Percentiles for GPAs

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lawls
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Percentiles for GPAs

Postby lawls » Sun Jun 20, 2010 2:03 am

I doubt this exists, but is there any information out there regarding how many law school applicants have certain GPAs? For instance, what percentile GPA is a 3.9? A 3.5?

One way to look at this, I suppose, is to look at the aggregate LSN data. I'm not sure if there are any predictor websites that present the aggregate data, though.

I was also looking at the Yale admissions chart (that looks a little dated) to see what the GPAs look like at the top schools:

http://officialguide.lsac.org/SearchRes ... AC3987.pdf

What I found surprising is that the number of 3.75+ GPAs isn't that much greater than the number of 170+ LSATs, although I suppose it is possible that there are quite a few more reverse splitters out there who aren't bothering to apply to Yale.

xyzzzzzzzz
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Re: Percentiles for GPAs

Postby xyzzzzzzzz » Sun Jun 20, 2010 3:17 am

When you send your transcripts to LSAC, they calculate the % for your school. This basically tells you where your gpa ranks in comparison to others at your school.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Percentiles for GPAs

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Sun Jun 20, 2010 3:23 am

lawls wrote:I doubt this exists, but is there any information out there regarding how many law school applicants have certain GPAs? For instance, what percentile GPA is a 3.9? A 3.5?

One way to look at this, I suppose, is to look at the aggregate LSN data. I'm not sure if there are any predictor websites that present the aggregate data, though.

I was also looking at the Yale admissions chart (that looks a little dated) to see what the GPAs look like at the top schools:

http://officialguide.lsac.org/SearchRes ... AC3987.pdf

What I found surprising is that the number of 3.75+ GPAs isn't that much greater than the number of 170+ LSATs, although I suppose it is possible that there are quite a few more reverse splitters out there who aren't bothering to apply to Yale.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Percentiles for GPAs

Postby Lawquacious » Sun Jun 20, 2010 3:57 am

The reason that an overall LSAT percentile for a given performance can be meaningfully calculated across all LSAT takers is that the test is standardized and performance can be equivocated based on that. With GPA, there is no such standardization of grading systems, so even though it would be technically (hypothetically) possible to find where a particular cumulative UGPA score falls in terms of percentile when compared with all other law applicants, this percentile information wouldn't have anywhere near the same validity or predictive value as a generalized LSAT percentile IMO. The ceiling for the GPA range is much easier to hit (at many schools an UGPA of 4.0 can be accomplished with hard work and an easy major for one thing). There are plenty of 4.0 students who won't get any where near a top law school due to 150s LSAT even though in terms of GPA percentile they are probably in the 99th. On the other hand, any one with a 99th percentile LSAT is pretty much guaranteed a spot in a top school (T14) even with a relatively poor GPA. I think GPA is more important in terms of determining ceiling for likely acceptances, as opposed to LSAT which has greater power (along with corresponding percentile) to predict the floor of acceptances.

lawls
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Re: Percentiles for GPAs

Postby lawls » Sun Jun 20, 2010 4:37 am

Lawquacious wrote:The reason that an overall LSAT percentile for a given performance can be meaningfully calculated across all LSAT takers is that the test is standardized and performance can be equivocated based on that. With GPA, there is no such standardization of grading systems, so even though it would be technically (hypothetically) possible to find where a particular cumulative UGPA score falls in terms of percentile when compared with all other law applicants, this percentile information wouldn't have anywhere near the same validity or predictive value as a generalized LSAT percentile IMO. The ceiling for the GPA range is much easier to hit (at many schools an UGPA of 4.0 can be accomplished with hard work and an easy major for one thing). There are plenty of 4.0 students who won't get any where near a top law school due to 150s LSAT even though in terms of GPA percentile they are probably in the 99th. On the other hand, any one with a 99th percentile LSAT is pretty much guaranteed a spot in a top school (T14) even with a relatively poor GPA. I think GPA is more important in terms of determining ceiling for likely acceptances, as opposed to LSAT which has greater power (along with corresponding percentile) to predict the floor of acceptances.


I agree with everything you say. The reason I am curious is there are some charts floating around regarding how many 170+ scores there are, how many 175+, etc., which give you an idea of how enslaved the schools are to the LSAT if they want to keep their medians in the t14 range (there simply aren't enough students to be choosy or to focus too much on softs). But if one also knows how rare high GPAs are among top LSAT scorers, one will have even more information on how few students are actually competing for the top spots if schools want to maintain their medians. Really just a curiosity, rather than wanting to know percentiles for their predictive value.

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Knock
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Re: Percentiles for GPAs

Postby Knock » Sun Jun 20, 2010 4:52 am

xyzzzzzzzz wrote:When you send your transcripts to LSAC, they calculate the % for your school. This basically tells you where your gpa ranks in comparison to others at your school.


Is it only for your degree-granting school? I took some community college classes at several community colleges.

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flyingpanda
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Re: Percentiles for GPAs

Postby flyingpanda » Sun Jun 20, 2010 5:02 am

Knockglock wrote:
xyzzzzzzzz wrote:When you send your transcripts to LSAC, they calculate the % for your school. This basically tells you where your gpa ranks in comparison to others at your school.


Is it only for your degree-granting school? I took some community college classes at several community colleges.


I just looked at it, they count it for your degree-granting school, but they include community classes in the % calculation.

Incidentally, i'm at the 15th percentile for my school, lawl.

xyzzzzzzzz
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Re: Percentiles for GPAs

Postby xyzzzzzzzz » Sun Jun 20, 2010 5:05 am

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Last edited by xyzzzzzzzz on Thu Jul 08, 2010 11:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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flyingpanda
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Re: Percentiles for GPAs

Postby flyingpanda » Sun Jun 20, 2010 5:07 am

xyzzzzzzzz wrote:
Knockglock wrote:
xyzzzzzzzz wrote:When you send your transcripts to LSAC, they calculate the % for your school. This basically tells you where your gpa ranks in comparison to others at your school.


Is it only for your degree-granting school? I took some community college classes at several community colleges.


They might not. It was calculated for one of my universities but not the other. For the latter, there was insufficient information, meaning not enough kids from that school applied to ls. Also, it was a very small school, so that might have something to do with it.


Oh, I guess you're right. My cumm GPA for my degree-counting institution is listed as different from my overall cumm GPA.




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