Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

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ThePennKid
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Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby ThePennKid » Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:24 pm

To HLS in particular.

I'm trying to prove to someone that what he read on Harvard's admissions site is misleading. I know that it's common knowledge that GPA and LSAT are just about the only things that matter but that's not good enough for this person.

Drop a link to some strong evidence, please.

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bk1
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby bk1 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:25 pm

lawschoolnumbers.com


d34d9823
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby d34d9823 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:27 pm

ThePennKid wrote:To HLS in particular.

I'm trying to prove to someone that what he read on Harvard's admissions site is misleading. I know that it's common knowledge that GPA and LSAT are just about the only things that matter but that's not good enough for this person.

Drop a link to some strong evidence, please.

That's not true - being black matters more than anything else. Also, softs do matter, it's just not very likely that your softs are significantly better than the girl with the better GPA/LSAT, who is presumably a motivated, successful person herself. All that said, http://harvard.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats is the place to go.

ThePennKid
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby ThePennKid » Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:29 pm

I don't think LSN will help.

The trolls on there putting admitted profiles with low numbers and rejected profiles with high numbers might just convince him that GPA and LSAT don't matter.

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beachbum
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby beachbum » Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:31 pm

Just go through LSN. Some schools are more obvious than others, but it seems to me that admits, waitlists, and rejects are are generally located in specific ranges. If softs made such a big difference, you would expect a more random distribution.

(Trends like this are especially noticeable at schools like WUSTL, where you have a wall of admits at 167).

However, HYS (particularly YS) seem to put more of an emphasis on softs than do most schools.

Edit: looks like a few people beat me to it.

d34d9823
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby d34d9823 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:33 pm

ThePennKid wrote:I don't think LSN will help.

The trolls on there putting admitted profiles with low numbers and rejected profiles with high numbers might just convince him that GPA and LSAT don't matter.

Those are not all trolls.

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bk1
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby bk1 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:39 pm

ThePennKid wrote:I don't think LSN will help.

The trolls on there putting admitted profiles with low numbers and rejected profiles with high numbers might just convince him that GPA and LSAT don't matter.


Then your friend is an idiot who doesn't understand statistics.

Is it possible to get into HLS with shitty numbers? Yes. Is it likely? No fucking way (barring URM).

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legalease9
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby legalease9 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:43 pm

Just look at their 25th 75th percentiles to see the strong correlation between high LSAT/GPA and acceptance.

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JazzOne
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby JazzOne » Tue Aug 24, 2010 1:20 pm

ThePennKid wrote:To HLS in particular.

I'm trying to prove to someone that what he read on Harvard's admissions site is misleading. I know that it's common knowledge that GPA and LSAT are just about the only things that matter but that's not good enough for this person.

Drop a link to some strong evidence, please.

Don't prove it to him. Just let him apply and see what happens.

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Knock
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby Knock » Tue Aug 24, 2010 1:25 pm

JazzOne wrote:
ThePennKid wrote:To HLS in particular.

I'm trying to prove to someone that what he read on Harvard's admissions site is misleading. I know that it's common knowledge that GPA and LSAT are just about the only things that matter but that's not good enough for this person.

Drop a link to some strong evidence, please.

Don't prove it to him. Just let him apply and see what happens.


This.

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TommyK
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby TommyK » Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:01 pm

Do you have 0% chance of getting into Harvard if you are below the 25th percentile in each? No. There's always that best-selling author, the pro poker player, the respected surgeon that enters the top tier schools with stats below the typical threshold. Top schools may take a flyer every once in a while on somebody that does not have the numbers to typically get into them, but it's usually on pretty remarkable cases, from what I understand.

But if you try to explain this nuanced message, I'm pretty sure your friend is going to have an experience right out of Dumb and Dumber:

Your friend: Hit me with it! Just give it to me straight! I came a long way just to see you! The least you can do is level with me. What are my chances?
HLS Adcomms: Not good
Your friend: You mean not good like one out of a hundred?
HLS Adcomms: I'd say more like one out of a million [pause]
Your friend: So you're telling me there's a chance... YEAH!

Look, in a world of limited resources, you spend your time and money on what has a reasonable expectation of yielding returns. Your buddy might have a weird, tiny, tiny shot of getting in without the numbers, but I probably wouldn't waste the moolah, or time generating another app.

Bumi
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby Bumi » Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:49 pm

beachbum wrote:(Trends like this are especially noticeable at schools like WUSTL, where you have a wall of admits at 167).


Emory is my favorite graph on LSN. It's as though nothing but LSAT matters to them.

d34d9823
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby d34d9823 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:53 pm

Bumi wrote:
beachbum wrote:(Trends like this are especially noticeable at schools like WUSTL, where you have a wall of admits at 167).


Emory is my favorite graph on LSN. It's as though nothing but LSAT matters to them.

lol I just saw that for the first time. Wish Harvard's was like that.

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Deuce
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby Deuce » Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:58 pm

I have a friend who is convinced that his 3.2 GPA isn't that bad because "law schools will see he got bad grades in lower classes, but did well in upper division courses!" and that law schools are going to be blown away by his full 2 years he has interned in a law office.

It's hard to listen to.

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clintonius
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby clintonius » Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:09 pm

Thought I had upon reading the title of this thread: "lawschoolnumbers.com"

This place makes me happy sometimes.

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bk1
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby bk1 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:20 pm

clintonius wrote:Thought I had upon reading the title of this thread: "lawschoolnumbers.com"

This place makes me happy sometimes.


TLS: A place for like-minded individuals.

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Patriot1208
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby Patriot1208 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:25 pm

bk1 wrote:
clintonius wrote:Thought I had upon reading the title of this thread: "lawschoolnumbers.com"

This place makes me happy sometimes.


TLS: A place for like-minded individuals.


Which equals over involved narcissists

d34d9823
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby d34d9823 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:30 pm

Patriot1208 wrote:Which equals over involved narcissists

Who pissed in your cereal this morning?

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Patriot1208
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby Patriot1208 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:32 pm

d34dluk3 wrote:
Patriot1208 wrote:Which equals over involved narcissists

Who pissed in your cereal this morning?


lol, no one, I realize that I am also one of those over involved narcissists, but you've been on this site long enough to know that is exactly what it is.

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TommyK
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby TommyK » Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:15 pm

Patriot1208 wrote:
d34dluk3 wrote:
Patriot1208 wrote:Which equals over involved narcissists

Who pissed in your cereal this morning?


lol, no one, I realize that I am also one of those over involved narcissists, but you've been on this site long enough to know that is exactly what it is.


"Still though, I think if you're not self-obsessed, you're probably boring" - Dave Eggers, A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius

Burger in a can
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Re: Evidence that law school admission is contigent on GPA/LSAT?

Postby Burger in a can » Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:19 pm

I just spent a day arguing with some people about this very topic: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=127607




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