Chances for T14?

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09042014
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby 09042014 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:51 pm

kk19131 wrote:Why is everyone telling you to go to Northwestern?

:lol:


It's the only only t14 fulltime program the OP has any shot at.

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kk19131
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby kk19131 » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:53 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
kk19131 wrote:Why is everyone telling you to go to Northwestern?

:lol:


It's the only only t14 fulltime program the OP has any shot at.


With a 179 LSAT and 120901920 years of work experience?

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clintonius
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby clintonius » Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:54 pm

hax123 wrote:ED @ NYU

Bad advice.

But what are thoughts on ED @ UVA? I'm still not clear on NU's policy -- would that prohibit him from then ED'ing at NU?

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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby hax123 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:44 am

clintonius wrote:
hax123 wrote:ED @ NYU

Bad advice.

But what are thoughts on ED @ UVA? I'm still not clear on NU's policy -- would that prohibit him from then ED'ing at NU?


Law school predictor gives the OP the same chances at UVA and NYU, so I don't see why he should ED at UVA instead of NYU. Moreover, NYU seems to put more relatively more weight on the LSAT and less on the GPA compared to most other T14 schools.

Assuming the OP has actually earned a 179 (which I doubt TBH), Northwestern is almost a given regardless of whether he does ED.

In my opinion, the best route for the OP is to apply to all T14 schools except for HYSCB and ED at his first choice. I suggested ED @ NYU because it's the best school at which he has a reasonable shot, but the OP may have a different first choice.

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IAFG
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby IAFG » Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:48 am

hax123 wrote:
clintonius wrote:
hax123 wrote:ED @ NYU

Bad advice.

But what are thoughts on ED @ UVA? I'm still not clear on NU's policy -- would that prohibit him from then ED'ing at NU?


Law school predictor gives the OP the same chances at UVA and NYU, so I don't see why he should ED at UVA instead of NYU. Moreover, NYU seems to put more relatively more weight on the LSAT and less on the GPA compared to most other T14 schools.

Assuming the OP has actually earned a 179 (which I doubt TBH), Northwestern is almost a given regardless of whether he does ED.

In my opinion, the best route for the OP is to apply to all T14 schools except for HYSCB and ED at his first choice. I suggested ED @ NYU because it's the best school at which he has a reasonable shot, but the OP may have a different first choice.

LSN misses the sharp drop-off below 3.0

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Ragged
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby Ragged » Fri Jun 18, 2010 1:07 am

kk19131 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
kk19131 wrote:Why is everyone telling you to go to Northwestern?

:lol:


It's the only only t14 fulltime program the OP has any shot at.


With a 179 LSAT and 120901920 years of work experience?


...and a 2.8 GPA, yes.

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flyingpanda
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby flyingpanda » Fri Jun 18, 2010 2:21 am

hax123 wrote:
clintonius wrote:
hax123 wrote:ED @ NYU

Bad advice.

But what are thoughts on ED @ UVA? I'm still not clear on NU's policy -- would that prohibit him from then ED'ing at NU?


Law school predictor gives the OP the same chances at UVA and NYU, so I don't see why he should ED at UVA instead of NYU. Moreover, NYU seems to put more relatively more weight on the LSAT and less on the GPA compared to most other T14 schools.

Assuming the OP has actually earned a 179 (which I doubt TBH), Northwestern is almost a given regardless of whether he does ED.

In my opinion, the best route for the OP is to apply to all T14 schools except for HYSCB and ED at his first choice. I suggested ED @ NYU because it's the best school at which he has a reasonable shot, but the OP may have a different first choice.


You're an idiot if you're just going to blindly follow LSP without using other sources.

09042014
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby 09042014 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 9:09 am

hax123 wrote:
clintonius wrote:
hax123 wrote:ED @ NYU

Bad advice.

But what are thoughts on ED @ UVA? I'm still not clear on NU's policy -- would that prohibit him from then ED'ing at NU?


Law school predictor gives the OP the same chances at UVA and NYU, so I don't see why he should ED at UVA instead of NYU. Moreover, NYU seems to put more relatively more weight on the LSAT and less on the GPA compared to most other T14 schools.

Assuming the OP has actually earned a 179 (which I doubt TBH), Northwestern is almost a given regardless of whether he does ED.

In my opinion, the best route for the OP is to apply to all T14 schools except for HYSCB and ED at his first choice. I suggested ED @ NYU because it's the best school at which he has a reasonable shot, but the OP may have a different first choice.


OP has no shot at NYU.

Law school predictor isn't Gospel, it's a rough estimating using an index made up of LSAT and GPA. The problem is law school predictor doesn't factor in cut offs (NYU rarely goes below 3.2, UVA below 3, Mich below 3, etc), and it overvalues huge LSAT scores. No school is going to care about a 179 more than a 177, but on LSP that changes your odds.

If the OP doesn't ED at Northwestern, he only has only a okay shot at getting regular decision at Northwestern. Go look at the Waitlisted at Northwestern Thread, there are some damn good numbers sitting on the WL.

Wasting his ED at NYU, where he has no shot, is a mistake.

ED at NU, or Georgetown PT, or enjoy Minnesota.

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JWicker10
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby JWicker10 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 2:37 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:I don't agree that some top law schools will not consider the OP's work experience & time out of undergraduate school. But, assuming that the above poster is correct, I will offer you classic TLS advice: retake the LSAT, study your heart out & get that 180.


I hope this post is a joke, because that's terrible advice. A 179 is a phenomoenal score, you don't need to retake.

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danidancer
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby danidancer » Fri Jun 18, 2010 2:46 pm

JWicker10 wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:I don't agree that some top law schools will not consider the OP's work experience & time out of undergraduate school. But, assuming that the above poster is correct, I will offer you classic TLS advice: retake the LSAT, study your heart out & get that 180.


I hope this post is a joke, because that's terrible advice. A 179 is a phenomoenal score, you don't need to retake.


I think that was supposed to be a joke...

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IAFG
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby IAFG » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:02 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:I don't agree that some top law schools will not consider the OP's work experience & time out of undergraduate school. But, assuming that the above poster is correct, I will offer you classic TLS advice: retake the LSAT, study your heart out & get that 180.

Based on any evidence or are you just hoping

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kk19131
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby kk19131 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:08 pm

I refuse to believe that a non-Northwestern law school wouldn't overlook the GPA in favor of the LSAT and work experience.

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IAFG
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby IAFG » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:09 pm

kk19131 wrote:I refuse to believe that a non-Northwestern law school wouldn't overlook the GPA in favor of the LSAT and work experience.

I refuse to believe Santa was my parents the whole time. They never would have gotten me such cool toys.

Edit: OP's circumstances aren't so unique that we lack examples of people with similar profiles having applied to law school. The evidence indicates hard GPA cut-offs, even for non-trads.

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JWicker10
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby JWicker10 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:14 pm

kk19131 wrote:I refuse to believe that a non-Northwestern law school wouldn't overlook the GPA in favor of the LSAT and work experience.


Some might give it less emphasis, but they will still consider it. 2.8 is exceptionally low and GPA is still a part of USNWR rankings last time I checked.

It really just depends on the school. OP would have the best shot EDing at one of those that is considered more LSAT centric. NU seems like a prime school to ED at because it places especially well in Big Law, is more LSAT centric and also places the largest emphasis of any of the T14 on WE.

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kk19131
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby kk19131 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:17 pm

JWicker10 wrote:
kk19131 wrote:I refuse to believe that a non-Northwestern law school wouldn't overlook the GPA in favor of the LSAT and work experience.


Some might give it less emphasis, but they will still consider it. 2.8 is exceptionally low and GPA is still a part of USNWR rankings last time I checked.

It really just depends on the school. OP would have the best shot EDing at one of those that is considered more LSAT centric. NU seems like a prime school to ED at because it places especially well in Big Law, is more LSAT centric and also places the largest emphasis of any of the T14 on WE.


I'm not saying that he has a guaranteed shot at all the schools, but to say that of the 14, 13 simply wouldn't AT ALL consider the application seems kind of silly to me... cutoffs or not.

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kk19131
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby kk19131 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:18 pm

IAFG wrote:
kk19131 wrote:I refuse to believe that a non-Northwestern law school wouldn't overlook the GPA in favor of the LSAT and work experience.

I refuse to believe Santa was my parents the whole time. They never would have gotten me such cool toys.

Edit: OP's circumstances aren't so unique that we lack examples of people with similar profiles having applied to law school. The evidence indicates hard GPA cut-offs, even for non-trads.


To my knowledge the t14 schools doesn't release this information.

09042014
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby 09042014 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:19 pm

kk19131 wrote:
IAFG wrote:
kk19131 wrote:I refuse to believe that a non-Northwestern law school wouldn't overlook the GPA in favor of the LSAT and work experience.

I refuse to believe Santa was my parents the whole time. They never would have gotten me such cool toys.

Edit: OP's circumstances aren't so unique that we lack examples of people with similar profiles having applied to law school. The evidence indicates hard GPA cut-offs, even for non-trads.


To my knowledge the t14 schools doesn't release this information.


http://www.lawschoolnumbers.com

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kk19131
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby kk19131 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:20 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
kk19131 wrote:
IAFG wrote:
kk19131 wrote:I refuse to believe that a non-Northwestern law school wouldn't overlook the GPA in favor of the LSAT and work experience.

I refuse to believe Santa was my parents the whole time. They never would have gotten me such cool toys.

Edit: OP's circumstances aren't so unique that we lack examples of people with similar profiles having applied to law school. The evidence indicates hard GPA cut-offs, even for non-trads.


To my knowledge the t14 schools doesn't release this information.


http://www.lawschoolnumbers.com


Exactly.

09042014
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby 09042014 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:23 pm

kk19131 wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
kk19131 wrote:
IAFG wrote:I refuse to believe Santa was my parents the whole time. They never would have gotten me such cool toys.

Edit: OP's circumstances aren't so unique that we lack examples of people with similar profiles having applied to law school. The evidence indicates hard GPA cut-offs, even for non-trads.


To my knowledge the t14 schools doesn't release this information.


http://www.lawschoolnumbers.com


Exactly.


Go see how under 3.0 students fare. It's not pretty.

Most law schools don't really care about work experience.

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kk19131
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby kk19131 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:27 pm

I've said many times I don't trust that website... nevertheless, according to that website, many of the schools seem to admit/waitlist people with those stats.

*I consider being waitlisted an admission*

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JWicker10
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby JWicker10 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:27 pm

A 179 and good PS will have a lot of pull though. A GPA addendum will also help. If you page through MVP graphs there are several sub-3.0 non-urms that do get in, but true to form, this is the exception not the rule. I think OP should apply just about everywhere in the top 20 he's interested in and then make a decision once he's gotten his offer(s).

09042014
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby 09042014 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:28 pm

kk19131 wrote:I've said many times I don't trust that website... nevertheless, according to that website, many of the schools seem to admit/waitlist people with those stats.

*I consider being waitlisted an admission*


Well the data isn't complete, but if it was common you'd see evidence of it.

And considering a waitlist an admission is nonsensical. Most WL's never get off. These people get waitlisted in case the school absolutely needs a high lsat.

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JWicker10
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby JWicker10 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:33 pm

kk19131 wrote:I've said many times I don't trust that website... nevertheless, according to that website, many of the schools seem to admit/waitlist people with those stats.

*I consider being waitlisted an admission*


That's ridiculous. I'd consider a WL a rejection before I'd consider it an admission. Wow.

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kk19131
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby kk19131 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:34 pm

I mean, that crazy website has URMs listed with ABSURD scores getting into schools: 148 and 2.9 for NYU...? rubbish.

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JWicker10
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Re: Chances for T14?

Postby JWicker10 » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:36 pm

kk19131 wrote:I mean, that crazy website has URMs listed with ABSURD scores getting into schools: 148 and 2.9 for NYU...? rubbish.


Some may be flames, but the overall trends are accurate.

Also, URMs get much different consideration than non-URMs and OP is white.




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