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Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 3:21 am
by re-applicant
Veyron wrote:
yngblkgifted wrote:
ntugwater wrote:
yngblkgifted wrote:What's up with their rankings? They seem to fluctuate more than any other school in the T14. Though I hate to sound like a prestige whore, what is the general consensus of the school's actual ranking? Is it a T10? T 14? The reason I am asking is because I am considering going there for law school. At the end of the day, it won't sway my decision any particular way but I am just kind of curious as to how legal employers tend to regard Berkeley?


Where do you want to work? If you want to work on the west coast and cant get into stanford, then go for it. If you want to work on east coast, then I'd say Berkeley is ~T20. Probably slightly better than UCLA.


For the sake of this thread, I will say that I am not set on a specific geographical location. Would you say the same thing about UVA on the West Coast? Would it be T 20ish?


No. Berk gets less respect in NYC than UVA gets in LA. That being said, LA is a much harder market to crack than NYC.


I can assure you that very few people in California know what a UVA is.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 3:52 am
by Kronk
Berkeley goes east. Berkeley is one of the best universities top to bottom in the world. That doesn't stop at the California borders.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:36 am
by glewz
re-applicant wrote:
Veyron wrote:
yngblkgifted wrote:
ntugwater wrote:Where do you want to work? If you want to work on the west coast and cant get into stanford, then go for it. If you want to work on east coast, then I'd say Berkeley is ~T20. Probably slightly better than UCLA.


For the sake of this thread, I will say that I am not set on a specific geographical location. Would you say the same thing about UVA on the West Coast? Would it be T 20ish?


No. Berk gets less respect in NYC than UVA gets in LA. That being said, LA is a much harder market to crack than NYC.


I can assure you that very few people in California know what a UVA is.


No joke. I've been all over CA. No One knows what UVA is.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:38 am
by yngblkgifted
Veyron wrote:
yngblkgifted wrote:
ntugwater wrote:
yngblkgifted wrote:What's up with their rankings? They seem to fluctuate more than any other school in the T14. Though I hate to sound like a prestige whore, what is the general consensus of the school's actual ranking? Is it a T10? T 14? The reason I am asking is because I am considering going there for law school. At the end of the day, it won't sway my decision any particular way but I am just kind of curious as to how legal employers tend to regard Berkeley?


Where do you want to work? If you want to work on the west coast and cant get into stanford, then go for it. If you want to work on east coast, then I'd say Berkeley is ~T20. Probably slightly better than UCLA.


For the sake of this thread, I will say that I am not set on a specific geographical location. Would you say the same thing about UVA on the West Coast? Would it be T 20ish?


No. Berk gets less respect in NYC than UVA gets in LA. That being said, LA is a much harder market to crack than NYC.



I find that extremely hard to believe. Anybody else have thoughts on this?

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:59 am
by dkt4
yngblkgifted wrote:I find that extremely hard to believe. Anybody else have thoughts on this?


it's hard to believe because its not particularly accurate.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:09 am
by LAWLAW09
yngblkgifted wrote: I am just kind of curious as to how legal employers tend to regard Berkeley?



OP, is an AA male. Berkeley students: Any thoughts as to how his URM status might affect his ability to return to the east coast? NY? DC?


fyi: I am in a similar situation as the OP.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:13 am
by djfe4president
I dont think the ability to move out east is effected. Think about it..California is just as nice as places such as New York. I think people move out east because they were born there...

If you went to Michigan though, there is more of a tendency to move because there is nothing there

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:17 am
by yngblkgifted
LAWLAW09 wrote:
yngblkgifted wrote: I am just kind of curious as to how legal employers tend to regard Berkeley?



OP, is an AA male. Berkeley students: Any thoughts as to how his URM status might affect his ability to return to the east coast? NY? DC?


fyi: I am in a similar situation as the OP.


Thanks lawlaw09, I would appreciate more thoughts on this too.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:34 am
by Patriot1208
djfe4president wrote:I dont think the ability to move out east is effected. Think about it..California is just as nice as places such as New York. I think people move out east because they were born there...

If you went to Michigan though, there is more of a tendency to move because there is nothing there

You have a gift with your indisputable logic.

OP, for a serious answer and really what my sarcasm was intended for, both schools will get you across the country equally fine. Berk, in the legal profession, is not more highly regarded than UVA and UVA is not more highly regarded than Berk. Some firms will prefer one school over the other but that is life. But if you go to one and want to move across the country be prepared to have to do a little more legwork yourself and probably have some more limited options. Quite a few less west coast firms go to UVA than east coast firms and vice versa. So, if you know you want to be on the east coast, UVA is a better option simply because of the increased number of firms you will be exposed to. It's the same for berk and the west coast. Stop worrying about slight differences in prestige, there isn't any. People, in the legal profession, do not respect Berk more than UVA. Also, a lot of people on the west coast seem to think Berk is more prestigious than it is, don't let that fool you.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:29 pm
by Rotor
glewz wrote:
re-applicant wrote:I can assure you that very few people in California know what a UVA is.


No joke. I've been all over CA. No One knows what UVA is.


While this may be close to true for lay reputation, that's a FAR cry from the reputation the school has with the folks who matter for OP's question: Hiring partners/committees and other legal professionals. With them, UVA and UCB are roughly on par with one another. As others have said there will be some personal variation and probably some market variation for that rep.

And Veyron's breakdown is a nice way to break down the issue and could be where my intuition about Berk's ability to move east comes from (though I hadn't analyzed to that level).

School Rep*Number of Jobs on Other Coast=Ability to Move between coasts. I think that the east coast's huge advantage with NY/DC vs. SF/LA in the second variable more than wipes out any marginal difference between how Berk is perceived back east.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:39 pm
by clone22
Drake014 wrote:
clone22 wrote:Is it a T14? Almost definitely.


Almost definitely? Exactly why is there an almost in that statement?

Is it a woman if it has a vagine? Almost definitely.

If its Berkeley Law is it a T14? Definitely. No almost.


Easy bro :). I'm probably going to be attending berk this fall because I think it's an amazing institution. I just didn't want to deal in absolutes so I thought to qualify it, much like you did with the woman/vagine concept.

cheers

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:41 pm
by yngblkgifted
Rotor wrote:
glewz wrote:
re-applicant wrote:I can assure you that very few people in California know what a UVA is.


No joke. I've been all over CA. No One knows what UVA is.


While this may be close to true for lay reputation, that's a FAR cry from the reputation the school has with the folks who matter for OP's question: Hiring partners/committees and other legal professionals. With them, UVA and UCB are roughly on par with one another. As others have said there will be some personal variation and probably some market variation for that rep.

And Veyron's breakdown is a nice way to break down the issue and could be where my intuition about Berk's ability to move east comes from (though I hadn't analyzed to that level).

School Rep*Number of Jobs on Other Coast=Ability to Move between coasts. I think that the east coast's huge advantage with NY/DC vs. SF/LA in the second variable more than wipes out any marginal difference between how Berk is perceived back east.


Excuse my retardation, but what exactly are you saying here?

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:47 pm
by Patriot1208
yngblkgifted wrote:
Rotor wrote:
glewz wrote:
re-applicant wrote:I can assure you that very few people in California know what a UVA is.


No joke. I've been all over CA. No One knows what UVA is.


While this may be close to true for lay reputation, that's a FAR cry from the reputation the school has with the folks who matter for OP's question: Hiring partners/committees and other legal professionals. With them, UVA and UCB are roughly on par with one another. As others have said there will be some personal variation and probably some market variation for that rep.

And Veyron's breakdown is a nice way to break down the issue and could be where my intuition about Berk's ability to move east comes from (though I hadn't analyzed to that level).

School Rep*Number of Jobs on Other Coast=Ability to Move between coasts. I think that the east coast's huge advantage with NY/DC vs. SF/LA in the second variable more than wipes out any marginal difference between how Berk is perceived back east.


Excuse my retardation, but what exactly are you saying here?


It seems he is saying that there are more jobs on the east coast, which is why the east coast has an advantage over the west coast. Meaning, that the ability to move east from berk is greater than the ability to move west from UVA not because they are perceived any differently (because they aren't) but because there are more jobs on the east coast.

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:56 pm
by yngblkgifted
Patriot1208 wrote:
It seems he is saying that there are more jobs on the east coast, which is why the east coast has an advantage over the west coast. Meaning, that the ability to move east from berk is greater than the ability to move west from UVA not because they are perceived any differently (because they aren't) but because there are more jobs on the east coast.


Gotcha. Thanks!

Re: Berkeley?

Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:59 pm
by Kronk
Berkeley has a big perception edge over UVa in my home state of Colorado, for what it's worth.

I think Berkeley generally does have a better perception than UVa, even in the legal field, not so much because Berkeley has a better law school than UVa, but becuase Berkeley is a better school in every other category. There probably isn't a difference in perception for BigLaw, as they are constantly hiring and probably have experience with grads from every top school. But I think there definitely is for public interest and government stuff, which is part of the reason I chose to go here.