Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

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ScrabbleChamp
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Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby ScrabbleChamp » Fri Jun 25, 2010 10:47 am

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Last edited by ScrabbleChamp on Sun May 20, 2012 10:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Iconoclast
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby Iconoclast » Fri Jun 25, 2010 10:57 am

He must include all transcripts. if he doesn't, then two things will happen.

1. The bar will find out.
2. He will be screwed.

And yes, the bar will find out. There are clearinghouses that have information about his/your attendance at almost every school in the nation. (Not all schools send info in to them, but more than 3000 do.) When the bar checks these databases and sees an institution that is not listed on his app, he's going down in flames.


Edit:
And just to clarify... by "screwed" I mean two things:
1. His school would have the option of revoking his degree since his application was fraudulent.
2. The bar would almost certainly ding him on character and fitness and he would not be allowed to practice law even if the school didn't pull his diploma.

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jackalope11
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby jackalope11 » Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:00 am

I believe that there are some other threads that could confirm this information... However, if your friend does not turn in all of his transcripts, as required he could potentially:

1. Receive some sort of disciplinary letter from the LSAC, which would then be attached to any application he submitted. (Thereby making it unlikely that any accredited LS would give him a chance.)

2. Have any scholarship offer rescinded if the omission were ever discovered.

3. Risk his chances at admission to the bar.

4. Possibly face other measures from the ABA during his career. (Including, I am sure, disbarment.)

Look, all lawyer jokes aside (and as I believe Susan Estridge points out in her book), you are required to take an oath to practice the law. Does your friend really want to start out his legal career lying about his past mistakes?

I did virtually the same thing with my studies in the beginning... I bit the bullet and submitted ALL of my transcripts and took my lumps... and still ended up at a ranked institution. Give your friend some good advice and tell him this is a terrible idea.

HTH...

shutterbug
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby shutterbug » Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:02 am

Have people previously done the same thing you describe and have gotten away with it? Probably.

Not worth the risk, though, so your advice to your friend should be to disclose. All that tuition and time will be for nothing if he can't get accepted to the bar. Definitely not worth the risk.

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vamedic03
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby vamedic03 » Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:05 am

ScrabbleChamp wrote:I am going to be starting law school this fall and, because of this, most of my friends now think I am an expert in the law, which couldn't be further from the truth. A friend of mine asked me a question about transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar, and I have no clue, so I'm posing the question here.

After high school, he piddled around at a part-time job and went to a local community college for a year. He failed every single class because he never went/drank too much/insert failure of an excuse here. He then decided he was being foolish, applied to the local state college, got in, and just graduated with a 3.5+- GPA. The 4-year has no idea he ever went to a community college, so there is no note of that on his transcripts. He does not want to disclose his community college transcripts, as they would probably bring down his 3.5 GPA to a 2.9 GPA.

His question is this: If he just lies about ever going to the community college, and because there is no record of it on his 4-year transcripts, is there any way the LSDAS or Bar will ever find out? I told him he should submit the transcripts, as it'll save him from worrying for 3 years of law school whether or not he'll have wasted his time, not to mention, I think it is pretty easy to explain how being 18, on your own for the first time, and partying too hard can negatively affect your grades. Plus, he had a decent GPA, so I think a good essay will go a long way in helping. However, any idea how/if this could affect him by not disclosing the info?



If he can't be honest about a transcript, then HE SHOULDN'T BE A LAWYER. Lawyers are entrusted with significant amounts of client money and significant levels of responsibility. It sucks that he screwed around in Community College, but, its part of his past and failure to disclose it is DISHONEST.

People on this site need to stop trying to escape their pasts by hiding it. Accept responsibility, own your past, and move on. Part of maturity is accepting your past and owning your mistakes.

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ScrabbleChamp
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby ScrabbleChamp » Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:09 am

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Last edited by ScrabbleChamp on Wed May 30, 2012 3:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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jackalope11
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby jackalope11 » Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:16 am

ScrabbleChamp wrote:I figured that was what would be said. I just wanted to see what others had to say. I doubt he will disclose, though. I told him they (the Bar) have ways of finding stuff out, like the Student Clearing House (where I had to get my transcripts from), but he said that the community college isn't on the list of schools that report... I guess I can tell him that the Bar may interview friends (i.e. me), and I'm surely not risking my career to lie for him!



I think your friend is missing the point, honestly... It doesn't matter if they don't find out what his grades were or not. It only matters if they find out that he ENROLLED in a school and never submitted the transcript...

Even if the school doesn't report grades, either LSAC or the Bar will find out about it. As soon as they see he enrolled in a school and didn't submit the transcript, the game is up.

LSAC's only job is to make sure that their reports are accurate. As such, it seems to be pretty good at figuring it out. Not to mention, we are single-shot players in this system, whereas they are experts. This type of gamesmanship is run-of-the-mill business for them.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby vanwinkle » Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:21 am

vamedic03 wrote:If he can't be honest about a transcript, then HE SHOULDN'T BE A LAWYER. Lawyers are entrusted with significant amounts of client money and significant levels of responsibility. It sucks that he screwed around in Community College, but, its part of his past and failure to disclose it is DISHONEST.

People on this site need to stop trying to escape their pasts by hiding it. Accept responsibility, own your past, and move on. Part of maturity is accepting your past and owning your mistakes.

THIS.

dramaticpaws
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby dramaticpaws » Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:09 pm

1. Your friend sounds like an idiot.

2. LSDAS will likely find all of your places of attendance. I went to a junior college for a semester in 1998 and decided it wasn't for me. I then attended a state school part of which I had to do a field course covered by another university. I then completed an MBA. I only reported the two degree granting institutions at first and LSDAS dinged me and said I need to submit transcripts from all four institutions. I wasn't trying to game the system, I just thought they needed degree-granting info. They want it all and will most likely find out about your friend's past at the comm. college.

3. To paraphrase vamedic03: disclose it and grow up!

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acrossthelake
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Re: Transcripts, LSDAS, and the Bar...

Postby acrossthelake » Fri Jun 25, 2010 1:05 pm

Not to hijack this thread, but relevant question as to LSAC being angry-face at me.

So they say to send a transcript even if:
"# you have just enrolled
(Request that the registrar's office send a transcript of courses "in progress" or a statement of current enrollment. The document must bear the official registrar's seal.) "

So, I wasn't sure if I wanted to take a community college this summer and did the application because I hadn't made up my mind by deadline. Decided that I didn't want to before registration, so now I am "enrolled" for the summer, but signed up for 0 courses, and will remain signed up for 0 courses. There will be no courses or grades to see, ever, though I am "enrolled". Is it necessary to send a transcript from there?




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