Odds of getting into a good Law School?

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ccs569
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Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby ccs569 » Thu May 27, 2010 12:07 pm

Hello, I am looking at law schools and would deeply appreciate any & all feedback on my chances:

Caucasian, Male
Northwestern
Industrial Engineering
GPA 2.98
2 years Business Analyst & Project Management Experience at a boutique IT consulting firm
Great Rec's

1. What do I need to get on the LSAT to have a decent shot at a top law school (Fordham for instance)?

2. What are my chances even with a top LSAT score (170+)?

3. What else can I do to improve my chances?

Thanks so much!

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stintez
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby stintez » Thu May 27, 2010 12:11 pm

ccs569 wrote:Hello, I am looking at law schools and would deeply appreciate any & all feedback on my chances:

Caucasian, Male
Northwestern
Industrial Engineering
GPA 2.98
2 years Business Analyst & Project Management Experience at a boutique IT consulting firm
Great Rec's

1. What do I need to get on the LSAT to have a decent shot at a top law school (Fordham for instance)?

2. What are my chances even with a top LSAT score (170+)?

3. What else can I do to improve my chances?

Thanks so much!


I think if you get a 165+ you would have a good chance at Fordham at sticker but a 170 will for sure get it done.

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SaintClarence27
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby SaintClarence27 » Thu May 27, 2010 12:12 pm

ccs569 wrote:Hello, I am looking at law schools and would deeply appreciate any & all feedback on my chances:

Caucasian, Male
Northwestern
Industrial Engineering
GPA 2.98
2 years Business Analyst & Project Management Experience at a boutique IT consulting firm
Great Rec's

1. What do I need to get on the LSAT to have a decent shot at a top law school (Fordham for instance)?

2. What are my chances even with a top LSAT score (170+)?

3. What else can I do to improve my chances?

Thanks so much!


I think you need a minimum 169 to have a chance at Fordham, but more likely a 170. 173 or so will give you a *shot* at some of the T14 splitters (Northwestern).

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SAE
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby SAE » Thu May 27, 2010 12:14 pm

stintez wrote:
ccs569 wrote:Hello, I am looking at law schools and would deeply appreciate any & all feedback on my chances:

Caucasian, Male
Northwestern
Industrial Engineering
GPA 2.98
2 years Business Analyst & Project Management Experience at a boutique IT consulting firm
Great Rec's

1. What do I need to get on the LSAT to have a decent shot at a top law school (Fordham for instance)?

2. What are my chances even with a top LSAT score (170+)?

3. What else can I do to improve my chances?

Thanks so much!


I think if you get a [strike]165+ you would have a good[/strike] 170+ there is some chance at Fordham at sticker [strike]but a 170 will for sure get it done.[/strike]

fixed

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NoleinNY
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby NoleinNY » Thu May 27, 2010 12:24 pm

Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?

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SaintClarence27
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby SaintClarence27 » Thu May 27, 2010 12:32 pm

NoleinNY wrote:Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?


TBF, it doesn't matter. You want to do as well on the LSAT as you POSSIBLY can. It will only help you - it's not like you'll be like "well, I scored a 173 PT so I'll get into Fordham. Might as well stop studying." Worry about specific schools AFTER.

ccs569
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby ccs569 » Thu May 27, 2010 12:38 pm

NoleinNY wrote:What are your goals, prefered region, etc?


The reason I mention Fordham is that NYC has always appealed to me. Not sure whether id go the lawfirm or corporate route.

I am also considering the JD/MBA route. Should this change my strategy beyond which specific schools I am looking at? Got a 720 on the GMAT.

And can I expect some leniency on the low gpa from the difficult major at a good school?

Thanks again!

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lostjake
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby lostjake » Thu May 27, 2010 12:47 pm

imaginary engineering is not a hard major

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NoleinNY
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby NoleinNY » Thu May 27, 2010 12:51 pm

SaintClarence27 wrote:
NoleinNY wrote:Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?


TBF, it doesn't matter. You want to do as well on the LSAT as you POSSIBLY can. It will only help you - it's not like you'll be like "well, I scored a 173 PT so I'll get into Fordham. Might as well stop studying." Worry about specific schools AFTER.
ccs569 wrote:
NoleinNY wrote:What are your goals, prefered region, etc?


The reason I mention Fordham is that NYC has always appealed to me. Not sure whether id go the lawfirm or corporate route.

I am also considering the JD/MBA route.
Should this change my strategy beyond which specific schools I am looking at? Got a 720 on the GMAT.

And can I expect some leniency on the low gpa from the difficult major at a good school?

Thanks again!


That's why I asked about goals...

The consensus on the boards tends to be either get an MBA or get a JD, since that combination may not help and could potentially hurt you. Major and school of origin are far behind LSAT score and GPA for admission.

Take an LSAT diagnostic. Think thoroughly whether you want to be a lawyer or not. If you find you do want to, study your butt off for the LSAT. If not, that's a damn good GMAT score...
Last edited by NoleinNY on Thu May 27, 2010 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Grizz
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby Grizz » Thu May 27, 2010 12:53 pm

Don't go to law school. Just continue your present job. With your GPA you're going to be looking at paying sticker at a lot of places. No need to go $200k in the hole plus opportunity cost when you're already making money.

Here's what it comes down to: why do you want to be a lawyer?

ccs569
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby ccs569 » Thu May 27, 2010 12:53 pm

lostjake wrote:imaginary engineering is not a hard major


Thanks Jake, I appreciate that.

ccs569
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby ccs569 » Thu May 27, 2010 1:04 pm

NoleinNY wrote:That's why I asked about goals...

The consensus on the boards tends to be either get an MBA or get a JD, since that combination may not help and could potentially hurt you. Major and school of origin are far behind LSAT score and GPA for admission.

Take an LSAT diagnostic. Think thoroughly whether you want to be a lawyer or not. If you find you do want to, study your butt off for the LSAT. If not, that's a damn good GMAT score...


Firstly, I really do appreciate your feedback.

How is it that the MBA/JD combination could hurt you? Especially if, like at Fordham, you can complete both in 3.5 years.

It seems unfortunate that major and school are afterthoughts when they play such a large role in what the GPA is. C'est la vie.

And please pardon my naivety, but are merit scholarships common at top schools? By sticker price, what is basically meant is that if I do get in, it will be lucky and I cant expect financial assistance that a more deserving applicant might?

Thanks.

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Rowinguy2009
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby Rowinguy2009 » Thu May 27, 2010 1:29 pm

Merit scholarships are fairly common at almost all schools (it's a lot harder at Harvard, Yale, or Stanford) if you have good enough numbers. Typically you need to be above both the 75 percentiles for both LSAT and GPA to have a solid chance at money.

If you don't get a merit scholarship, then you will be paying the "sticker" price charged by the school...meaning you will be paying full price.

Edit: I can't spell
Last edited by Rowinguy2009 on Thu May 27, 2010 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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kittenmittons
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby kittenmittons » Thu May 27, 2010 1:30 pm

Get a 170 and enjoy Northwestern

yabbadabbado
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby yabbadabbado » Thu May 27, 2010 1:42 pm

ccs569 wrote:How is it that the MBA/JD combination could hurt you? Especially if, like at Fordham, you can complete both in 3.5 years.


Firstly, the MBA will be absolutely useless for practicing law. Even if corporate law is what you want to do, you will learn what you need to on the job and not in an MBA program. Second, Fordham is not a top B-School so the kind of added effect you'd get from say, a Harvard JD/MBA just isn't going to be there...not even close. Lastly, many legal employers are suspicious of JD/MBAs because they think it shows lack of commitment to law. There is a persistent myth out there that the more degrees you have, the more marketable you are. Doesn't work that way in law 99% of the time. The exception would be certain hard science Ph.Ds and such for patent law.

And please pardon my naivety, but are merit scholarships common at top schools? By sticker price, what is basically meant is that if I do get in, it will be lucky and I cant expect financial assistance that a more deserving applicant might?


There are merit scholarships at top schools but the vast majority of students are paying sticker price with no merit aid. With a very high LSAT you might get some merit $ at schools in the 15-25 range, but anything ranked higher than that you shouldn't expect a dime.

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SaintClarence27
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby SaintClarence27 » Thu May 27, 2010 1:47 pm

ccs569 wrote:
NoleinNY wrote:What are your goals, prefered region, etc?


The reason I mention Fordham is that NYC has always appealed to me. Not sure whether id go the lawfirm or corporate route.

I am also considering the JD/MBA route. Should this change my strategy beyond which specific schools I am looking at? Got a 720 on the GMAT.

And can I expect some leniency on the low gpa from the difficult major at a good school?

Thanks again!


I think you will get *some* leniency from *some* schools - if your LSAT score is really good. I mean, there's really not a whole lot of difference between a 3.4 and 2.98 when it comes to affecting a school's medians, so some will probably look at you the same as someone with a 3.3 and an "easy" major. Again, though, you're gonna need to rock the LSAT.

ccs569
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby ccs569 » Thu May 27, 2010 2:50 pm

The motivation behind getting a JD/MBA would be to balance myself out in case I choose to pursue business (which I would say is likely), but I see what you are saying about a perceived lack of committment to law.

I realize that Fordham does not have a top tier b-school. However, it is actually a top 20 b-school for finance (which I am interested in).

Also, with my GPA, even with good scores, getting into a top law or top business school will be a crap-shoot. Getting into both at the same school seems unlikely.

I understand that I just need to shoot for as high of a score as possible, but so that I am not wasting my time, what score should I make sure I am testing at? By that I mean, do I need to get at least 170 to have a realistic shot at these schools?

Much Obliged.

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Holly Golightly
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby Holly Golightly » Thu May 27, 2010 2:51 pm

NoleinNY wrote:Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?

2.7 and 176. It pains me that I know his stats by heart.

NayBoer is another sub-3.0 who's going to NU next year.

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SaintClarence27
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby SaintClarence27 » Thu May 27, 2010 2:54 pm

Holly Golightly wrote:
NoleinNY wrote:Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?

2.7 and 176. It pains me that I know his stats by heart.

NayBoer is another sub-3.0 who's going to NU next year.


Yeah, in BP they just recite each others' stats over and over. It's kind of boring.

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Holly Golightly
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby Holly Golightly » Thu May 27, 2010 2:55 pm

SaintClarence27 wrote:
Holly Golightly wrote:
NoleinNY wrote:Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?

2.7 and 176. It pains me that I know his stats by heart.

NayBoer is another sub-3.0 who's going to NU next year.


Yeah, in BP they just recite each others' stats over and over. It's kind of boring.

Jealous that I don't know yours?

d34d9823
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby d34d9823 » Thu May 27, 2010 2:56 pm

yabbadabbado wrote:
ccs569 wrote:How is it that the MBA/JD combination could hurt you? Especially if, like at Fordham, you can complete both in 3.5 years.


Firstly, the MBA will be absolutely useless for practicing law. Even if corporate law is what you want to do, you will learn what you need to on the job and not in an MBA program. Second, Fordham is not a top B-School so the kind of added effect you'd get from say, a Harvard JD/MBA just isn't going to be there...not even close. Lastly, many legal employers are suspicious of JD/MBAs because they think it shows lack of commitment to law. There is a persistent myth out there that the more degrees you have, the more marketable you are. Doesn't work that way in law 99% of the time. The exception would be certain hard science Ph.Ds and such for patent law.

This + two of the most valuable things you get from B-school/law school are:

- Networking with your classmates, who will presumably go on to be influential. You can't do this nearly as effectively in a dual degree program.

- The opportunity to do OCI with top firms in your field. If you do the dual degree, you waste half of this since you pretty much have to pick one field. Much better to get the degree you think you want, go into the work force, and go back to school for the other one if you change your mind.

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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby 09042014 » Thu May 27, 2010 2:58 pm

Holly Golightly wrote:
NoleinNY wrote:Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?

2.7 and 176. It pains me that I know his stats by heart.

NayBoer is another sub-3.0 who's going to NU next year.


We both applied ED, and it helps. There are some people with better numbers sitting on the WL right now.

Kellogg JD/MBA is a damn good one, but I don't know you'd make the cut. In fact I'd bet against it.
Last edited by 09042014 on Thu May 27, 2010 2:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Holly Golightly
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby Holly Golightly » Thu May 27, 2010 2:59 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
Holly Golightly wrote:
NoleinNY wrote:Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?

2.7 and 176. It pains me that I know his stats by heart.

NayBoer is another sub-3.0 who's going to NU next year.


We both applied ED, and it helps. There are some people with better numbers sitting on the WL right now.

There are people WL-ed with better numbers than me, too. I just got lucky, though.

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SaintClarence27
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby SaintClarence27 » Thu May 27, 2010 3:03 pm

Holly Golightly wrote:
SaintClarence27 wrote:
Holly Golightly wrote:
NoleinNY wrote:Aim as high as you can, LSAT-wise. Desert Fox got into Northwestern Law ED with like a 2.9 and a mid 170s, IIRC. As for Fordham, LSN showed someone get into Fordham with a 3.02 and a 175. A person with a 2.98 was waitlisted at 172.

What are your goals, prefered region, etc?

2.7 and 176. It pains me that I know his stats by heart.

NayBoer is another sub-3.0 who's going to NU next year.


Yeah, in BP they just recite each others' stats over and over. It's kind of boring.

Jealous that I don't know yours?


No. My stats suck!

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clintonius
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Re: Odds of getting into a good Law School?

Postby clintonius » Thu May 27, 2010 3:04 pm

ccs569 wrote:The motivation behind getting a JD/MBA would be to balance myself out in case I choose to pursue business (which I would say is likely), but I see what you are saying about a perceived lack of committment to law.

I realize that Fordham does not have a top tier b-school. However, it is actually a top 20 b-school for finance (which I am interested in).

Also, with my GPA, even with good scores, getting into a top law or top business school will be a crap-shoot. Getting into both at the same school seems unlikely.

I understand that I just need to shoot for as high of a score as possible, but so that I am not wasting my time, what score should I make sure I am testing at? By that I mean, do I need to get at least 170 to have a realistic shot at these schools?

Much Obliged.

I've also heard that the dual degree hurts you on the business side of things, possibly more than it would in the legal world, because they view it as hedging your bets. Business rewards people who take (calculated) risks. Dual degrees can be viewed as hesitancy to go all-in.




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