Top Law Schools

naterj wrote:

ghenkis khan wrote:

rad law wrote:

ghenkis khan wrote:160 (after PT avg. of 165), 3.3 GPA. Chances of getting into u conn or reasonable goal for schools?

Chances of UConn? Decent. Chances of jobs from UConn? Not so hot.

Retake? Or any suggestions for schools that I'd have a shot at with any decent job prospects

If you're PTing at 165 use these 3 months to study and take the October. Give it one more shot.

I've definitely been considering retaking, however, I'll be living in Spain for the year teaching english and a little worried about taking it over there, and know very little about testing overseas. What if my score ended up being worse, any consequences from this?

TOMaHULK wrote: I'd like to go to Stetson, however I think this may be unobtainable. I'm not looking at schools such as Barry/FAMU (say what you want but they're accredited and ABA approved-plus Public and in-state tuition)/Nova Southeastern/Gulf Coast/Univ of Arkansas/Loloya/Mich State/WVU/Louisville/Charleston/Charlotte/etc-Note: Most of these are best on my LS Predictor possibilities. I'd like to stay in FL and based on my lower numbers I'm actually thinking that FAMU may be my best option (close to family and friends/instate tuition/they're accredited). But Barry in Orlando is also looking good too-although Private tuition.

Just figured I'd share. Yes I know a lot of you are better than me, etc...so please spare me of that. LOL

FL resident here.

For FL, you have to get into UF, FSU, Miami with close to full tuition, Stetson with close to full tuition, or don't go. This is not elitism, it is the economy. The market is glutted with 11 total schools, T14 plus Vandy and Emory people who want to work here, etc. Median kids at UF are having a tough time. Local govts. are barely hiring. The housing and tourism-based economy is terrible.

Barry - Indicative of the respect it commands, 4(!) firms come for OCI. Not respected. A joke and a swindle. Orlando may be a nice place to draw unemployment from, however.

FAMU - Recently accredited because it has been rocked by scandals. An embarrassment in tax-payer subsidized education, especially the Shirley Cunningham fen-phen scandal. Employers do not take FAMU seriously.

Nova - Another joke. One poster on TLS knows the recent law review editor (or someone on exec. board?), who is unemployed. This should be indicative of prospects for the rest of the students.

Hopefully the NA boost can get you in at UF or FSU.

rad law wrote:If I had lower numbers and wanted to stay down South, I'd still try Ole Miss, Bama, South Carolina, and a couple others before TN though (if I could pay in-state, obviously).

Agreed. Top schools in their state FTW.

rad law wrote:

TOMaHULK wrote: I'd like to go to Stetson, however I think this may be unobtainable. I'm not looking at schools such as Barry/FAMU (say what you want but they're accredited and ABA approved-plus Public and in-state tuition)/Nova Southeastern/Gulf Coast/Univ of Arkansas/Loloya/Mich State/WVU/Louisville/Charleston/Charlotte/etc-Note: Most of these are best on my LS Predictor possibilities. I'd like to stay in FL and based on my lower numbers I'm actually thinking that FAMU may be my best option (close to family and friends/instate tuition/they're accredited). But Barry in Orlando is also looking good too-although Private tuition.

Just figured I'd share. Yes I know a lot of you are better than me, etc...so please spare me of that. LOL

FL resident here.

For FL, you have to get into UF, FSU, Miami with close to full tuition, Stetson with close to full tuition, or don't go. This is not elitism, it is the economy. The market is glutted with 11 total schools, T14 plus Vandy and Emory people who want to work here, etc. Median kids at UF are having a tough time. Local govts. are barely hiring. The housing and tourism-based economy is terrible.

Barry - Indicative of the respect it commands, 4(!) firms come for OCI. Not respected. A joke and a swindle. Orlando may be a nice place to draw unemployment from, however.

FAMU - Recently accredited because it has been rocked by scandals. An embarrassment in tax-payer subsidized education, especially the Shirley Cunningham fen-phen scandal. Employers do not take FAMU seriously.

Nova - Another joke. One poster on TLS knows the recent Law Review editor (or someone on exec. board?), who is unemployed. This should be indicative of prospects for the rest of the students.

Hopefully the NA boost can get you in at UF or FSU.

I respect your thoughts. However, I must add that I have 2 friends that went to Barry and now have respectable jobs. I also have a buddy that went to Nova and got a decent job with the DA down in Miami Dade. So all hope isn't lost. But again, I don't disagree with you. I just think there's exceptions to every rule. Thank you for your thoughts. Note: I live down the road from Stetson, maybe their PT program...

TOMaHULK wrote: I respect your thoughts. However, I must add that I have 2 friends that went to Barry and now have respectable jobs. I also have a buddy that went to Nova and got a decent job with the DA down in Miami Dade. So all hope isn't lost. But again, I don't disagree with you. I just think there's exceptions to every rule. Thank you for your thoughts. Note: I live down the road from Stetson, maybe their PT program...

Did they graduate before or after the economy imploded?

Stetson PT is still not worth it without a massive scholarship.

rad law wrote:

deadpanic wrote:

rad law wrote:

GettingReady2010 wrote:Anyone have anything good or bad to say about Tennessee or Kentucky?

TN - Not the best school in the state. Vanderbilt kids DO take jobs there. 36 stayed in 2009. Tennessee only graduates 160.

True it is not the best school in state, but I'm sorry rad, this is kind of ridiculous. If you have in-state tuition (or a significant scholarship), can't get in Vandy (w/$), don't care about BigLaw, and want to practice in TN, UT is a good option. Tennessee loves their Vols.

I'll give you that most of the Vanderbilt people who did stay in TN stayed in Nashville (about 30 IIRC). So perhaps I am overstating this.

If I had lower numbers and wanted to stay down South, I'd still try Ole Miss, Bama, South Carolina, and a couple others before TN though (if I could pay in-state, obviously).

Bama is much harder to get into than TN. I think I have a secure admission from TN but not even a prayer so much at Bama.
TN is a good school and I assume they have a big alumni network.

rad law wrote:

TOMaHULK wrote: I'd like to go to Stetson, however I think this may be unobtainable. I'm not looking at schools such as Barry/FAMU (say what you want but they're accredited and ABA approved-plus Public and in-state tuition)/Nova Southeastern/Gulf Coast/Univ of Arkansas/Loloya/Mich State/WVU/Louisville/Charleston/Charlotte/etc-Note: Most of these are best on my LS Predictor possibilities. I'd like to stay in FL and based on my lower numbers I'm actually thinking that FAMU may be my best option (close to family and friends/instate tuition/they're accredited). But Barry in Orlando is also looking good too-although Private tuition.

Just figured I'd share. Yes I know a lot of you are better than me, etc...so please spare me of that. LOL

FL resident here.

For FL, you have to get into UF, FSU, Miami with close to full tuition, Stetson with close to full tuition, or don't go. This is not elitism, it is the economy. The market is glutted with 11 total schools, T14 plus Vandy and Emory people who want to work here, etc. Median kids at UF are having a tough time. Local govts. are barely hiring. The housing and tourism-based economy is terrible.

Barry - Indicative of the respect it commands, 4(!) firms come for OCI. Not respected. A joke and a swindle. Orlando may be a nice place to draw unemployment from, however.

FAMU - Recently accredited because it has been rocked by scandals. An embarrassment in tax-payer subsidized education, especially the Shirley Cunningham fen-phen scandal. Employers do not take FAMU seriously.

Nova - Another joke. One poster on TLS knows the recent Law Review editor (or someone on exec. board?), who is unemployed. This should be indicative of prospects for the rest of the students.

Hopefully the NA boost can get you in at UF or FSU.

I agree with this. I think FIU is a good median. Def not as good as UF/FSU/Mia/Stetson, and Mia takes the Miami market well, but it is more respected and I believe it is on the rise. Plus it's a LOT cheaper and takes a lot lower numbers.

rad law wrote:

ghenkis khan wrote:160 (after PT avg. of 165), 3.3 GPA. Chances of getting into u conn or reasonable goal for schools?

Chances of UConn? Decent. Chances of jobs from UConn? Not so hot.

Define decent. He's below both medians... Retake is TCR.



Edit: Not to say there is no shot with those numbers, but I'd say your chances of getting in are 25% or so...

fenway wrote: romo, you should have your own thread where people can consolidate their hopes and dreams while you lay in the cyber cut ready to nintendo-duck-hunt the f*ck out of all the hapless chimeras that are brought before you

That's fine. Rad law can be the goofy smiling dog who fetches the fallen ducks.

Also, my hopes and dreams were also Nintendo-duck hunted when I picked WUSTL. So no hard feelings.

darby girl wrote: I agree with this. I think FIU is a good median. Def not as good as UF/FSU/Mia/Stetson, and Mia takes the Miami market well, but it is more respected and I believe it is on the rise. Plus it's a LOT cheaper and takes a lot lower numbers.

FIU wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, but it's still not such a great idea. If you graduate from FIU jobless at least you will be in less debt. Trying for a scholarship is key though. Big law chances are pretty much nil. A couple FIU people are on TLS. One is trying his best to transfer, and the other one has pretty much a full scholarship, so she is cool with $60k-ish starting. Even that amount is atypical however and only goes to people near the top of the class, IIRC.

"On the rise" is debatable, but even if it is, it probably won't help you in 3 years.

rad law wrote:

darby girl wrote: I agree with this. I think FIU is a good median. Def not as good as UF/FSU/Mia/Stetson, and Mia takes the Miami market well, but it is more respected and I believe it is on the rise. Plus it's a LOT cheaper and takes a lot lower numbers.

FIU wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, but it's still not such a great idea. If you graduate from FIU jobless at least you will be in less debt. Trying for a scholarship is key though. Big law chances are pretty much nil. A couple FIU people are on TLS. One is trying his best to transfer, and the other one has pretty much a full scholarship, so she is cool with $60k-ish starting. Even that amount is atypical however and only goes to people near the top of the class, IIRC.

"On the rise" is debatable, but even if it is, it probably won't help you in 3 years.

I just meant that it is becoming more well-known, because it is still very new. And it is, IMO, MUCH better than barry, fl coastal, FAMU, all the others. I don't consider FIU a joke, is more what I mean.

[

deadpanic wrote:

rad law wrote:

GettingReady2010 wrote: True it is not the best school in state, but I'm sorry rad, this is kind of ridiculous. If you have in-state tuition (or a significant scholarship), can't get in Vandy (w/$), don't care about BigLaw, and want to practice in TN, UT is a good option. Tennessee loves their Vols.

I'll give you that most of the Vanderbilt people who did stay in TN stayed in Nashville (about 30 IIRC). So perhaps I am overstating this.

If I had lower numbers and wanted to stay down South, I'd still try Ole Miss, Bama, South Carolina, and a couple others before TN though (if I could pay in-state, obviously).

Bama is much harder to get into than TN. I think I have a secure admission from TN but not even a prayer so much at Bama.
TN is a good school and I assume they have a big alumni network.

Actually, I would recommend Memphis over UTenn despite the rankings. The school has a good relationship with Baker, Donelson so you have a shot at a job in both the memphis and nashville ofices. Also, there are quite a few smaller firms in Memphis that take in a few alumni. Also, may have a shot at a few of the decent Little Rock firms(Mitchell Williams, Rose) but not really 100% sure there.

tkgrrett wrote:[

deadpanic wrote:

rad law wrote:

GettingReady2010 wrote: True it is not the best school in state, but I'm sorry rad, this is kind of ridiculous. If you have in-state tuition (or a significant scholarship), can't get in Vandy (w/$), don't care about BigLaw, and want to practice in TN, UT is a good option. Tennessee loves their Vols.

I'll give you that most of the Vanderbilt people who did stay in TN stayed in Nashville (about 30 IIRC). So perhaps I am overstating this.

If I had lower numbers and wanted to stay down South, I'd still try Ole Miss, Bama, South Carolina, and a couple others before TN though (if I could pay in-state, obviously).

Bama is much harder to get into than TN. I think I have a secure admission from TN but not even a prayer so much at Bama.
TN is a good school and I assume they have a big alumni network.

Actually, I would recommend Memphis over UTenn despite the rankings. The school has a good relationship with Baker, Donelson so you have a shot at a job in both the memphis and nashville ofices. Also, there are quite a few smaller firms in Memphis that take in a few alumni. Also, may have a shot at a few of the decent Little Rock firms(Mitchell Williams, Rose) but not really 100% sure there.

Really? The only reason I would go to Memphis over TN (is memphis private?) is if I got some money and it became a good bit cheaper.

tkgrrett wrote:

deadpanic wrote:

rad law wrote:

GettingReady2010 wrote: True it is not the best school in state, but I'm sorry rad, this is kind of ridiculous. If you have in-state tuition (or a significant scholarship), can't get in Vandy (w/$), don't care about BigLaw, and want to practice in TN, UT is a good option. Tennessee loves their Vols.

I'll give you that most of the Vanderbilt people who did stay in TN stayed in Nashville (about 30 IIRC). So perhaps I am overstating this.

If I had lower numbers and wanted to stay down South, I'd still try Ole Miss, Bama, South Carolina, and a couple others before TN though (if I could pay in-state, obviously).

Bama is much harder to get into than TN. I think I have a secure admission from TN but not even a prayer so much at Bama.
TN is a good school and I assume they have a big alumni network.

Actually, I would recommend Memphis over UTenn despite the rankings. The school has a good relationship with Baker, Donelson so you have a shot at a job in both the memphis and nashville ofices. Also, there are quite a few smaller firms in Memphis that take in a few alumni. Also, may have a shot at a few of the decent Little Rock firms(Mitchell Williams, Rose) but not really 100% sure there.

Granted I am not particularly knowledgeable on the Tennessee legal market, but I am almost positive this is not TCR.

Both schools are decent, cheap options for people who are from TN and want to practice in TN. But going to one of these schools and dropping 150k on one of them is a bad, bad call, especially if you are trying to have some portability within the region.

tkgrrett wrote:[

deadpanic wrote:

rad law wrote:

GettingReady2010 wrote: I'll give you that most of the Vanderbilt people who did stay in TN stayed in Nashville (about 30 IIRC). So perhaps I am overstating this.

If I had lower numbers and wanted to stay down South, I'd still try Ole Miss, Bama, South Carolina, and a couple others before TN though (if I could pay in-state, obviously).

Bama is much harder to get into than TN. I think I have a secure admission from TN but not even a prayer so much at Bama.
TN is a good school and I assume they have a big alumni network.

Actually, I would recommend Memphis over UTenn despite the rankings. The school has a good relationship with Baker, Donelson so you have a shot at a job in both the memphis and nashville ofices. Also, there are quite a few smaller firms in Memphis that take in a few alumni. Also, may have a shot at a few of the decent Little Rock firms(Mitchell Williams, Rose) but not really 100% sure there.

Really? The only reason I would go to Memphis over TN (is memphis private?) is if I got some money and it became a good bit cheaper.

Both are state schools.. if you get money at UTenn you will likely get money at Memphis too.. All the best firms in the state are in Nashville and Memphis. The city of Memphis has kind of an inferiority complex so it aggressively pushes for alums of Memphis to get positions in Memphis/West TN and the school can get a few positions in Nashville. UTenn is in east TN and not really any sizeable firms nearby. Facilities wise, I have actually never been to UTenn school of law but Memphis just opened a brand new, and very nice, law school overlooking the Mississippi river.

darby girl wrote: Really? The only reason I would go to Memphis over TN (is memphis private?) is if I got some money and it became a good bit cheaper.

They have in-state. I'd immediately be suspicious of a school whose website looks as bad as theirs does though.

http://www.memphis.edu/law/future/index.php

tkgrrett wrote:

deadpanic wrote:

rad law wrote:

GettingReady2010 wrote:
I'll give you that most of the Vanderbilt people who did stay in TN stayed in Nashville (about 30 IIRC). So perhaps I am overstating this.

If I had lower numbers and wanted to stay down South, I'd still try Ole Miss, Bama, South Carolina, and a couple others before TN though (if I could pay in-state, obviously).

Bama is much harder to get into than TN. I think I have a secure admission from TN but not even a prayer so much at Bama.
TN is a good school and I assume they have a big alumni network.

Actually, I would recommend Memphis over UTenn despite the rankings. The school has a good relationship with Baker, Donelson so you have a shot at a job in both the memphis and nashville ofices. Also, there are quite a few smaller firms in Memphis that take in a few alumni. Also, may have a shot at a few of the decent Little Rock firms(Mitchell Williams, Rose) but not really 100% sure there.

Granted I am not particularly knowledgeable on the Tennessee legal market, but I am almost positive this is not TCR.

Both schools are decent, cheap options for people who are from TN and want to practice in TN. But going to one of these schools and dropping 150k on one of them is a bad, bad call, especially if you are trying to have some portability within the region.

I am particularly knowledgeable on the TN legal market. Obviously you shouldnt be coming to these schools expecting portability to nyc or chicago but given the two choices this is what I recommend. Im not encouraging anyone to spend 150k on either, but if they are choosing between these two schools and are definitely attending one this is what i recommend thinking about.

rad law wrote:

darby girl wrote: Really? The only reason I would go to Memphis over TN (is memphis private?) is if I got some money and it became a good bit cheaper.

They have in-state. I'd immediately be suspicious of a school whose website looks as bad as theirs does though.

http://www.memphis.edu/law/future/index.php

Not really sure what you mean.. that is a fairly standard site and the school colors are blue and gray.

Edit: actual home page: http://www.memphis.edu/law/

tkgrrett wrote:Facilities wise, I have actually never been to UTenn school of law but Memphis just opened a brand new, and very nice, law school overlooking the Mississippi river.

It always puzzles me when people talk about facilities. I would go to school in a cardboard box if I had a guaranteed 75% shot (not even a 100% shot) at market in ATL.

tkgrrett wrote:Actually, I would recommend Memphis over UTenn despite the rankings. The school has a good relationship with Baker, Donelson so you have a shot at a job in both the memphis and nashville ofices. Also, there are quite a few smaller firms in Memphis that take in a few alumni. Also, may have a shot at a few of the decent Little Rock firms(Mitchell Williams, Rose) but not really 100% sure there.

This is definitely not credited. Memphis is a backup option for everyone that is denied at UT. Granted, Memphis Law isn't terrible or anything for those wanting to work in Memphis, but UT gives you a shot at everything from Memphis to Bristol. Memphis Law is not good for anything outside the city or West TN. If by Little Rock you mean West Memphis, Arkansas, then yeah, it is a good option as well.

Bottom line, UT is cheaper and has better job prospects. UT grads fare much better with Baker Donelson.

rad law wrote:

tkgrrett wrote:Facilities wise, I have actually never been to UTenn school of law but Memphis just opened a brand new, and very nice, law school overlooking the Mississippi river.

It always puzzles me when people talk about facilities. I would go to school in a cardboard box if I had a guaranteed 75% shot (not even a 100% shot) at market in ATL.

Seriously man.. enough is enough.. point was that these two schools, while in the same state, face different market conditions that isnt accounted for by rank. Some people ask about facilities so I included the fact that it is a new school.. you question talking about facilities then you bash a super standard website for some reason. Im not applying to either school, just trying to be helpful. Its idiots like you that make TLS a joke for anything besides LSAT prep and the school profiles.

tkgrrett wrote:
I am particularly knowledgeable on the TN legal market. Obviously you shouldnt be coming to these schools expecting portability to nyc or chicago but given the two choices this is what I recommend. Im not encouraging anyone to spend 150k on either, but if they are choosing between these two schools and are definitely attending one this is what i recommend thinking about.

Fair enough. I'm sure you make good points. But do you have any data to back that up? Neither school is even in the top 50 in the NLJ 250 Go to Law schools, which means their biglaw placement was around 10% or lower. (And that is quasi-pre ITE, meaning that their numbers are probably even worse now). Maybe NLJ isn't a fair metric to judge these schools on considering there aren't really any powerful markets in Tennessee, but what would you suggest then?

tkgrrett wrote:

rad law wrote:

tkgrrett wrote:Facilities wise, I have actually never been to UTenn school of law but Memphis just opened a brand new, and very nice, law school overlooking the Mississippi river.

It always puzzles me when people talk about facilities. I would go to school in a cardboard box if I had a guaranteed 75% shot (not even a 100% shot) at market in ATL.

Seriously man.. enough is enough.. point was that these two schools, while in the same state, face different market conditions that isnt accounted for by rank. Some people ask about facilities so I included the fact that it is a new school.. you question talking about facilities then you bash a super standard website for some reason. Im not applying to either school, just trying to be helpful. Its idiots like you that make TLS a joke for anything besides LSAT prep and the school profiles.

I was speaking more in a general fashion, but me being a cynical ass is fairly common knowledge.

rad law wrote:

tkgrrett wrote:

rad law wrote:

tkgrrett wrote:Facilities wise, I have actually never been to UTenn school of law but Memphis just opened a brand new, and very nice, law school overlooking the Mississippi river.

It always puzzles me when people talk about facilities. I would go to school in a cardboard box if I had a guaranteed 75% shot (not even a 100% shot) at market in ATL.

Seriously man.. enough is enough.. point was that these two schools, while in the same state, face different market conditions that isnt accounted for by rank. Some people ask about facilities so I included the fact that it is a new school.. you question talking about facilities then you bash a super standard website for some reason. Im not applying to either school, just trying to be helpful. Its idiots like you that make TLS a joke for anything besides LSAT prep and the school profiles.

I was speaking more in a general fashion, but me being a cynical ass is fairly common knowledge.

This.

But also, he has a great point. If Yale conducted classes in an abandoned warehouse, I'd go there over any of the beautiful campuses at Michigan, Cornell, Vandy, etc.

romothesavior wrote:

tkgrrett wrote:
I am particularly knowledgeable on the TN legal market. Obviously you shouldnt be coming to these schools expecting portability to nyc or chicago but given the two choices this is what I recommend. Im not encouraging anyone to spend 150k on either, but if they are choosing between these two schools and are definitely attending one this is what i recommend thinking about.

Fair enough. I'm sure you make good points. But do you have any data to back that up? Neither school is even in the top 50 in the NLJ 250 Go to Law schools, which means their biglaw placement was around 10% or lower. (And that is quasi-pre ITE, meaning that their numbers are probably even worse now). Maybe NLJ isn't a fair metric to judge these schools on considering there aren't really any powerful markets in Tennessee, but what would you suggest then?

Again.. look at the title of this thread. This is for people looking at schools mostly not ranking high on NLJ 250. I am not applying to either of these schools in the fall because I will have much better options. Not everyone applying will. These are not schools you go to planning on going into Biglaw. There isnt a mass of data on this because these schools just dont have the range for that. I happen to be involved in the business/legal community in the midsouth and thats where my info comes from. If you want you can check out the baker donelson sites for the memphis and nashville offices and im sure you will find a decent(not overwhelming of course) amount of employed Memphis grads that graduated over the last 8 or 9 years. Even that doesnt really tell you a lot though since very few grads from either school will have a shot of making it there. The city is Memphis is on a push to retain talent, even going so far as to create a government department dedicated to it.

Neither school is overwhelmingly better than the other. Just trying to offer something to look at.