BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

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LiveFreeOrLaw
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BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby LiveFreeOrLaw » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:41 pm

Share some of your own. These are what I found to be true after a couple years of my own research:

1. Graduates from regionally respected schools do just fine in life.
It's not true that only top tier school graduates get great jobs. So much depends on the person's own achievements while in school and how they sell themselves.

2. Education at top ranked schools aren't so much better.
Almost every professor in every school is HYS educated. All 1Ls learn exactly the same things and most 2Ls and 3Ls don't learn something so new and different at one school over another.

3. US News Rankings itself is completely meaningless
The only useful information US News provides is the convenient list of tuition, location, student body size, and median LSAT/GPA in one page. Of course you can look them up individually yourself if you are diligent. Interpreting anything beyond that would be 140 for reasons you already know so well but can't seem to act on.

4. You might not want to practice law after law school.(Especially big law)
Big law has a huge turn over rate and most don't last for more than 3 yrs. Every young gun wants a biglaw job, but I think you should spend some more time getting to know yourself and your values better. I hope none of us turn out like Amy Chua, the YLS grad professor who ended up in law school because to her that was the default road after college. She's an accomplished law professor, but I don't know if she is spending her life happily. I hope you do.

5. No one cares about your achievements and no one will remember them.
Except for your immediate family and friends for the first few months of acceptance to law school. Placing security and value in achievements is a fatal mistake.

6. We're still very young.
But we think we know so much better.
Last edited by LiveFreeOrLaw on Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Mickey Quicknumbers
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby Mickey Quicknumbers » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:45 pm

LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:1. Graduates from regionally respected schools do just fine in life.
It's not true that only top tier school graduates get great jobs. So much depends on the person's own achievements while in school and how they sell themselves.

egregiously false, you simply cannot generalize like that.
LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:2. Education at top ranked schools aren't so much better.
Almost every professor in every school is HYS educated. All 1Ls learn exactly the same things as most 2Ls and 3Ls don't learn something so new and different at one school over another.

You haven't even been to one law school yet. Much less two. How could you possibly say this?

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LiveFreeOrLaw
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby LiveFreeOrLaw » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:49 pm

Mickey Quicknumbers wrote:
LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:1. Graduates from regionally respected schools do just fine in life.
It's not true that only top tier school graduates get great jobs. So much depends on the person's own achievements while in school and how they sell themselves.

egregiously false, you simply cannot generalize like that.
LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:2. Education at top ranked schools aren't so much better.
Almost every professor in every school is HYS educated. All 1Ls learn exactly the same things as most 2Ls and 3Ls don't learn something so new and different at one school over another.

You haven't even been to one law school yet. Much less two. How could you possibly say this?


I've attended a law school (T14) for a year several years back before I had to leave due to medical reasons. 1Ls all learn the same things no matter where you go. All 1Ls follow the ABA curriculum guidelines.

Regionally respected school graduates do just fine. There is nothing egregiously flawed about this. My definition of do just fine is making enough money to pay for bills and have a bit left for savings, traveling, and other happy things in life.

1234543523

Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby 1234543523 » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:53 pm

You are a horrible poster.

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LiveFreeOrLaw
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby LiveFreeOrLaw » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:56 pm

f7 wrote:You are a horrible poster.


gtfo if you have nothing to contribute. Being cynical isn't being intelligent, douche.

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vanwinkle
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:58 pm

LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:1. Graduates from regionally respected schools do just fine in life.
It's not true that only top tier school graduates get great jobs. So much depends on the person's own achievements while in school and how they sell themselves.

The criticism of lower-tier schools isn't that it's impossible to do well graduating from those schools. There have been and will continue to be people who graduate from bottom-tier schools and manage to do remarkably well for themselves. Nobody disputes that, even most of the top-tier-or-bust folks.

It's a matter of chances. If you go to T14 law school, your odds of getting a "great job" are far, far higher than someone who goes to a T2 or T3 school. It's not just a function of whether it's possible but how likely it is. This is especially true since, as a 0L, you absolutely cannot know what kind of "achievements while in law school" you'll have. Maybe you'll end up #1 in your class, and that'll open doors for you enough to get you interviews and be able to impress people with who you are as a person. But remember, for each 1 person at the top of their class, there's a classful of people who aren't. Do you think out of 200 people, the other 199 weren't also thinking, "I'm going to try to be #1"?

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vanwinkle
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:59 pm

LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:
f7 wrote:You are a horrible poster.

gtfo if you have nothing to contribute. Being cynical isn't being intelligent, douche.

Image

I'm the one who gets to tell people to GTFO.

Let's have the ad-homs stop, in both directions, before I have to card more people.

cern
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby cern » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:00 pm

7. You know the future (and the objective truth about reality).
That's right, just kind of throw together whatever types of projections, estimations, or flat out baseless assertions you want and tell people about them in the form of information. Most of the time claiming some sort of experience will help. Also, if there are things that you really don't want to be true, try calling them misconceptions.

09042014
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby 09042014 » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:03 pm

Does regionally respected school = CCN?

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vanwinkle
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:04 pm

Desert Fox wrote:Does regionally respected school = CCN?

ITE, yes.

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Spookyghost
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby Spookyghost » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:12 pm

LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:Share some of your own. These are what I found to be true after a couple years of my own research:

2. Education at top ranked schools aren't so much better.
Almost every professor in every school is HYS educated. All 1Ls learn exactly the same things and most 2Ls and 3Ls don't learn something so new and different at one school over another.


Given your mastery of subject-verb agreement how can I possibly dispute the information in this thread?

concurrent fork
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby concurrent fork » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:34 pm

If:
LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:So much depends on the person's own achievements while in school and how they sell themselves.

but:
LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:Placing security and value in achievements is a fatal mistake.

Have you made a fatal mistake?

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zonto
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby zonto » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:57 pm

Heaven forbid someone go against the groupthink you all subject to in the forum. Hurry, sling more insults because someone doesn't agree with you! If you'd actually try to understand what's behind the message, I think you'll find a lot of maturity and wisdom.

And concurrent fork, saying that getting a job and that finding success in life depends on your motivation and achievement is much different than saying that that achievement is the thing you value the most. Is it the means to an end or the end itself?

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vanwinkle
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 26, 2011 4:29 pm

zonto wrote:Heaven forbid someone go against the groupthink you all subject to in the forum. Hurry, sling more insults because someone doesn't agree with you! If you'd actually try to understand what's behind the message, I think you'll find a lot of maturity and wisdom.

While I don't think the comment he was responding to was necessary, I don't see a lot of maturity or wisdom in someone who addresses detractors with "gtfo douche".

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vanwinkle
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Mar 26, 2011 4:30 pm

concurrent fork wrote:If:
LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:So much depends on the person's own achievements while in school and how they sell themselves.

but:
LiveFreeOrLaw wrote:Placing security and value in achievements is a fatal mistake.

Have you made a fatal mistake?

Image

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gothamm
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby gothamm » Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:13 pm

This thread went over quite well.



+ i don't think that rankings are meaningless. In fact, I think they are quite meaningful.

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ahduth
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Re: BEFORE AND AFTER: 0L's Misconceptions on the Ranking & LS

Postby ahduth » Sun Mar 27, 2011 1:07 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
zonto wrote:Heaven forbid someone go against the groupthink you all subject to in the forum. Hurry, sling more insults because someone doesn't agree with you! If you'd actually try to understand what's behind the message, I think you'll find a lot of maturity and wisdom.

While I don't think the comment he was responding to was necessary, I don't see a lot of maturity or wisdom in someone who addresses detractors with "gtfo douche".


Eh, that's debatable, someone let that "fu" guy out of the lounge. LiveFree responded with a lounge-type comment. I think there's sometimes wisdom in responding to people in a language they can understand.

But the OP is right that people need to take a step back from the admissions process potentially. Some people dive into this process all starry-eyed, and they may be doing themselves a disservice. You should push hard at whatever you do, but make sure you want to actually be doing it before you commit lol. Having been out of school for awhile, I sometimes feel that point 6 is particularly apropos of much of the posting on this board. Not that I've gotten any smarter, more just realized exactly how clueless I really am.




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