What T14 grouping is Berkeley in? Forum

[AreJay711]

Y H S CC BN MVP DNC GtownVandyTex

I'll call your idiotic grouping and raise you this (probably less) idiotic grouping.

Y - S - H - V - M - Co - Ch - Nw - P - D - Nyu - V - C - G - Tex - Usc - Ucla

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=108528

[whymeohgodno]

Y H S CC BN MVP DNC GtownVandyTex

I'll call your idiotic grouping and raise you this (probably less) idiotic grouping.

Y - S - H - V - M - Co - Ch - Nw - P - D - Nyu - V - C - G - Tex - Usc - Ucla

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=108528

I love how you go almost exactly by that list but conveniently ignore the difference between Yale and Stanford and place Yale at top.

[BruceWayne]

Boalt is putting significantly less people in big firms than schools it's supposed to be better than like NU and Duke. 30%? LOL Northwestern beat that by 20%, I'm sure Duke, Virginia and Michigan did too. Penn probably more than that.

It's a Georgetown peer school ITE.

And the TLS obsession with determining a school's placement strength by how much of the class goes to NYC firms (with the notable exception of Stanford and Yale--they get a free pass for not sending a lot of people to NYC firms) continues. Boalt's doing "poorly" in this economy compared to it's peers because the kids who go there by and large have zero desire to work in a big NYC firm. Duke, Penn, and NYU are filled with kids who have had ideas of NYC biglaw in their heads from day one--naturally they have "better" firm placement. This is the same reason why HYS come out "behind" Columbia and NYU in a lot of firm placement studies; but then send way more students to federal clerkships, PI, and prestigious non NYC firms.

If Boalt's anything like UVA, a crap ton of people really really don't want to work/end up in NYC; I'd imagine even more of Boalt's student's don't want to work there actually.

[justadude55]

if you can get the in state tuition, berkley is a great place to go to. you get a top of the line LS for ~20k a year. agree on pass/fail. i would be surprised if LSAT score came up at interviews -- do people really care? a lot of successful attorneys took it when there was a different scoring system.

[justadude55]

Boalt is putting significantly less people in big firms than schools it's supposed to be better than like NU and Duke. 30%? LOL Northwestern beat that by 20%, I'm sure Duke, Virginia and Michigan did too. Penn probably more than that.

It's a Georgetown peer school ITE.

And the TLS obsession with determining a school's placement strength by how much of the class goes to NYC firms (with the notable exception of Stanford and Yale--they get a free pass for not sending a lot of people to NYC firms) continues. Boalt's doing "poorly" in this economy compared to it's peers because the kids who go there by and large have zero desire to work in a big NYC firm. Duke, Penn, and NYU are filled with kids who have had ideas of NYC biglaw in their heads from day one--naturally they have "better" firm placement. This is the same reason why HYS come out "behind" Columbia and NYU in a lot of firm placement studies; but then send way more students to federal clerkships, PI, and prestigious non NYC firms.

If Boalt's anything like UVA, a crap ton of people really really don't want to work/end up in NYC; I'd imagine even more of Boalt's student's don't want to work there actually.

yeah, the fairest measure of how good a school is would be to see how many students who wanted to work in big law were able to get a job in big law. unfortunately, this would be impossible to quantify.

[bigkahuna2020]

I didn't realize that biglaw was the only way to determine ranking

I guess it goes NYHC at the top or something

[solidsnake]

This is such a stupid topic. Why does this matter to you? Do you think firms, judges, or clients ask what category "B" goes in? Grow the fuck up.

[AreJay711]

Y H S CC BN MVP DNC GtownVandyTex

I'll call your idiotic grouping and raise you this (probably less) idiotic grouping.

Y - S - H - V - M - Co - Ch - Nw - P - D - Nyu - V - C - G - Tex - Usc - Ucla

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=108528

I love how you go almost exactly by that list but conveniently ignore the difference between Yale and Stanford and place Yale at top.

Well the link ignores academic so I adjusted lol.

[im_blue]

if you can get the in state tuition, berkley is a great place to go to. you get a top of the line LS for ~20k a year. agree on pass/fail. i would be surprised if LSAT score came up at interviews -- do people really care? a lot of successful attorneys took it when there was a different scoring system.

in-state tuition will be $49k in 2011 and $52k in 2012.

http://www.law.berkeley.edu/6943.htm

[r6_philly]

So where is Berkeley in terms of pure IP?

Dammit, I have a seriously question.

[bigkahuna2020]

So where is Berkeley in terms of pure IP?

Dammit, I have a seriously question.

#2 according to most places I've seen

[whymeohgodno]

Y H S CC BN MVP DNC GtownVandyTex

I'll call your idiotic grouping and raise you this (probably less) idiotic grouping.

Y - S - H - V - M - Co - Ch - Nw - P - D - Nyu - V - C - G - Tex - Usc - Ucla

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=108528

I love how you go almost exactly by that list but conveniently ignore the difference between Yale and Stanford and place Yale at top.

Well the link ignores academic so I adjusted lol.

Yale places at least 5% more into academia than Stanford?

[BioEBear2010]

So where is Berkeley in terms of pure IP?

Dammit, I have a seriously question.

Specialty rankings really aren't that important. If you have a tech background, you are more marketable. End of story. For good reason, though, the techies flock to Stanford and Berkeley (in no small part because of their desire to work in the Bay Area).

[Pleasye]

if you can get the in state tuition, berkley is a great place to go to. you get a top of the line LS for ~20k a year. agree on pass/fail. i would be surprised if LSAT score came up at interviews -- do people really care? a lot of successful attorneys took it when there was a different scoring system.

in-state tuition will be $49k in 2011 and $52k in 2012.

http://www.law.berkeley.edu/6943.htm

I was just about post about this. Boalt's tuition is not 20k a year. None of the CA public schools are.

[sundance95]

Yale places at least 5% more into academia than Stanford?

LOL at Stanford hijacking a Cal thread.

[mrmangs]

So where is Berkeley in terms of pure IP?

Dammit, I have a seriously question.

I am also curious about this. But I'm mainly interested in transactional IP b/c I don't have a hard science background.

[d34d9823]

This is such a stupid topic. Why does this matter to you? Do you think firms, judges, or clients ask what category "B" goes in? Grow the fuck up.

You've got it backwards. The categories are a rough aggregation of the schools' practical prestige and influence.

[irishman86]

So where is Berkeley in terms of pure IP?

Dammit, I have a seriously question.

I am also curious about this. But I'm mainly interested in transactional IP b/c I don't have a hard science background.

Transactional IP? Flame?

[r6_philly]

So where is Berkeley in terms of pure IP?

Dammit, I have a seriously question.

Specialty rankings really aren't that important. If you have a tech background, you are more marketable. End of story. For good reason, though, the techies flock to Stanford and Berkeley (in no small part because of their desire to work in the Bay Area).

Not ranking per se, but a realistic assessment of where it should be on my priority/school list based on non-personal criteria. I know Standford and Berkeley are magnets for people like me of course, I just want some sort of assessment whether I should put them ahead of CCNPM. (since people are dissing Berkeley here)

[BruceWayne]

This is such a stupid topic. Why does this matter to you? Do you think firms, judges, or clients ask what category "B" goes in? Grow the fuck up.

You've got it backwards. The categories are a rough aggregation of the schools' practical prestige and influence.

No he doesn't; a lot of these categorical distinctions that you're referring to are simply TLS extractions of the US News overall numerical rankings and autoadmit.com lore. They don't even bother to use the lawyer/judge prestige scores that US News collects; ironically enough one of the few stats they track worth noting--but the one that TLS never mentions in regards to rankings. If you check those out over the last decade you'll find that a lot of these TLS distinctions are coming out of thin air. For all intents and purposes if you're going for a job in NYC it's HYS CCN and then the rest of the top 14. If you're going for a job somewhere else it's basically HYS serious gap, CC then a small gap and then the rest of the top 14.

[AreJay711]

I'll call your idiotic grouping and raise you this (probably less) idiotic grouping.

Y - S - H - V - M - Co - Ch - Nw - P - D - Nyu - V - C - G - Tex - Usc - Ucla

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 1&t=108528

I love how you go almost exactly by that list but conveniently ignore the difference between Yale and Stanford and place Yale at top.

Well the link ignores academic so I adjusted lol.

Yale places at least 5% more into academia than Stanford?

Checked it and you are correct, it nowhere near enough to make up the 5% difference (though it would have been close in 2007).

[09042014]

Boalt is putting significantly less people in big firms than schools it's supposed to be better than like NU and Duke. 30%? LOL Northwestern beat that by 20%, I'm sure Duke, Virginia and Michigan did too. Penn probably more than that.

It's a Georgetown peer school ITE.

And the TLS obsession with determining a school's placement strength by how much of the class goes to NYC firms (with the notable exception of Stanford and Yale--they get a free pass for not sending a lot of people to NYC firms) continues. Boalt's doing "poorly" in this economy compared to it's peers because the kids who go there by and large have zero desire to work in a big NYC firm. Duke, Penn, and NYU are filled with kids who have had ideas of NYC biglaw in their heads from day one--naturally they have "better" firm placement. This is the same reason why HYS come out "behind" Columbia and NYU in a lot of firm placement studies; but then send way more students to federal clerkships, PI, and prestigious non NYC firms.

If Boalt's anything like UVA, a crap ton of people really really don't want to work/end up in NYC; I'd imagine even more of Boalt's student's don't want to work there actually.

Yet back five years ago Boalt was placing a similar number of people into big law as MVP. Did Boalt suddenly start taking huge masses of PI and small firm folks?

[AreJay711]

This is such a stupid topic. Why does this matter to you? Do you think firms, judges, or clients ask what category "B" goes in? Grow the fuck up.

You've got it backwards. The categories are a rough aggregation of the schools' practical prestige and influence.

No he doesn't; a lot of these categorical distinctions that you're referring to are simply TLS extractions of the US News overall numerical rankings and autoadmit.com lore. They don't even bother to use the lawyer/judge prestige scores that US News collects; ironically enough one of the few stats they track worth noting--but the one that TLS never mentions in regards to rankings. If you check those out over the last decade you'll find that a lot of these TLS distinctions are coming out of thin air. For all intents and purposes if you're going for a job in NYC it's HYS CCN and then the rest of the top 14. If you're going for a job somewhere else it's basically HYS serious gap, CC then a small gap and then the rest of the top 14.

Not statistically significant for what I care about actually (which is the 25th percentile private sector starting salary). Just wrote a 54 page report on it lol.

[mrmangs]

So where is Berkeley in terms of pure IP?

Dammit, I have a seriously question.

I am also curious about this. But I'm mainly interested in transactional IP b/c I don't have a hard science background.

Transactional IP? Flame?

It might be ignorance, but it's not flame, . I would assume there is transactional work to be done with companies in places like Silicon Valley (in fact, I've heard people mention transactional IP work), and from what little I've been able to gather (mainly from TLS and a guy I kinda know who works at MoFo), a hard science background is only really important if you are going to be doing IP litigation or prosecution. I want to be doing transactional work generally speaking, but I am just wondering if hiring would be any better in firms/areas that revolve around IP. Also, since Stanford and Berkeley are supposed to be so strong in IP (although, as has already been mentioned, this is probably just because they attract students with a certain background who want to work in places like SV), is there any added advantage going to either of those schools if one wanted to do that kind of work. So, rip my question to shreds if it merits it. I'm just curious and may be way off base.

[BioEBear2010]

Transactional IP is most certainly real. It's a subset of corporate work. Someone's gotta assess the value of IP and deal with licenses/patents/what-have-you when one company is acquiring another.

More on point: Berkeley is a great school (especially on the West Coast), but the grading system does hurt it relative to other schools.