U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

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Voyager
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby Voyager » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:28 pm

In person? He certainly was. His rhetoric was awful and insane. But think about it: a guy that makes his life fleecing people has to be good at sales... at connecting with people. And he was.

Voyager
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby Voyager » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:28 pm

NancyBotwin wrote:
Voyager wrote:Sorry you are going through a rough patch here. I am not being vulgar or calling anyone names or attacking anyone personally.


Excuse me?
Voyager wrote:

3) This dean is a filthy liar and thief. A parasite who has been preying on young people who are just getting a start in life. Stop protecting him. You sound like Jerry Falwell apologists right after he appeared on CNN and announced that god caused 9/11 to punish us. Jerry Falwell came across as a really nice guy in person, by the way.


Yeah. STFU.


Uh, he did lie.

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JCougar
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby JCougar » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:29 pm

Yukos wrote:
muaythaifighter wrote:LOL wow, what happened? i thought their 25th was 163 last year. and that was an egregious act of data manipulation btw.


Confirmed 25th was 163 last year, that would be a hell of a fall if genuine...

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/loca ... 0129.story


That article does not say that the 163 25th %ile was confirmed. Just because US News publishes it doesn't mean anything. US News gets their numbers from the school.

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bjsesq
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby bjsesq » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:29 pm

Voyager wrote:See, that quote is the sort of thing which one would normally assume would result in moderation of some sort. Also, the quote actually makes no sense in light of the exchange.


It makes perfect sense. You are being intentionally dense. Seriously, just leave this thread. I don't give a fuck how long you've been on TLS.

Voyager
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby Voyager » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:31 pm

bjsesq wrote:
Voyager wrote:See, that quote is the sort of thing which one would normally assume would result in moderation of some sort. Also, the quote actually makes no sense in light of the exchange.


It makes perfect sense. You are being intentionally dense. Seriously, just leave this thread. I don't give a fuck how long you've been on TLS.


No. I was saying that a 163 to 165 error cannot be due to something innocuous, like rounding. I hope that clears it up.

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NancyBotwin
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby NancyBotwin » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:31 pm

Voyager wrote:Uh, he did lie.


You have absolutely zero proof of that. All you are going on is your assumption based on the 5 point drop. You have no proof that it was not a mistake.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby Voyager » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:32 pm

NancyBotwin wrote:
Voyager wrote:Uh, he did lie.


You have absolutely zero proof of that. All you are going on is your assumption based on the 5 point drop. You have no proof that it was not a mistake.


True. I don't. Seems like a pretty huge error, though, on one of the KEY metrics schools report on.

Also, (and please correct me if I am wrong), but didn't the school ALSO inflate its GPA?
Last edited by Voyager on Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bjsesq
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby bjsesq » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:33 pm

Voyager wrote:
NancyBotwin wrote:
Voyager wrote:Uh, he did lie.


You have absolutely zero proof of that. All you are going on is your assumption based on the 5 point drop. You have no proof that it was not a mistake.


True. I don't. Seems like a pretty huge error, though, on one of the KEY metrics schools report on.


But he's a filthy liar and a thief, right?

MrAnon
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby MrAnon » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:33 pm

And please, no. Pless's threads were/are great sources of information. Even if this IS him, he still dedicated a lot of time and effort to this site and had a significant, positive impact.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby NancyBotwin » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:34 pm

Voyager wrote:Also, (and please correct me if I am wrong), but didn't the school ALSO inflate its GPA?


2 similar and related mistakes =/= intent.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby minnbills » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:34 pm

NancyBotwin wrote:
Voyager wrote:Uh, he did lie.


You have absolutely zero proof of that. All you are going on is your assumption based on the 5 point drop. You have no proof that it was not a mistake.


Well, it seems hard to believe this could just be some sort of error at this point. Unless there are hardly any students between 163 and 168 which would make some mathematical error possible, but that seems unlikely as well.

Voyager
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby Voyager » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:34 pm

bjsesq wrote:
Voyager wrote:
NancyBotwin wrote:
Voyager wrote:Uh, he did lie.


You have absolutely zero proof of that. All you are going on is your assumption based on the 5 point drop. You have no proof that it was not a mistake.


True. I don't. Seems like a pretty huge error, though, on one of the KEY metrics schools report on.


But he's a filthy liar and a thief, right?


Pretty much what I am going with, yes. 5 point LSAT error+huge GPA error+dude pulled out of position?

Yeah, I am going to roll with the liar theory.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby Thirteen » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:35 pm

MrAnon wrote:
And please, no. Pless's threads were/are great sources of information. Even if this IS him, he still dedicated a lot of time and effort to this site and had a significant, positive impact.


He helped me land on my feet at SMU. Sounds like a significant, positive impact on the life of a TLS poster.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby MrAnon » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:36 pm

Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby bjsesq » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:37 pm

MrAnon wrote:Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?


How the fuck could one person know that without access to the rest of the data?

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minnbills
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby minnbills » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:39 pm

bjsesq wrote:
MrAnon wrote:Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?


How the fuck could one person know that without access to the rest of the data?


+1

There are people below median at every law school in the nation...

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MBZags
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby MBZags » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:39 pm

MrAnon wrote:Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?


No. No. No.

muaythaifighter
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby muaythaifighter » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:39 pm

while i disagree with voyager's insensitivity to this topic, i do agree that this was not a simple mistake. how do you make a mistake of putting a 168 instead of a 163? those two are completely different things. also, it was not just the LSAT, it was the GPA as well. i think you need to be angrier at Pless and the admissions office and tell them to do something. Even in the off chance that this is just a mistake and not a blatant deception, it is still their job to ensure this does not happen.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby MrAnon » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:40 pm

bjsesq wrote:
MrAnon wrote:Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?


How the fuck could one person know that without access to the rest of the data?


Okay but what is the end game? They should all be at a better school? At the end of the day the school is ranked according to the composition of the student body. They will fall to the place they are supposed to be at, instead of being artificially inflated. I mean if you want to transfer out, where are you getting in with a 163 LSAT? I'd be happy with UIUC.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby dresden doll » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:40 pm

bjsesq wrote:
MrAnon wrote:Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?


How the fuck could one person know that without access to the rest of the data?


You're supposed to immediately perceive that you couldn't have possibly been 'that good.' Duh.

Voyager
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby Voyager » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:41 pm

So...
168 vs 163
3.81 v 3.70

Seems fairly egregious to me.

If you hold these people's feet to the fire, you will help your peers at other schools keep their own administrators in line.

I am very much in the corner of the Illinios law students. I am also disgusted by the way all law schools screw with their employment data. It never occured to me that schools would lie about employment data as well.

If you people keep protecting them and swallowing their lies then it becomes much less likely that the law schools will ever be forced to change. Law students need to demand change. Otherwise these people are going to keep screwing you.

We need the ABA to start taking hard action on all law schools.

Also, ending one dean's career helps scare other deans into having a grip on their school's numbers at minimum and may prevent lying.
Last edited by Voyager on Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:44 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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bjsesq
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby bjsesq » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:41 pm

MrAnon wrote:
bjsesq wrote:
MrAnon wrote:Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?


How the fuck could one person know that without access to the rest of the data?


Okay but what is the end game? They should all be at a better school? At the end of the day the school is ranked according to the composition of the student body. They will fall to the place they are supposed to be at, instead of being artificially inflated. I mean if you want to transfer out, where are you getting in with a 163 LSAT? I'd be happy with UIUC.


You just moved the goalposts. First it was about what the law students knew, and how they should have known. Now it's about what the numbers actually are. Settle on one argument.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby Kilpatrick » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:43 pm

MrAnon wrote:Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?

muaythaifighter
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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby muaythaifighter » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:43 pm

i can't believe ppl think pless is a honest man based on the fact that he posts here with advice. with the facts so far, it seems like he has lied which he has done in the past with letting applicants in in exchange for jobs from corrupted people.

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Re: U. of Illinois Law suspends Dean of Admissions

Postby MrAnon » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:47 pm

bjsesq wrote:
MrAnon wrote:
bjsesq wrote:
MrAnon wrote:Look the truth is UIUC students are blowing this out of proportion. You all know what your LSAT scores were; did you think you got that lucky and got admitted to a school with a median LSAT score that much higher??? Must have thought those softs were really working for you? In the back of your mind, you had to know that something was amiss, right?


How the fuck could one person know that without access to the rest of the data?


Okay but what is the end game? They should all be at a better school? At the end of the day the school is ranked according to the composition of the student body. They will fall to the place they are supposed to be at, instead of being artificially inflated. I mean if you want to transfer out, where are you getting in with a 163 LSAT? I'd be happy with UIUC.


You just moved the goalposts. First it was about what the law students knew, and how they should have known. Now it's about what the numbers actually are. Settle on one argument.


The bottom line is that every student will do precisely what the university wants - shut up and not rock the boat.




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