UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

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WhiteGuy5
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UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby WhiteGuy5 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:03 pm

Hey Guys,

So I've been surfing this board for a long time but never bothered to post.

I had been practicing for the LSAT for a really long time and I was averaging somewhere in the low 170s when I took it last Saturday (I took all the PTs from 35-63). The third game messed me up like it messed up a lot of people on this board, but I feel OK with the rest -- I'm expecting 167-168ish.

I only have letters of recommendation for the top 8 ranked schools (except Michigan)+Cornell, Georgetown, and Fordham. I don't want to go to any of the others in the T14 except the ones I'm applying to and if I can't get into the T14, I rather go to school in New York City.

My question is...am I making a mistake? I'm picking Fordham over all the non-T14s because I think outside of the T14, being in New York City in a pretty decent school is the next best thing you can do if you want to live/work in NYC.

Was there a wiser course of action for someone like me?

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rinkrat19
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby rinkrat19 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:09 pm

Jesus, you made your recommenders write EIGHT different letters?

Generally, people have their recommenders write one generic letter, and only do a school-specific letter if they have something specific to say about that school (e.g. they also went there or whatever).

I would think that #9-14 still place fine in NYC and you probably should have blanketed the whole T14. With a 167, you're not getting into HY, Stanford's iffy, and you're a big splitter at CCNM. That's 7 of the top 8 that are by no means guaranteed.

EDIT: Oops, you said that you would prefer to go to school in NYC, not work there. But my opinion isn't changed. IMO #9-14 are still better choices than Fordham, unless you get some humongous scholarship.

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WhiteGuy5
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby WhiteGuy5 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:25 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:Jesus, you made your recommenders write EIGHT different letters?

Generally, people have their recommenders write one generic letter, and only do a school-specific letter if they have something specific to say about that school (e.g. they also went there or whatever).

I would think that #9-14 still place fine in NYC and you probably should have blanketed the whole T14. With a 167, you're not getting into HY, Stanford's iffy, and you're a big splitter at CCNM. That's 7 of the top 8 that are by no means guaranteed.

EDIT: Oops, you said that you would prefer to go to school in NYC, not work there. But my opinion isn't changed. IMO #9-14 are still better choices than Fordham, unless you get some humongous scholarship.


No. I would rather work in the city.

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rinkrat19
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby rinkrat19 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:27 pm

WhiteGuy5 wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:Jesus, you made your recommenders write EIGHT different letters?

Generally, people have their recommenders write one generic letter, and only do a school-specific letter if they have something specific to say about that school (e.g. they also went there or whatever).

I would think that #9-14 still place fine in NYC and you probably should have blanketed the whole T14. With a 167, you're not getting into HY, Stanford's iffy, and you're a big splitter at CCNM. That's 7 of the top 8 that are by no means guaranteed.

EDIT: Oops, you said that you would prefer to go to school in NYC, not work there. But my opinion isn't changed. IMO #9-14 are still better choices than Fordham, unless you get some humongous scholarship.


No. I would rather work in the city.
Well, whatever. Same thing stands.

ETA: this isn't to say that Fordham would be a terrible choice (especially with some scholarship). But you're leaving out some perfectly good schools for no reason. You don't need ties to work in NYC from a T14.

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WhiteGuy5
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby WhiteGuy5 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:42 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:
WhiteGuy5 wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:Jesus, you made your recommenders write EIGHT different letters?

Generally, people have their recommenders write one generic letter, and only do a school-specific letter if they have something specific to say about that school (e.g. they also went there or whatever).

I would think that #9-14 still place fine in NYC and you probably should have blanketed the whole T14. With a 167, you're not getting into HY, Stanford's iffy, and you're a big splitter at CCNM. That's 7 of the top 8 that are by no means guaranteed.

EDIT: Oops, you said that you would prefer to go to school in NYC, not work there. But my opinion isn't changed. IMO #9-14 are still better choices than Fordham, unless you get some humongous scholarship.


No. I would rather work in the city.
Well, whatever. Same thing stands.


Well -- here was my logic. The T14 according to the traditional USNWR rankings are not ranked in the same order according to the Law Firms ranking (http://www.usnews.com/education/best-gr ... aw-schools). I'm applying with my eye more on that list than anything else. I took out schools I know I would NOT want to go to/areas I know I would NOT want to live around out of that list and applied in that way.

A school like Cornell - officially ranked #13 is tied at 8 in the Firm list -- it is easier to get into than most of the T14, it's a school I would much rather go to and an area I would much rather be in. Plus it's closer to NYC where my family is.

Coldly applying to the T14 without other considerations is, I think, not a good idea.

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rinkrat19
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby rinkrat19 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:52 pm

WhiteGuy5 wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
WhiteGuy5 wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:Jesus, you made your recommenders write EIGHT different letters?

Generally, people have their recommenders write one generic letter, and only do a school-specific letter if they have something specific to say about that school (e.g. they also went there or whatever).

I would think that #9-14 still place fine in NYC and you probably should have blanketed the whole T14. With a 167, you're not getting into HY, Stanford's iffy, and you're a big splitter at CCNM. That's 7 of the top 8 that are by no means guaranteed.

EDIT: Oops, you said that you would prefer to go to school in NYC, not work there. But my opinion isn't changed. IMO #9-14 are still better choices than Fordham, unless you get some humongous scholarship.
No. I would rather work in the city.
Well, whatever. Same thing stands.


Well -- here was my logic. The T14 according to the traditional USNWR rankings are not ranked in the same order according to the Law Firms ranking (http://www.usnews.com/education/best-gr ... aw-schools). I'm applying with my eye more on that list than anything else. I took out schools I know I would NOT want to go to/areas I know I would NOT want to live around out of that list and applied in that way.

A school like Cornell - officially ranked #13 is tied at 8 in the Firm list -- it is easier to get into than most of the T14, it's a school I would much rather go to and an area I would much rather be in. Plus it's closer to NYC where my family is.

Coldly applying to the T14 without other considerations is, I think, not a good idea.
If you're talking about 1-8 on that list, how is anyone supposed to know that? Use the same list as everyone else, c'mon. "Reputation" is a dumb rankings list anyway. How about percentage of graduating class actually hired by NLJ250 firms? http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2483173162
Cornell would be a fine choice (last year's unusually good placement is thought to be something of an outlier, however)
If there's somewhere in the T14 you would just be miserable in for three years (like I would kill myself if forced to spend more than 10 minutes in Virginia or North Carolina. It's just not debateable), rule those out. But recognize that T14 schools all get the NYC firms at OCI.

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WhiteGuy5
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby WhiteGuy5 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:56 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:If you're talking about 1-8 on that list, how is anyone supposed to know that? Use the same list as everyone else, c'mon. "Reputation" is a dumb rankings list anyway. How about percentage of graduating class actually hired by NLJ250 firms? http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2483173162
Cornell would be a fine choice (last year's unusually good placement is thought to be something of an outlier, however)
If there's somewhere in the T14 you would just be miserable in for three years (like I would kill myself if forced to spend more than 10 minutes in Virginia or North Carolina. It's just not debateable), rule those out. But recognize that T14 schools all get the NYC firms at OCI.


I do. I'm just saying...I don't want to go to Duke or Northwestern or Michigan or UVA...regardless of their ranking. Hence, my choices.

Thanks for the reply.

pwyoung
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby pwyoung » Thu Oct 06, 2011 6:08 pm

Ask for advice > Disregard advice once given

Quality thread structure.

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WhiteGuy5
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby WhiteGuy5 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 2:31 am

pwyoung wrote:Ask for advice > Disregard advice once given

Quality thread structure.


I didn't disregard his advice. The schools I am NOT applying to in the T14 are schools that I specifically don't want to go to, which is what he was saying actually.

And since when is the OP expected to take the advice given? Was that really worth one of your precious posts?

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lzyovrachievr
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby lzyovrachievr » Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:40 pm

WhiteGuy5 wrote:My question is...am I making a mistake?


Being a douchebag to people who post in your thread would generally be considered this. HTH.

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bk1
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby bk1 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:46 pm

WhiteGuy5 wrote:I do. I'm just saying...I don't want to go to Duke or Northwestern or Michigan or UVA...regardless of their ranking. Hence, my choices.


You're okay with Chicago but not NU? You're okay with GULC/Cornell but not UVa/Duke/UMich? I don't get it. Look at it this way:

Ends: working in NYC.
Means: going to a T14>Fordham.

It's foolish to dismiss Duke/NU/UMich/UVa when you express desire is to be a lawyer in NYC. You should go to those schools over Fordham (though one could make an argument for Fordham if there was decent scholarship money).

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WhiteGuy5
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby WhiteGuy5 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:09 pm

bk1 wrote:
WhiteGuy5 wrote:I do. I'm just saying...I don't want to go to Duke or Northwestern or Michigan or UVA...regardless of their ranking. Hence, my choices.


You're okay with Chicago but not NU? You're okay with GULC/Cornell but not UVa/Duke/UMich? I don't get it. Look at it this way:

Ends: working in NYC.
Means: going to a T14>Fordham.

It's foolish to dismiss Duke/NU/UMich/UVa when you express desire is to be a lawyer in NYC. You should go to those schools over Fordham (though one could make an argument for Fordham if there was decent scholarship money).


Well if I'm getting into Duke/NU/UMich/UVA I'm also probably getting into Cornell or Georgetown am I not? Schools lower on the list/easier to get into but schools that I would MUCH rather go to. In fact, if I'm getting into Duke/NU/UMich/UVA, I'm probably getting into Cornell/GULC with some scholarship too. Is it so insane to not want to go to Duke/NU/UMich/UVA?

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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby bk1 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:22 pm

WhiteGuy5 wrote:Well if I'm getting into Duke/NU/UMich/UVA I'm also probably getting into Cornell or Georgetown am I not? Schools lower on the list/easier to get into but schools that I would MUCH rather go to. In fact, if I'm getting into Duke/NU/UMich/UVA, I'm probably getting into Cornell/GULC with some scholarship too. Is it so insane to not want to go to Duke/NU/UMich/UVA?


Yes it is generally true, but the admissions/scholarship process is not nearly as rote as you are making it out to be. The schools ranked 7-14 have pretty much the same medians (with slight variations). Most of the lower T14 are essentially peers in terms of admissions, and depending on your numbers Cornell/UMich are the most lenient to lower LSAT's whereas UVa/GULC tend to be easiest on lower GPA's.

Is it wrong to not want to go certain T14's? No, but it would be foolish to not apply to them when your goal is to work in NYC and there is a possibility that you wouldn't get into the other T14's.

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rinkrat19
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby rinkrat19 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:24 pm

WhiteGuy5 wrote:
bk1 wrote:
WhiteGuy5 wrote:I do. I'm just saying...I don't want to go to Duke or Northwestern or Michigan or UVA...regardless of their ranking. Hence, my choices.


You're okay with Chicago but not NU? You're okay with GULC/Cornell but not UVa/Duke/UMich? I don't get it. Look at it this way:

Ends: working in NYC.
Means: going to a T14>Fordham.

It's foolish to dismiss Duke/NU/UMich/UVa when you express desire is to be a lawyer in NYC. You should go to those schools over Fordham (though one could make an argument for Fordham if there was decent scholarship money).


Well if I'm getting into Duke/NU/UMich/UVA I'm also probably getting into Cornell or Georgetown am I not? Schools lower on the list/easier to get into but schools that I would MUCH rather go to. In fact, if I'm getting into Duke/NU/UMich/UVA, I'm probably getting into Cornell/GULC with some scholarship too. Is it so insane to not want to go to Duke/NU/UMich/UVA?
Cornell/GULC over NU is arguably kinda dumb because you're willing to go to UChi, so clearly the city is not a deal-breaker (and NU is in a much cooler part of the city, btw), but you'd rather go to a lower-ranked school than NU...why? I mean, either location is a problem or it's not. We're trying to figure out your logic, and you're not being consistent.

Two more arguments:
1) you may not get INTO the T14s you think you will, and NU/Mich/UVA are splitter-friendly.
2) some T14s negotiate scholarships, and you'll need as much money from as many peer schools as possible. Sometimes applying to a school you have ZERO intention of attending can actually pay off.

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WhiteGuy5
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby WhiteGuy5 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 2:10 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:
WhiteGuy5 wrote:
bk1 wrote:
WhiteGuy5 wrote:I do. I'm just saying...I don't want to go to Duke or Northwestern or Michigan or UVA...regardless of their ranking. Hence, my choices.


You're okay with Chicago but not NU? You're okay with GULC/Cornell but not UVa/Duke/UMich? I don't get it. Look at it this way:

Ends: working in NYC.
Means: going to a T14>Fordham.

It's foolish to dismiss Duke/NU/UMich/UVa when you express desire is to be a lawyer in NYC. You should go to those schools over Fordham (though one could make an argument for Fordham if there was decent scholarship money).


Well if I'm getting into Duke/NU/UMich/UVA I'm also probably getting into Cornell or Georgetown am I not? Schools lower on the list/easier to get into but schools that I would MUCH rather go to. In fact, if I'm getting into Duke/NU/UMich/UVA, I'm probably getting into Cornell/GULC with some scholarship too. Is it so insane to not want to go to Duke/NU/UMich/UVA?
Cornell/GULC over NU is arguably kinda dumb because you're willing to go to UChi, so clearly the city is not a deal-breaker (and NU is in a much cooler part of the city, btw), but you'd rather go to a lower-ranked school than NU...why? I mean, either location is a problem or it's not. We're trying to figure out your logic, and you're not being consistent.

Two more arguments:
1) you may not get INTO the T14s you think you will, and NU/Mich/UVA are splitter-friendly.
2) some T14s negotiate scholarships, and you'll need as much money from as many peer schools as possible. Sometimes applying to a school you have ZERO intention of attending can actually pay off.


Agreed, generally. I just rather stay closer to NY for personal/family reasons. So if I'm going to have to leave it should be for a pretty awesome school like UChic, whereas NU does not excite me.

Anyway, I'll reconsider applying to 7-12.

pwyoung
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Re: UnknownLSAT/3.85 DId I Make a Fatal Mistake?

Postby pwyoung » Sat Oct 08, 2011 2:53 am

WhiteGuy5 wrote:
pwyoung wrote:Ask for advice > Disregard advice once given

Quality thread structure.


I didn't disregard his advice. The schools I am NOT applying to in the T14 are schools that I specifically don't want to go to, which is what he was saying actually.

And since when is the OP expected to take the advice given? Was that really worth one of your precious posts?


Precious posts? Are they in limited reserve or something?




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