Suffolk Law grad,127K debt,jobless,living at home, taking Qs Forum

[existenz]

That sucks OP. Good luck on the bar though, hopefully that associate position materializes.

[scrowell]

Just popped back in. Sorry guys but I do have a day job to gain some money so I will not be on the forum all the time. I will try to answer some more questions but I made this thread in hopes to provide advice to future 1L students of lower ranked schools. An update, I have a few interviews tomorrow but a family friend has offered me an associate position at his small firm in NH pending that I pass the bar. My starting salary will be between 45 - 55K which takes a lot of the pressure off. Needless to say I am extremely excited as he told me a few months ago that he was not going to take on any new people.

Sweet dude, really happy for you!

[lisjjen]

The flame wars on here were fun the summer before my Senior year, but now they're just exhausting. I'll restate my original position. It is hilarious to see 0Ls condescendingly. tell. graduates what to do.

Offering constructive criticisms and friendly suggestions is reasonable. Feeling like you can look down your nose at OP because you were accepted to a higher ranked institution than the graduate who has worked in firms is ridiculous.

I haven't seen any of that here. People seem genuinely sympathetic and are simply weighing in on the situation. If the OP didn't want that, he should keep his problems off the internet.

Also, I'm not an 0L.

RC Fail. The one poster who was most critical is obviously a flame. As in, they have one post.

[Noval]

Just popped back in. Sorry guys but I do have a day job to gain some money so I will not be on the forum all the time. I will try to answer some more questions but I made this thread in hopes to provide advice to future 1L students of lower ranked schools. An update, I have a few interviews tomorrow but a family friend has offered me an associate position at his small firm in NH pending that I pass the bar. My starting salary will be between 45 - 55K which takes a lot of the pressure off. Needless to say I am extremely excited as he told me a few months ago that he was not going to take on any new people.

That's great ! Now you have a way to start your career as a Lawyer, now be careful and don't take any more retarded risks.

45-55k might now be paradise, but it's enough to get started.

Try to find a creative way to pay back your loans, or apply to JAG (Trying is better than not trying...even with the 5% selection rate).

[Blessedassurance]

Try to find a creative way to pay back your loans, or apply to JAG (Trying is better than not trying...even with the 5% selection rate).

Military and civilian life are two very different things. It's generally not a good idea to join for the purposes of mitigating one's debt situation. You can't just throw it around as a viable alternative. It's like telling unemployed college graduates to join the Army.

This is not to say it's not a viable option for some people.

[Naked Dude]

Congrats OP. Kick ass and enjoy New Hampshire.

[Blessedassurance]

Good luck, OP!

Irony (noun):

The very fact that you've secured employment means someone that knows you (acquaintance or otherwise) is going to go to Suffolk because they know someone who went to Suffolk and got a job as a lawyer.

[robotclubmember]

naked dude asks,"I am just an 0L, but is advising the guy to spend more money on another degree sage wisdom? I just took a bartending course with a guy who just graduated with a Tax LLM from Northwestern."

Response: Accounting firms are always hiring tax professionals. I would bet that an LLM from Northwestern in tax would get him a job with one of the big 4 accounting firm if he did reasonably well. His problem,however, is that he might eventually have to take courses in order to site for the CPA,which would be a bummer while he is working full time. However, I think some of these firms will make someone a principal without having the CPA. Some research on this would be warranted.

Swing and a miss! As someone working at an accounting firm, I can categorically say that this is false. As usual, taxguy is wrong.

Big Four has a demand for tax lawyers. Then there is a supply of lawyers which exceeds that demand.

Big Four is not "always hiring." They laid off 30% of our office in 2008/2009, tax professionals included. His problem is not taking the CPA. His problem is the fact that these endless Big Four jobs you speak of are actually very limited.

[Naked Dude]

naked dude asks,"I am just an 0L, but is advising the guy to spend more money on another degree sage wisdom? I just took a bartending course with a guy who just graduated with a Tax LLM from Northwestern."

Response: Accounting firms are always hiring tax professionals. I would bet that an LLM from Northwestern in tax would get him a job with one of the big 4 accounting firm if he did reasonably well. His problem,however, is that he might eventually have to take courses in order to site for the CPA,which would be a bummer while he is working full time. However, I think some of these firms will make someone a principal without having the CPA. Some research on this would be warranted.

Swing and a miss! As someone working at an accounting firm, I can categorically say that this is false. As usual, taxguy is wrong.

Big Four has a demand for tax lawyers. Then there is a supply of lawyers which exceeds that demand.

Big Four is not "always hiring." They laid off 30% of our office in 2008/2009, tax professionals included. His problem is not taking the CPA. His problem is the fact that these endless Big Four jobs you speak of are actually very limited.

What I'm told is, and correct me if I'm wrong, is that a niche like tax has a higher than average job satisfaction (i.e. it attracts people who "like" the intellectual work) and thus has a lower burnout rate than, say, litigation, and therefore there's less turnover.

[NYC Law]

naked dude asks,"I am just an 0L, but is advising the guy to spend more money on another degree sage wisdom? I just took a bartending course with a guy who just graduated with a Tax LLM from Northwestern."

Response: Accounting firms are always hiring tax professionals. I would bet that an LLM from Northwestern in tax would get him a job with one of the big 4 accounting firm if he did reasonably well. His problem,however, is that he might eventually have to take courses in order to site for the CPA,which would be a bummer while he is working full time. However, I think some of these firms will make someone a principal without having the CPA. Some research on this would be warranted.

Swing and a miss! As someone working at an accounting firm, I can categorically say that this is false. As usual, taxguy is wrong.

Big Four has a demand for tax lawyers. Then there is a supply of lawyers which exceeds that demand.

Big Four is not "always hiring." They laid off 30% of our office in 2008/2009, tax professionals included. His problem is not taking the CPA. His problem is the fact that these endless Big Four jobs you speak of are actually very limited.

5 bucks says taxguy knows more about the tax and accounting industry than you.

[scammedhard]

Good luck, OP!

Irony (noun):

The very fact that you've secured employment means someone that knows you (acquaintance or otherwise) is going to go to Suffolk because they know someone who went to Suffolk and got a job as a lawyer.

It's pretty ironic indeed. I hope people realize the OP (and anyone who attends law school with little scholarship money) really have two issues to deal with: 1) Finding a legal job; 2) Paying the debt. I think OP has fulfilled 1, but he still needs to deal with 2. In any case OP, today was much better than yesterday and, hopefully, tomorrow will be better than today; we can only hope that your situation will keep improving. Congrats and good luck!

[Naked Dude]

Does OP have sizeable undergrad debt? I know of many people who spent more on undergrad and sure as shit didn't start out making 50k. All told, if that's all 7 years of postsecondary education cost, could be much worse. Not an enviable situation, but hardly an outlier.

[robotclubmember]

naked dude asks,"I am just an 0L, but is advising the guy to spend more money on another degree sage wisdom? I just took a bartending course with a guy who just graduated with a Tax LLM from Northwestern."

Response: Accounting firms are always hiring tax professionals. I would bet that an LLM from Northwestern in tax would get him a job with one of the big 4 accounting firm if he did reasonably well. His problem,however, is that he might eventually have to take courses in order to site for the CPA,which would be a bummer while he is working full time. However, I think some of these firms will make someone a principal without having the CPA. Some research on this would be warranted.

Swing and a miss! As someone working at an accounting firm, I can categorically say that this is false. As usual, taxguy is wrong.

Big Four has a demand for tax lawyers. Then there is a supply of lawyers which exceeds that demand.

Big Four is not "always hiring." They laid off 30% of our office in 2008/2009, tax professionals included. His problem is not taking the CPA. His problem is the fact that these endless Big Four jobs you speak of are actually very limited.

5 bucks says taxguy knows more about the tax and accounting industry than you.

PM me and I'll tell ya where to write that check out to. It's just like how he knew more than the admissions process than everyone on TLS. Anyone remember that? Because he "talked to the admissions counselors personally."

People who have been in the industry for a while and are seasoned veterans have a tendency to treat the job market for entry as the same as what it was when they entered. It is quite different. The thing is, I know he's wrong because objectively, he's wrong. You just think that he might know something more about this, probably based off of his stellar track record as a prophet on TLS.

[cinephile]

Just popped back in. Sorry guys but I do have a day job to gain some money so I will not be on the forum all the time. I will try to answer some more questions but I made this thread in hopes to provide advice to future 1L students of lower ranked schools. An update, I have a few interviews tomorrow but a family friend has offered me an associate position at his small firm in NH pending that I pass the bar. My starting salary will be between 45 - 55K which takes a lot of the pressure off. Needless to say I am extremely excited as he told me a few months ago that he was not going to take on any new people.

Good luck!

[pft]

From reading his posts advising accounting undergrads on another forum, taxguy doesn't have a clue about large firms, although that hardly keeps him from dispensing tons of advice. It's funny seeing students lapping up everything he posts because he acts authoritative and has a high post count.

As for the Big 4, there is a constant demand for tax accountants, not tax lawyers. JDs are frequently hired, but strong evidence of an ability to succeed in tax accounting will be required.

[FeelTheHeat]

From reading his posts advising accounting undergrads on another forum, taxguy doesn't have a clue about large firms, although that hardly keeps him from dispensing tons of advice. It's funny seeing students lapping up everything he posts because he acts authoritative and has a high post count.

I hope you are saying people don't lap up everything he says on this board. He is universally derided on these boards and posters are frequently suspended for blatantly insulting him. A lot of his schtick is disagreeable, to be sure, but he is a lot more informed than the 1Ls who gasbag advice and whose extent of knowledge of the legal field is what they pick up on TLS.

[lebron 4 president]

Just pondering here and sorry if this question was already asked but OP; does Suffolk have a LRAP program?

[NYC Law]

From reading his posts advising accounting undergrads on another forum, taxguy doesn't have a clue about large firms, although that hardly keeps him from dispensing tons of advice. It's funny seeing students lapping up everything he posts because he acts authoritative and has a high post count.

I hope you are saying people don't lap up everything he says on this board. He is universally derided on these boards and posters are frequently suspended for blatantly insulting him. A lot of his schtick is disagreeable, to be sure, but he is a lot more informed than the 1Ls who gasbag advice and whose extent of knowledge of the legal field is what they pick up on TLS.

No one laps up taxguy. But the guy seems to know taxes (not from his post count or the fact his name is 'tax guy', but more relating to the leak of his RL identity).

[Helmholtz]

Just pondering here and sorry if this question was already asked but OP; does Suffolk have a LRAP program?

I think that at Suffolk you have to compete among other public interest people for a very limited number of LRAP handouts.

Confirmed:

"LRAP recipients will be selected based on type of employment, salary, loan debt, financial need, and available funding. . . . Award amounts will vary, not to exceed $6,000 per year. Approximately 15 new recipients are selected each year."

Anybody else need a reason not to go to Suffolk?

[schooner]

From reading his posts advising accounting undergrads on another forum, taxguy doesn't have a clue about large firms, although that hardly keeps him from dispensing tons of advice. It's funny seeing students lapping up everything he posts because he acts authoritative and has a high post count.

I hope you are saying people don't lap up everything he says on this board. He is universally derided on these boards and posters are frequently suspended for blatantly insulting him. A lot of his schtick is disagreeable, to be sure, but he is a lot more informed than the 1Ls who gasbag advice and whose extent of knowledge of the legal field is what they pick up on TLS.

The threads seem to be well-policed so that anyone posting bad advice or acting up tends to get called out. (I'm speaking from personal experience: I've also posted plenty of dumb things and somebody always eventually corrected me.) I think one of the best things about TLS is the way you can crowdsource advice from a lot of really smart people.

Anyway, OP, congrats on finding a job - you should definitely go celebrate. (Then help out other alumni if you can.) Good luck!

[Naked Dude]

From reading his posts advising accounting undergrads on another forum, taxguy doesn't have a clue about large firms, although that hardly keeps him from dispensing tons of advice. It's funny seeing students lapping up everything he posts because he acts authoritative and has a high post count.

As for the Big 4, there is a constant demand for tax accountants, not tax lawyers. JDs are frequently hired, but strong evidence of an ability to succeed in tax accounting will be required.

Hypothetically, how would someone with a nonbusiness major and no finance/accounting experience get their foot in the door? I'm pretty set on law school now, but I just wonder.

[schooner]

From reading his posts advising accounting undergrads on another forum, taxguy doesn't have a clue about large firms, although that hardly keeps him from dispensing tons of advice. It's funny seeing students lapping up everything he posts because he acts authoritative and has a high post count.

As for the Big 4, there is a constant demand for tax accountants, not tax lawyers. JDs are frequently hired, but strong evidence of an ability to succeed in tax accounting will be required.

Hypothetically, how would someone with a nonbusiness major and no finance/accounting experience get their foot in the door? I'm pretty set on law school now, but I just wonder.

Nepotism.

[pft]

I hope you are saying people don't lap up everything he says on this board.

Yeah I was talking about the other forum.

Hypothetically, how would someone with a nonbusiness major and no finance/accounting experience get their foot in the door? I'm pretty set on law school now, but I just wonder.

A one year MS Tax will get you a chance, assuming you will also be taking enough accounting to meet your state's CPA education requirements.

[taxguy]

First, I know someone who just recently got a tax job with a big 4, although some of the big 4 have laid off people.

Secondly, the person that I knew had both an accounting and law background. Thus, you need to call someone at these firms and see what happens if you only have an LLM in tax. I wouldn't just blithely spend 50 grand more without some investigation. I can say that as little as three years ago, many accounting firms were hiring tax pros. I honestly don't know what is going on with each of these firms now. However, I would bet that tax positions are still available.

[ndirish2010]

Well I'm glad this thread ended well.