I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

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rundoxierun
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby rundoxierun » Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:58 am

EnriqueL wrote:
ze2151 wrote:well there you go. i'm going to withdraw because you know a guy.


I know one guy with $200,000 in debt. I don't ask people about their finances. I do know a shit ton of others who have over $100,000 to pay back.

You know, people on this thread are really angry for some reason. Sorry for bursting your bubble.


Not angry.. just got kind of dumbfounded when you spent so much time complaining about money then dismissed the idea of attending Harvard or Stanford because you only have a good shot at biglaw. Im not really sure what you were looking for in law school. High pay with low stress and low hours and loving environment??

EnriqueL
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby EnriqueL » Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:58 am

BaiAilian2013 wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:
Sauer Grapes wrote:Do you mind sharing your specific school? It's not like that would out you.


Absolutely not.

Why not?


Because I don't want to trash my alma mater.

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legalease9
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby legalease9 » Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:58 am

tkgrrett wrote:Umm.. what?? I never said I hate anything. I have been lucky enough to see a bit of what Biglaw type lawyers do so I know the life. What I am saying is that Im not the type to look for that perfect job so Im not as put off by the lifestyle as most and more people need to realize what life is like in other fields compared to law. Is biglaw my dream?? No. Do I think its an acceptable job in comparison to other options? Hell yes.


Ok, maybe hate is strong. But you did say that its ok to take a job that "sucks" and then "find fulfillment" elsewhere it life.

Long hours and high stress is fine if you are fulfilled by your job.

My only point is that if you find NO fulfillment in your career, then you should get a different career.

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legalease9
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby legalease9 » Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:59 am

EnriqueL wrote:
BaiAilian2013 wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:
Sauer Grapes wrote:Do you mind sharing your specific school? It's not like that would out you.


Absolutely not.

Why not?


Because I don't want to trash my alma mater.


Why not?

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PKSebben
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby PKSebben » Fri Jul 02, 2010 11:59 am

EnriqueL wrote:a) 2013 might be worse.
b) Not really.
c) I am not the delusional one bro.


Let me break it down for you, hoss.

a)You: Preftigous non-biglaw positions are tough to get from STANFORD because of deferred-stipend biglaw d00ds.
Me: No, in 2013, there will be no subsidized biglaw dudes because law firms aren't a) deferring anymore (they're just not hiring them) and b) even if there are deferred associates, they're not getting defferals
You: 2013 might be worse.
Me: You're a fucking idiot who apparently can't read.

b) I graduated from Michigan. At Michigan, you can HANG A GODDAMN SHINGLE AND GET THE LRAP. YOU DONT KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

c) No U.

d) I'm sorry you don't want to out your obviously TTTT alma mater. Sorry you and your broheims shelled out 200k to attend a shithole. Did you really thing you were going to pull biglaw from Hofstra?

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Bildungsroman
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby Bildungsroman » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:00 pm

EnriqueL wrote:
tkgrrett wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:
tkgrrett wrote:Also, just would like to say that not just Biglaw is downsizing.. EVERYTHING is downsizing!! We had an all finance meeting at my company a few days ago and our CFO literally told an entire department(some sort of payroll) that their jobs could be gone at any moment("We havent decided anything yet but we are looking into it and will keep you posted"). Even in healthcare there are a lot of OPEN jobs but a lot of those jobs are just simply being unfilled on purpose. People complain about law but they need to show some viable alternatives at the same time. People also need to understand that a ~50%+ chance at 160k seen at most of T10 is phenomenal, and the ~70% chance seen at the T6 is beyond phenomenal. Yeah it sucks if you dont make it but seriously think about it.


LOL! "Law is doing badly. But so is everything else. Ergo I should go to law school."


Umm no.. more like "Im not wanting to go into law wanting to do fed work because I think its filled with unicorns and rainbows but in reality I would probably be complaining about that too." Im going to law school because I have seen the lifestyle and dont really mind it and I have numbers that will give me the opportunity to attend a school that will give me a decent shot at academia(which actually is my dream job) while also allowing me a shot at biglaw salary or govt entities if my priorities change.


Unless you go to HYS, you have almost no chance at academia unless you consider teaching torts to 1Ls at Florida Coastal to be academia.


Demonstrably false. Just went to a random T14 school's faculty websiteand clicked on random permanent faculty names. Saw JDs from Chicago, Northwestern, Cornell, Tulane, Kansas, Columbia, Michigan, BU, Georgetown, etc. in addition to a smattering of HYS. Sure, HYS give you a better chance, but those schools don't have a monopoly on opportunity. You, sir, are quite clearly dealing with your own inadequacy issues from your frustrated dreams and are attempting to blame everyone but yourself for your own failings.

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Rock Chalk
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby Rock Chalk » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:00 pm

EnriqueL wrote:Those jobs don't come easy. Especially not when you're competing with BigLaw-subsidized deferred associates. Besides, I don't have loans. So this is kind of beside the point. My friends who do all tell me that LRAP is more hype than substance. They're literally drowning in debt. I know a guy who at my school who's $200,000 in debt but without a real job.

Two questions:

1) Do you know what literally means? You gave me quite the mental picture.

2) Why do you suck so bad at quoting?

EnriqueL
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby EnriqueL » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:00 pm

legalease9 wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:
Sauer Grapes wrote:Do you mind sharing your specific school? It's not like that would out you.


Absolutely not.

Why not?


Because I don't want to trash my alma mater.


Why not?[/quote]

Because hurting its reputation hurts me.

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jackalope11
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby jackalope11 » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:01 pm

EnriqueL wrote:
ze2151 wrote:well there you go. i'm going to withdraw because you know a guy.


I know one guy with $200,000 in debt. I don't ask people about their finances. I do know a shit ton of others who have over $100,000 to pay back.

You know, people on this thread are really angry for some reason. Sorry for bursting your bubble.



Actually, I think that message was sarcasm. And the only real anger I've picked up has been from your posts... I know that it can be both difficult and frustrating to suffer the slings and arrows on a chat room, but please do not forget that this is your thread.

Remember when you mentioned that this wasn't 20 questions? Well now they're commenting, and you're upset? What would you have posters do, then? Readily agree with all of your points?


I remain confused.

EnriqueL
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby EnriqueL » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:01 pm

EnriqueL wrote:
tkgrrett wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:
tkgrrett wrote:Also, just would like to say that not just Biglaw is downsizing.. EVERYTHING is downsizing!! We had an all finance meeting at my company a few days ago and our CFO literally told an entire department(some sort of payroll) that their jobs could be gone at any moment("We havent decided anything yet but we are looking into it and will keep you posted"). Even in healthcare there are a lot of OPEN jobs but a lot of those jobs are just simply being unfilled on purpose. People complain about law but they need to show some viable alternatives at the same time. People also need to understand that a ~50%+ chance at 160k seen at most of T10 is phenomenal, and the ~70% chance seen at the T6 is beyond phenomenal. Yeah it sucks if you dont make it but seriously think about it.


LOL! "Law is doing badly. But so is everything else. Ergo I should go to law school."


Umm no.. more like "Im not wanting to go into law wanting to do fed work because I think its filled with unicorns and rainbows but in reality I would probably be complaining about that too." Im going to law school because I have seen the lifestyle and dont really mind it and I have numbers that will give me the opportunity to attend a school that will give me a decent shot at academia(which actually is my dream job) while also allowing me a shot at biglaw salary or govt entities if my priorities change.


Unless you go to HYS, you have almost no chance at academia unless you consider teaching torts to 1Ls at Florida Coastal to be academia.


Demonstrably false. Just went to a random T14 school's faculty websiteand clicked on random permanent faculty names. Saw JDs from Chicago, Northwestern, Cornell, Tulane, Kansas, Columbia, Michigan, BU, Georgetown, etc. in addition to a smattering of HYS. Sure, HYS give you a better chance, but those schools don't have a monopoly on opportunity. You, sir, are quite clearly dealing with your own inadequacy issues from your frustrated dreams and are attempting to blame everyone but yourself for your own failings.[/quote]


Chris Christie went to Seton Hall. You see, you too can be governor after attending a TTT!

I'm having difficulty quoting because I respond quickly to all your responses and because TLS does not let me put four quotes within a quote.
Last edited by EnriqueL on Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Bildungsroman
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby Bildungsroman » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:02 pm

Rock Chalk wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:Those jobs don't come easy. Especially not when you're competing with BigLaw-subsidized deferred associates. Besides, I don't have loans. So this is kind of beside the point. My friends who do all tell me that LRAP is more hype than substance. They're literally drowning in debt. I know a guy who at my school who's $200,000 in debt but without a real job.

Two questions:

1) Do you know what literally means? You gave me quite the mental picture.

2) Why do you suck so bad at quoting?


Image

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balzern
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby balzern » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:02 pm

Demonstrably false. Just went to a random T14 school's faculty websiteand clicked on random permanent faculty names. Saw JDs from Chicago, Northwestern, Cornell, Tulane, Kansas, Columbia, Michigan, BU, Georgetown, etc. in addition to a smattering of HYS. Sure, HYS give you a better chance, but those schools don't have a monopoly on opportunity. You, sir, are quite clearly dealing with your own inadequacy issues from your frustrated dreams and are attempting to blame everyone but yourself for your own failings.[/quote]


Boom! Headshot.

EnriqueL
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby EnriqueL » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:04 pm

balzern wrote:Demonstrably false. Just went to a random T14 school's faculty websiteand clicked on random permanent faculty names. Saw JDs from Chicago, Northwestern, Cornell, Tulane, Kansas, Columbia, Michigan, BU, Georgetown, etc. in addition to a smattering of HYS. Sure, HYS give you a better chance, but those schools don't have a monopoly on opportunity. You, sir, are quite clearly dealing with your own inadequacy issues from your frustrated dreams and are attempting to blame everyone but yourself for your own failings.



Boom! Headshot.[/quote]

Not at all. It's the weakest argument, and probably the one that's most responsible for people's stupid decisions. "So and so did such and such and became so successful. I can do it too!"

It reminds me of people telling me they don't care about school because Bill Gates dropped out of college.

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Rock Chalk
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby Rock Chalk » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:04 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:
Rock Chalk wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:Those jobs don't come easy. Especially not when you're competing with BigLaw-subsidized deferred associates. Besides, I don't have loans. So this is kind of beside the point. My friends who do all tell me that LRAP is more hype than substance. They're literally drowning in debt. I know a guy who at my school who's $200,000 in debt but without a real job.

Two questions:

1) Do you know what literally means? You gave me quite the mental picture.

2) Why do you suck so bad at quoting?


Image

Almost exactly, except somehow it was liquid debt! :shock:

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PKSebben
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby PKSebben » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:05 pm

EnriqueL wrote:
balzern wrote:Demonstrably false. Just went to a random T14 school's faculty websiteand clicked on random permanent faculty names. Saw JDs from Chicago, Northwestern, Cornell, Tulane, Kansas, Columbia, Michigan, BU, Georgetown, etc. in addition to a smattering of HYS. Sure, HYS give you a better chance, but those schools don't have a monopoly on opportunity. You, sir, are quite clearly dealing with your own inadequacy issues from your frustrated dreams and are attempting to blame everyone but yourself for your own failings.



Boom! Headshot.


Not at all. It's the weakest argument, and probably the one that's most responsible for people's stupid decisions. "So and so did such and such and became so successful. I can do it too!"

It reminds me of people telling me they don't care about school because Bill Gates dropped out of college.[/quote]

It's equally as valid as the story about your broheim with 200k in debt.

get it to x
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby get it to x » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:05 pm

You won't be our hero and take away our pain until you provide us with a school and geo location. If you have a legitimate critique regarding your alma mater at least it would potentially help out someone who is about to embark on the same road as you did three years ago.

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Rock Chalk
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby Rock Chalk » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:05 pm

EnriqueL wrote:Because hurting its reputation hurts me.

This is stupid. None of us are hiring partners at law firms. Not talking specifics ruins your credibility, and I'm pretty sure there aren't many of us who actually believe you went T14 debt free. HTH.

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KibblesAndVick
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby KibblesAndVick » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:07 pm

EnriqueL wrote:Because hurting its reputation hurts me.


If you actually want to help students to make an informed choice about their job prospects post law school you need to be specific. We need real data points. If you complain about how law schools lie and mislead with their statistics but then refuse to out your school because it will hurt the school's reputation you're nothing more than a hypocrite looking for a pity party. If you won't give details nothing you're saying is in anyway helpful. It's just scaremongering,

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legalease9
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby legalease9 » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:07 pm

EnriqueL wrote:
balzern wrote:Demonstrably false. Just went to a random T14 school's faculty websiteand clicked on random permanent faculty names. Saw JDs from Chicago, Northwestern, Cornell, Tulane, Kansas, Columbia, Michigan, BU, Georgetown, etc. in addition to a smattering of HYS. Sure, HYS give you a better chance, but those schools don't have a monopoly on opportunity. You, sir, are quite clearly dealing with your own inadequacy issues from your frustrated dreams and are attempting to blame everyone but yourself for your own failings.



Boom! Headshot.


Not at all. It's the weakest argument, and probably the one that's most responsible for people's stupid decisions. "So and so did such and such and became so successful. I can do it too!"

It reminds me of people telling me they don't care about school because Bill Gates dropped out of college.


There are a lot more non-HYS academics than Bill Gates'. There are over 170 Law schools currently. They can't all fill their entire academic rosters with HYS. HYS certainly has the easiest time sliding into academia, but there are other ways in.
Last edited by legalease9 on Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:08 pm, edited 3 times in total.

EnriqueL
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby EnriqueL » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:07 pm

PKSebben wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:
balzern wrote:Demonstrably false. Just went to a random T14 school's faculty websiteand clicked on random permanent faculty names. Saw JDs from Chicago, Northwestern, Cornell, Tulane, Kansas, Columbia, Michigan, BU, Georgetown, etc. in addition to a smattering of HYS. Sure, HYS give you a better chance, but those schools don't have a monopoly on opportunity. You, sir, are quite clearly dealing with your own inadequacy issues from your frustrated dreams and are attempting to blame everyone but yourself for your own failings.



Boom! Headshot.


Not at all. It's the weakest argument, and probably the one that's most responsible for people's stupid decisions. "So and so did such and such and became so successful. I can do it too!"

It reminds me of people telling me they don't care about school because Bill Gates dropped out of college.


It's equally as valid as the story about your broheim with 200k in debt.[/quote]

No, for this reason: students who graduate with debt and without jobs that provide them a hope of paying it back within a reasonable time are the norm. They're not the exception. The guy with $200,000 debt is just has it a few degrees worse than everyone else.

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Bildungsroman
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby Bildungsroman » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:07 pm

EnriqueL wrote:Chris Christie went to Seton Hall. You see, you too can be governor after attending a TTT!

I'm having difficulty quoting because I respond quickly to all your responses and because TLS does not let me put four quotes within a quote


As to your first point, sarcasm is a weak defensive mechanism.

As to your second point, see my previous comment about your inadequacies.

EnriqueL
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby EnriqueL » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:07 pm

legalease9 wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:
balzern wrote:Demonstrably false. Just went to a random T14 school's faculty websiteand clicked on random permanent faculty names. Saw JDs from Chicago, Northwestern, Cornell, Tulane, Kansas, Columbia, Michigan, BU, Georgetown, etc. in addition to a smattering of HYS. Sure, HYS give you a better chance, but those schools don't have a monopoly on opportunity. You, sir, are quite clearly dealing with your own inadequacy issues from your frustrated dreams and are attempting to blame everyone but yourself for your own failings.



Boom! Headshot.


Not at all. It's the weakest argument, and probably the one that's most responsible for people's stupid decisions. "So and so did such and such and became so successful. I can do it too!"

It reminds me of people telling me they don't care about school because Bill Gates dropped out of college.


There are a lot more non-HYS academics than Bill Gates'. Think about it logically. There are over 170 Law schools currently. They can't all fill their entire academic rosters with HYS. HYS certainly has the easiest time sliding into academia, but there are other ways in.





Hence my answer about TTTs. If that's academia, shoot.

EnriqueL
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby EnriqueL » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:08 pm

Rock Chalk wrote:
EnriqueL wrote:Because hurting its reputation hurts me.

This is stupid. None of us are hiring partners at law firms. Not talking specifics ruins your credibility, and I'm pretty sure there aren't many of us who actually believe you went T14 debt free. HTH.



You don't believe me that I went to a T14 debt-free? What the...

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romothesavior
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby romothesavior » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:09 pm

Come on people, this is TLS, not xoxo or one of those other eyesore websites. Learn how to quote so I don't want to smash my head against the wall when reading.

ze2151
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Re: I Definitely Do NOT Recommend Law School

Postby ze2151 » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:11 pm

Enrique- I'm not angry. Look up my post history. I'm not the guy your message is aimed at. I just think your piece of anecdotal evidence looked silly and out of place, so I made a snarky comment. Sorry to make YOU so angry.

Back to munching my popcorn.




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