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UPenn asks if you have ever been convicted of a crime or if any charge is pending against you.

I wouldn't, but that's just me. I am in no way authorized to give you an official answer, obviously.

Call Penn's admissions office.

bk187 wrote:Call Penn's admissions office.

I will tom. What about UVA's that says "Have you ever been convicted of any offense, excluding minor traffic or parking violations?" I already submitted the app but this just came to mind. I would think that any offense would include this?

I bet not. Being cited =/= being convicted.

johnnyutah wrote:I bet not. Being cited =/= being convicted.

This. You have not been convicted, nor are any charges pending. I was arrested and had the case dismissed (or rather reduced to a minor traffic violation) and intend to answer "No" to questions like this. If they ask about arrests I will write an addendum.

Look at the question you are being asked on each application and answer the question as it is being asked.

You do not have a criminal record. That would suggest you committed a "minor misdemeanor." The law school has no way of figuring out what your minor misdemeanors were, or what crimes you've had expunged. However, state bar associations do. And when they evaluate your ethical fitness for admission to the bar, one of the question you are asked is if you have ever lied on a law school application. The risk you run is this. If they bar association sees you answered no, and then reviews your law school apps (which they have access to), and reviews your criminal record including expunged offenses and minor misdemeanors (which most, but not all state bar associations have access to), and it appears you did not answer the question truthfully, you will probably be penalized by having to wait a couple years to be admitted to the bar.

The what-ifs you need to think about are a) what state do you think you'll take the bar in, if you plan to take the bar b) does that state have access to my full criminal history (most but not all do), c) what did the law school application ask me (some schools specifically ask you to report expunged crimes. some specifically ask you not to report expunged crimes and d) DID YOU ANSWER THAT QUESTION TRUTHFULLY.

The offense is minor enough that reporting it can't seriously affect your admissions chances, if the application asks you a question that requires you report it to be not omitting the truth. Just read the question on the application and then decide.

EDIT - Just a note, it has happened before in real life the way I have described, but even if you roll the dice, statistically, the odds are in your favor that you will never be found out. But consider all possibilities.

Do you really think no one else has had some minor "disorderly" charge? Don't worry about it. You will be going to school with a number of people with small drug crimes and other shit no one cares about. A good bit of time of non-arrest time is best.

Or, if you want, don't admit to it. The schools don't do in depth criminal checks from what I have heard. HOWEVER, you run into problems when applying for the bar, where they check deep down all the way to parking tickets. And they base stuff of your law school application.

I'd say that the school doesn't care as long as you can pass the bar.

Lastly, can you find the ACTUAL law, not some shitty commentary? I'd like to evaluate something that isn't put together by a group of assholes with the mental capacity of the people from Jersey Shore.

Sporkdevil:

"N.J.S.A. 2C:52-4 governs the expungement of Municipal Ordinances in New Jersey. It reads:

§ 2C:52-4. Ordinances

In all cases wherein a person has been found guilty of violating a municipal ordinance of any governmental entity of this State and who has not been convicted of any prior or subsequent crime, whether within this State or any other jurisdiction, and who has not been adjudged a disorderly person or petty disorderly person on more than two occasions, may, after the expiration of a period of 2 years from the date of his conviction, payment of fine, satisfactory completion of probation or release from incarceration, whichever is later, present a duly verified petition as provided in section 2C:52-7 herein to the Superior Court in the county in which the violation occurred praying that such conviction and all records and information pertaining thereto be expunged."

From the bolded, it sounds like violating a borough ordinance is considered a "crime" in which I did plead guilty to. So I guess I was convicted of a crime?

Either way I'm going to disclose it to all schools to cover my ass when I graduate. Now the question is do I check 'yes' on the Penn application??? or just check 'no' and attach and addendum?

Your call. The question is, do you want to be ethical, or do you want to maximize your chances of admission at the school? If you answered the former, then you should probably disclose the offense, write an addendum, and risk the possibility that they might care a little bit, which a little bit is by far the most they'll care for some kid having a jolly good time. If you answered the latter, then lie, because they won't find out. They don't check that deep into your criminal record (though the Bar does).

Your decision.

When in doubt, always disclose

It sounds like they never even documented it. I wouldn't worry about it. I only report stuff where there was a ticket or citation given.

neighbordownthe wrote:It sounds like they never even documented it. I wouldn't worry about it. I only report stuff where there was a ticket or citation given.

It was documented with a citation, and a record at the municipal court for two years from the guilty plea, although no criminal record

2009 Prospective wrote:When in doubt, always disclose

I disclosed it, sent in the app yesterday. Now, to contact UVA and tell them I need to submit an addendum