMain wrote:I think it depends on how the school codes it. Some withdrawals are considered punitive (i.e will count as F's to LSAC) and some are non-punitive (won't count as F's). I withdrew from a class in college due to scheduling issues, but because I withdrew right at the beginning of the semester, I was in my school's grace period and got a non-punitive withdrawal. At least, that's how I think it all works.


Oh ok that makes sense. My transcripts have an attached page with the grading scale and rules ie withdrawals, failures, retakes, etc.

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ScottRiqui
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby ScottRiqui » Thu Jun 26, 2014 4:40 pm

I would definitely retake in September if you think you can improve your score at all. You'll have your score back by the end of October, which will allow you meet even the Early Decision/Early Action deadlines at most, if not all, schools. If you're getting your apps in by the beginning of November, that's plenty "early" enough.

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MT Cicero
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby MT Cicero » Thu Jun 26, 2014 5:18 pm

ScottRiqui wrote:I would definitely retake in September if you think you can improve your score at all. You'll have your score back by the end of October, which will allow you meet even the Early Decision/Early Action deadlines at most, if not all, schools. If you're getting your apps in by the beginning of November, that's plenty "early" enough.


Please do this if your score leaves anything at all to be desired. Then, please go to this forum:http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=41657&hilit=pithypike

Holding the GI Bill with Yellow Ribbon is a golden ticket to avoid sticker. Even with your GPA, a high enough LSAT can yield solid regional schools and possibly some of the lower T14s (especially GU and NU with a good LSAT).

My GPA is lower than yours and I'll be attending NU this fall. Drill, drill, drill...and profit.

golfenstate
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby golfenstate » Thu Jun 26, 2014 5:26 pm

Sicsofs wrote:Sup Fellow Vets. Just got in to Georgetown Law as a transfer. TTTT 3.54 top 10% URM. 35M, two deployments totaling 27 months, govt contractor in Cuba and AFG for 30 months. I feel like coming from a TTTT, the vet edge got me over the top. Climb to glory.

Kai

The dream... I know the transfer process is dependent on class rank/gpa, but do you have any veteran-specific advice on doing this? Shooting for USC/UT from low T40.

Dondarrion
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby Dondarrion » Mon Jun 30, 2014 11:36 am

So the December LSAT is going to cost me a pretty penny.

$170 for normal fee
$343 for non-disclosed location (Okinawa)

$513 total :shock: :shock: :shock:

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MT Cicero
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby MT Cicero » Tue Jul 01, 2014 9:48 am

Well, yesterday was my final flight in the Air Force. Farewell Strike Eagle. Only a few admin days remain and I'll be on terminal leave. Looking forward to moving to Chicago in 7 weeks!

Dondarrion: $513 for the LSAT? Wow. Although the cost will be more than offset if you beat it into submission...

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TheSpanishMain
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Re: Veterans Thread

Postby TheSpanishMain » Tue Jul 01, 2014 9:58 am

Soco Law wrote:Well, yesterday was my final flight in the Air Force. Farewell Strike Eagle. Only a few admin days remain and I'll be on terminal leave. Looking forward to moving to Chicago in 7 weeks!



Feels good, doesn't it? Grow that beard.




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