Choosing b/w pepperdine and loyola Forum

[1ferret!]

I agree with the above re cost of living savings....but staying with parents?

The competition at each school will be among your section. The ranking is based on the whole class but the curve applies to those in your section. At Pepperdine, the section size will be somewhere around 65-70 students....not sure what it will be at Loyola.

First year curve at Pepperdine can be found by looking online at the academics section under grade distributions to give you an idea of what you will have to do. But the numbers are always deceiving....at the end of the day, you have to do better than two thirds of your classmates. Period.

[gothamm]

What is wrong with living with parents in the comfort of family to save another 40-60k over three years?

[1ferret!]

Hey, to each their own when it comes to living with your parents. I'm a little older, haven't lived in the same house with my parents for over twelve years, nor would I even consider it an option. If I did consider it, I would likely conclude that it would be worth the money to get my own place.

[Ash;-)]

I think staying home and taking advantage of the family support while attending law school is a very beneficial thing... But at the same time I could understand the argument against this point as well.

[Gatriel]

Pepperdine is the Regent Law of Westcoast.

Outed as someone who has never visited campus, or sat in on a class.

[LiveFreeOrLaw]

Both diploma mills sorry that UCLA, Berkeley, and Stanford get the first dips. Flip a coin.

[gothamm]

Both diploma mills sorry that UCLA, Berkeley, and Stanford get the first dips. Flip a coin.

What is your motivation for posting in this thread? Have some class...

[NoleinNY]

If you have any questions (I'm a 1L at LLS) you can check out this thread: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 4&t=133045

I agree with the above re cost of living savings....but staying with parents?

The competition at each school will be among your section. The ranking is based on the whole class but the curve applies to those in your section. At Pepperdine, the section size will be somewhere around 65-70 students....not sure what it will be at Loyola.

First year curve at Pepperdine can be found by looking online at the academics section under grade distributions to give you an idea of what you will have to do. But the numbers are always deceiving....at the end of the day, you have to do better than two thirds of your classmates. Period.

There are approximately 85, give or take 3-4 students, per section.

Also pepperdine is known for being a "conservative" school, not sure about loyola, so your personal political beliefs could come into play here

Loyola leans a little left, imo.

[jeremysen]

I (half-jokingly) feel that since pepperdine is in malibu, it'll be in a more relaxed, gunner-less environment. Congrats on both btw.

[LiveFreeOrLaw]

Both diploma mills sorry that UCLA, Berkeley, and Stanford get the first dips. Flip a coin.

What is your motivation for posting in this thread? Have some class...

There's nothing classy about selling $150k dream life tickets printed at a law factory to a bunch of naive college grads who don't know what to do next. "We're looking for idealistic candidates who really, without shame, want to change the world." - I heard this shit in person from an admissions dean at a related school. Do you know that UCLA alone graduates 300+ law students per year? Even assuming that half of them will move out of state, you honestly think LA has that many decent paying law jobs opening up each year? I'm not saying that the quality of teaching at any of these two schools is inferior to any top schools nor am I saying that getting a legal education in itself is not worthy (albeit an expensive hobby). They teach the same shit and all the profs are from Yale and Havard. But let's not kid ourselves that there really isn't a scam going on here.

Pepperdine: 65.7K/Yr - OP will pay 45.7K/Yr for 3 yrs
http://law.pepperdine.edu/financial-ass ... ttendance/

Loyola: 67.8K/Yr - OP will pay 37.8K/yr for 3 yrs
http://intranet.lls.edu/financialaid/cost.html

[1ferret!]

The poster above has obviously joined the "t-14 or lawl school is never worth it" bandwagon... however, since such sentiments can be, and have been, endlessly debated elsewhere I think it better to actually address the OPs concerns.

So according to the above LLS kid's numbers on section size, you will be faced with larger sections at LLS relative to Pepperdine. More kids get A's but you have to beat out more kids to get an A. It all comes back to the basic need to be among the top third no matter where you go. Will the section size really make a difference in how easy it is to maintain the top third requirement? Doesn't really seem like it given the similarities, and if there were, the difference is likely so minimal as to be pointless to count on.

Not much of a gunner feel at Pepperdine, and I for one was surprised by how the "famously conservative" politics of Pepperdine....didn't really manifest.

[Ash;-)]

Both diploma mills sorry that UCLA, Berkeley, and Stanford get the first dips. Flip a coin.

What is your motivation for posting in this thread? Have some class...

There's nothing classy about selling $150k dream life tickets printed at a law factory to a bunch of naive college grads who don't know what to do next. "We're looking for idealistic candidates who really, without shame, want to change the world." - I heard this shit in person from an admissions dean at a related school. Do you know that UCLA alone graduates 300+ law students per year? Even assuming that half of them will move out of state, you honestly think LA has that many decent paying law jobs opening up each year? I'm not saying that the quality of teaching at any of these two schools is inferior to any top schools nor am I saying that getting a legal education in itself is not worthy (albeit an expensive hobby). They teach the same shit and all the profs are from Yale and Havard. But let's not kid ourselves that there really isn't a scam going on here.

Pepperdine: 65.7K/Yr - OP will pay 45.7K/Yr for 3 yrs
http://law.pepperdine.edu/financial-ass ... ttendance/



Loyola: 67.8K/Yr - OP will pay 37.8K/yr for 3 yrs
http://intranet.lls.edu/financialaid/cost.html

i think most of the people on this site are kids who just came out of under grad and have no idea how real world works. true that a top school will provide one with a better chance of getting a good job which at the max pays around 150k; but at these type of jobs the firms will make you work like a dog and treat you like doormat [needless to say that most of the people who work for big law with the hope of becoming partner at some point hate their job and in most cases hate their lives(i suggest to talk to some people who you think are holding your dream jobs at the big law)]. i have a lot of friends who graduated from different schools and practice law now for more than 7 years. i think business savvy is something that could help your law career and proven to be more effective in generating higher level of income than just the ranking of the school you attended to get your law degree. i have friends who came out of t14 schools and make 140k and hate their life and want to leave law and go into teaching because of work experience at big law, and on the other hand i have bunch of friends who came out of tear 3 schools and are making 200k+ and are so happy and working for themselves. i know that you might say this is a exception to the rule, and i will respond; that with a little real business world experience one can find it to be not that difficult to accomplish more coming out of a lower tear school compare to some one coming out of top tear or even t14 school. so dont let your naive outlook in life effects others and discourage some from doing something positive. so stop jumping on the bandwagon with the rest of the TLS naive kids and actually get out of school and get some real world experience and then make comments like the above. and by the way i actually have an admission from UCLA but still dont rule out attending LOYOLA because UCLA ranks better. so a little more real world research would do you a lot of good.

[UCLAtransfer]

IMO, LLS has far and away the better reputation and network in LA, assuming that is where you will be trying to find employment. Their lawyers are everywhere. My (mid-sized LA) firm doesn't recruit from Pepperdine and doesn't have a single lawyer from there (total of about 55 attys). We probably have about 20 LLS attys and recruit there every year. I obviously don't have detailed information on this, but I would be surprised if there were many firms that recruited from Pepperdine that didn't recruit from LLS, but I don't think mine is the only firm that goes to LLS but doesn't make it out to Malibu. Not to say its not a good school, but from what I have seen LLS definitely has a leg up when it comes LA recruiting outside of UCLA and USC.

[UCLAtransfer]

top tear

Enough said.

[Ash;-)]

top tear

Enough said.

wow you are so smart and have perfect logical reasoning skills... dismissing a valid point base on an auto spelling correction error my iphon made while typing. so i wonder what schools did you get admission offers from ( i bet probably not "TOP TIER")... please enlighten us more with your bandwagon logic and impeccable reasoning skills...

[UCLAtransfer]

top tear

Enough said.

wow you are so smart and have perfect logical reasoning skills... dismissing a valid point base on an auto spelling correction error my iphon made while typing. so i wonder what schools did you get admission offers from ( i bet probably not "TOP TIER")... please enlighten us more with your bandwagon logic and impeccable reasoning skills...

Jesus. Calm the hell down. I have no idea what "bandwagon logic" or "impeccable reasoning skills" you are referencing, but don't take yourself so seriously- it's a damn joke, lighten the f*ck up.

As far as what LS I attend, I really don't see how that plays into this in any way- but if you really care,

<----take your own advice and read more carefully.

[1ferret!]

IMO, LLS has far and away the better reputation and network in LA, assuming that is where you will be trying to find employment. Their lawyers are everywhere. My (mid-sized LA) firm doesn't recruit from Pepperdine and doesn't have a single lawyer from there (total of about 55 attys). We probably have about 20 LLS attys and recruit there every year. I obviously don't have detailed information on this, but I would be surprised if there were many firms that recruited from Pepperdine that didn't recruit from LLS, but I don't think mine is the only firm that goes to LLS but doesn't make it out to Malibu. Not to say its not a good school, but from what I have seen LLS definitely has a leg up when it comes LA recruiting outside of UCLA and USC.

Yes, Loyola has been and will continue to put out twice as many students a year as Pepperdine, so the network will continue to be better in terms of sheep quantity. The business environment continues to be in flux. As long as firms are looking for ways to expand their options given the limited number of top performers from strictly t14 schools, coupled with an inability to keep up with the price escalator on first year associate salaries given current economic conditions, and Pepperdine students surpassing Loyola students with regard to the quality of incoming student numbers, with an increasing reputation in its home market...Pepperdine will make gains in the quality of opportunities it provides to its students. Its ok to be a cheerleader, there may even be some foundation for your cheerleading. However I would disagree with your "far and away" characterization, and would contend that whatever the current status quo - Pepperdine is rising in relation - whether that means closing the gap or pulling away thats for you to decide.

[gothamm]

Both diploma mills sorry that UCLA, Berkeley, and Stanford get the first dips. Flip a coin.

What is your motivation for posting in this thread? Have some class...

There's nothing classy about selling $150k dream life tickets printed at a law factory to a bunch of naive college grads who don't know what to do next. "We're looking for idealistic candidates who really, without shame, want to change the world." - I heard this shit in person from an admissions dean at a related school. Do you know that UCLA alone graduates 300+ law students per year? Even assuming that half of them will move out of state, you honestly think LA has that many decent paying law jobs opening up each year? I'm not saying that the quality of teaching at any of these two schools is inferior to any top schools nor am I saying that getting a legal education in itself is not worthy (albeit an expensive hobby). They teach the same shit and all the profs are from Yale and Havard. But let's not kid ourselves that there really isn't a scam going on here.

Pepperdine: 65.7K/Yr - OP will pay 45.7K/Yr for 3 yrs
http://law.pepperdine.edu/financial-ass ... ttendance/

Loyola: 67.8K/Yr - OP will pay 37.8K/yr for 3 yrs
http://intranet.lls.edu/financialaid/cost.html

What do you suppose us mere mortals who dont have a 3.7/174 should do then? Not go to law school? "Retake"? There are plenty of lawyers who graduate outside the t20 who make an incredible living. And no, these people are not outliers. I appreciate your sentiments, but your claim that these solid regional schools are "diploma millls" is far off.

[1ferret!]

shrug it off man, goes with posting on TLS

[Ash;-)]

trust me the big law job is over raided and if you talk to people who actually hold these job majority will tell you they are unhappy. you might make less money if you work for a mid size firm or a small one but at lease you will enjoy your job and can actually live not just work. and if you are a little business savvy you could do your own thing and make more money than the people with the big law careers. this hold true for a lot of people i know and talked to.

if you come out loyola or pepperdine and have a good plan and know what you are doing you can be just as successful financially as people who come out of t14 with less stress. EX. i have friends who went to Thomas jefferson law which is a tier4 school and hey make more money than my friends who were at the top 10% of their class from Berkeley, i have to add that they are actually happier as well that they dont have to deal with the big law BS. so nothing is set in stone. you should not listen to these naive people on TLS and just do the best you can and go to the best school which is possible for you...

[FiveSermon]

Both diploma mills sorry that UCLA, Berkeley, and Stanford get the first dips. Flip a coin.

You forgot USC. Or is that a diploma mill as well?

[LiveFreeOrLaw]

Both diploma mills sorry that UCLA, Berkeley, and Stanford get the first dips. Flip a coin.

You forgot USC. Or is that a diploma mill as well?

Tier 1 stops at UCLA/Texas.

Duhh...

[Danteshek]

You may want to consider the relative merits of the journals at both schools. I know Pepperdine has a Dispute Resolution journal, a Business journal, and an Administrative Law journal, while LLS has an Entertainment journal and an International journals. The main law review at LLS is significantly larger than the Pepperdine law review, and offers writing opportunities in both the 2L and 3L year. I'm not sure about Pepperdine on that score.

[edf2011]

How about this --choosing between Loyola and Pepp. Interested in Public Interest Law only--zero interest in big law. Finances not a factor in decision nor is location within LA. The only limiting factor right now is a need to remain stateside after graduation--no exotic ports of call. If you're not sure which particular practice area you'll end up in within the generic 'public interest'--healthcare, environmental, financial fraud, crim etc. Which do you choose?

[Danteshek]

How about this --choosing between Loyola and Pepp. Interested in Public Interest Law only--zero interest in big law. Finances not a factor in decision nor is location within LA. The only limiting factor right now is a need to remain stateside after graduation--no exotic ports of call. If you're not sure which particular practice area you'll end up in within the generic 'public interest'--healthcare, environmental, financial fraud, crim etc. Which do you choose?

Loyola because of its walking distance proximity to Legal Aid, ACLU, Public Counsel etc