Academia

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Miracle
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Academia

Postby Miracle » Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:00 pm

What are best law schools for someone that is interested in academia?

Tautology
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Re: Academia

Postby Tautology » Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:00 pm

The best law schools.

acrossthelake
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Re: Academia

Postby acrossthelake » Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:03 pm

Yale.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Academia

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:03 pm

Yale is often thought of as a law school for the academically minded. But most of academia is based on the individual's accomplishments such as documented research & authored publications. Graduating in the top 5% of your law school class, getting published in a law review, becoming a law review editor & then obtaining a SJD degree after completing law school should open opportunities for you in legal academia. I am not sure that one's JD granting law school matters much so long as it is a top tier law school, and usually those seeking a career as a law school professor will have gone to a top ranked law school anyway.
My best advice is to research law schools that grant the SJD degree & determine their admissions standards and requirements.
Last edited by CanadianWolf on Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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gwuorbust
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Re: Academia

Postby gwuorbust » Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:15 pm

Cooley. you will be a shoe-in for teaching the law for sure*


*in at least one backwoods highschool american government class

bigben
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Re: Academia

Postby bigben » Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:30 pm

school, grades (yale 20%, h/s 10%, ccn 5%, mvpbndcg 3%, rest nevar)

+

lr (bonus: publication)

+

coa

=

academia

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nealric
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Re: Academia

Postby nealric » Thu Jun 24, 2010 1:53 pm

Only Yale is a good enough shot at academia that you can really just decide ex-ante to get into it. Otherwise, you pretty much need to wait and see how you perform. Then, go for the prestigious clerkship and get as many publications as possible under your belt.

Researching law schools with SJD programs is pointless. Do that after law school graduation if you are one of the very few candidates for which the SJD is the right choice- if it's for you, you probably already know why.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Academia

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:04 pm

Researching law schools that award the SJD degree will offer more reliable information about academic careers in law than any other source with which I am familiar. Researching SJD programs doesn't mean that you will have to attend, but it is the only resource to my knowledge that is targeted exclusively to those with strong interests in law school academia.

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vamedic03
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Re: Academia

Postby vamedic03 » Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:42 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:Researching law schools that award the SJD degree will offer more reliable information about academic careers in law than any other source with which I am familiar. Researching SJD programs doesn't mean that you will have to attend, but it is the only resource to my knowledge that is targeted exclusively to those with strong interests in law school academia.


This is incorrect.

The best resource is Larry Solum's blog: http://lsolum.typepad.com/legaltheory/

Prof. Solum collects and publishes statistics on law professor hiring.

FYI - ALMOST NO PROFESSOR HAS A SJD. If they have something other than a JD, its a PHD that provided them with the skills for conducting empirical research.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Academia

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:44 pm

Doesn't have to get the SJD, just the information & use the resources. You will learn more from law professors connected with a SJD program about academia then from any other source with which I am familiar.
Last edited by CanadianWolf on Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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mallard
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Re: Academia

Postby mallard » Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:48 pm

Most of the information in this thread is direly wrong. Top grades and clerkships and law review matter less and less. School quality and professor recommendations matter a lot, as does publication record. An SJD is the worst idea I've ever fucking heard.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Academia

Postby CanadianWolf » Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:49 pm

Again, use the resources of the program. An SJD is the surest way to become a law professor, although not required.

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mallard
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Re: Academia

Postby mallard » Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:50 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:Again, use the resources of the program. An SJD is the surest way to become a law professor, although not required.


As evidenced by the fact that there are no law professors with SJDs, or what?

Kretzy
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Re: Academia

Postby Kretzy » Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:52 pm

mallard wrote:Most of the information in this thread is direly wrong. Top grades and clerkships and law review matter less and less. School quality and professor recommendations matter a lot, as does publication record. An SJD is the worst idea I've ever fucking heard.


This seems to be what I've heard from everyone. School, plus faculty who will go to bat for you, plus publications. That's why a PhD is helpful...not for the credential, but for the ability to publish now and have a body of future research you can discuss with hiring committees.

Unless your degree is a Bachelor of Laws from a European country/Australia...and SJD is useless. Folks like Rosalind Dixon at UChicago have an SJD...but they're a vast minority, even with folks who aren't from American law schools.

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doyleoil
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Re: Academia

Postby doyleoil » Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:53 pm

mallard wrote:Most of the information in this thread is direly wrong. Top grades and clerkships and law review matter less and less. School quality and professor recommendations matter a lot, as does publication record. An SJD is the worst idea I've ever fucking heard.


or, if you won't listen to this (i.e. reason), then read this:

http://www.law.uchicago.edu/careerservi ... awteaching

note the conspicuous lack of a "get sjd ----> models and bottles academia" path

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Bildungsroman
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Re: Academia

Postby Bildungsroman » Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:55 pm

Chose a random school, William & Mary, and looked at its law faculty page. Saw law degrees from the following schools:


Harvard x6
UVA x5
Yale x5
Stanford x4
Duke x3
Columbia x2
Berkeley x2
Chicago x2
Georgetown x2
Vanderbilt
San Diego
George Washington
UCLA
Illinois
William and Mary
UNC
Wisconsin

So, you don't need to go to YHS to become a law professor, but it certainly helps, and schools don't seem to slum much outside of T20.

acrossthelake
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Re: Academia

Postby acrossthelake » Thu Jun 24, 2010 10:56 pm

http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2009 ... hing.shtml
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2008 ... hing.shtml
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2006 ... hing.shtml
Group 1 (1)
Yale Law School

Group 2 (2-4)
Harvard Law School
Stanford Law School
University of Chicago Law School

Group 3 (5-8)
Columbia Law School
New York University School of Law
University of California, Berkeley Boalt Hall School of Law
University of Michigan Law School

Group 4 (9)
University of Virginia Law School

Group 5 (10-17)
Cornell Law School
Duke University School of Law
Georgetown University Law Center
Northwestern University School of Law
University of California, Los Angeles School of Law
University of Minnesota Law School
University of Pennsylvania Law School
University of Texas School of Law




http://www.leiterrankings.com/faculty/2 ... tion.shtml
Quality of jobs is evaluated along three dimensions: the number of graduates placed as tenure-track faculty at the top 15 law faculties, based on EQR measures (Yale, Harvard, Chicago, Stanford, Columbia, Berkeley, NYU, Michigan, Texas, Penn, Cornell, Northwestern, Virginia, Duke, Georgetown); the number of graduates placed as tenure-track faculty at "tier 1" or "top 50" law faculties, again based on EQR criteria; and the number placed at U.S. News tier 1 schools (since there is some arbitrary fluctuation at the margins, we used several years of U.S. News to define tier 1).

Based on these criteria, the top fifteen law schools from which to earn a J.D. for purposes of getting in to law teaching are as follows.
1. Yale University
2. Harvard University
Stanford University
4. University of Chicago
University of Michigan, Ann Arbor
6. Columbia University
University of California, Berkeley
University of Virginia
9. New York University
10. Cornell University
Duke University
Georgetown University
University of Pennsylvania
University of Texas, Austin

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ck3
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Re: Academia

Postby ck3 » Sat Jun 26, 2010 10:26 am

doyleoil wrote:
mallard wrote:Most of the information in this thread is direly wrong. Top grades and clerkships and law review matter less and less. School quality and professor recommendations matter a lot, as does publication record. An SJD is the worst idea I've ever fucking heard.


or, if you won't listen to this (i.e. reason), then read this:

http://www.law.uchicago.edu/careerservi ... awteaching

note the conspicuous lack of a "get sjd ----> models and bottles academia" path



Actually in Brian Leiter's article which you linked to, he does mention getting an SJD as a possible enhancement of your chances.

"The key to Path B is some additional academic experience/research after graduating from law school, and perhaps after getting some practice experience. This might take the form of a graduate law degree (an LL.M., less commonly for American lawyer, an S.J.D.) at a top law school (usually this means: Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Columbia, maybe also NYU [esp. for tax] [Chicago offers LLM and SJD degrees, but primarily for foreign-trained lawyers];"

Renzo
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Re: Academia

Postby Renzo » Sat Jun 26, 2010 10:39 am

mallard wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:Again, use the resources of the program. An SJD is the surest way to become a law professor, although not required.


As evidenced by the fact that there are no law professors with SJDs, or what?


I think CanadianWolf is one of the smartest posters on this board. No matter how hard I tried to be as consistently wrong as he is, I wouldn't be able to match his level of successful and constant wrongness. That takes skill.




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