Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

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drgodfather
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Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Wed May 26, 2010 6:47 pm

I graduated college with a Doctor of Pharmacy and have no other degree. However, a law school told me they only take undergrad GPA but the undergrad courses I took were not enough to get a degree. I did pre-pharmacy for 2 years and pharmacy for 4 years. Are they really suggesting that my GPA will come from those 2 years of undergraduate work?

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hotdog123
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby hotdog123 » Wed May 26, 2010 6:48 pm

How did you swing getting into Pharm school without an undergrad degree?

That seems odd...

drgodfather
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Wed May 26, 2010 6:50 pm

DonnyMost wrote:How did you swing getting into Pharm school without an undergrad degree?

That seems odd...


Most programs are like that so it's not odd at all. I graduated from a school in the south and if you look at their admissions website you will see that only the pre-pharmacy curriculum is required to get in.

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MusicNutMeggie
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby MusicNutMeggie » Wed May 26, 2010 6:51 pm

Did you do one of those undergrad/pharm combined programs? A friend of mine did one of those and encountered the same problem when later applying to med schools. Try calling your UG institution and talking to an academic advisor and the registrar about it. If your pharm school is part of the same university, it's possible that they can move courses around to show that you received undergrad credit for some of the pharm courses-- instead of looking like you did two years of UG and four years of pharm school, they could make it look like three and three, or maybe even four and two. Worked for my friend-- hope it works for you! Good luck!

bradley
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby bradley » Wed May 26, 2010 6:53 pm

The real question is, why are you leaving a great career like that and going to law school? Read the news lately?

drgodfather
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Wed May 26, 2010 6:55 pm

MusicNutMeggie wrote:Did you do one of those undergrad/pharm combined programs? A friend of mine did one of those and encountered the same problem when later applying to med schools. Try calling your UG institution and talking to an academic advisor and the registrar about it. If your pharm school is part of the same university, it's possible that they can move courses around to show that you received undergrad credit for some of the pharm courses-- instead of looking like you did two years of UG and four years of pharm school, they could make it look like three and three, or maybe even four and two. Worked for my friend-- hope it works for you! Good luck!


Yes I believe that's what my program was. Thanks for the advice, I'll be sure to talk to someone about it.

bradley wrote:The real question is, why are you leaving a great career like that and going to law school? Read the news lately?


I'm just keeping my options open.

thatsnotmyname
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby thatsnotmyname » Wed May 26, 2010 6:57 pm

drgodfather wrote:I graduated college with a Doctor of Pharmacy and have no other degree. However, a law school told me they only take undergrad GPA but the undergrad courses I took were not enough to get a degree. I did pre-pharmacy for 2 years and pharmacy for 4 years. Are they really suggesting that my GPA will come from those 2 years of undergraduate work?


I think your LSAC GPA would be only those 2 years of undergrad grades... However, I think for most law schools, you must hold a bachelor's degree to be eligible for admission. I think there are some that do not require a bachelor's, though, not sure. I feel like law schools would understand why you don't have a bachelor's if you wrote an addendum.

I'm interested in what the answer is to your question and whether you are eligible for admission w/o a bachelor's. I can't really help you out.

drgodfather
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Wed May 26, 2010 7:01 pm

thatsnotmyname wrote:
drgodfather wrote:I graduated college with a Doctor of Pharmacy and have no other degree. However, a law school told me they only take undergrad GPA but the undergrad courses I took were not enough to get a degree. I did pre-pharmacy for 2 years and pharmacy for 4 years. Are they really suggesting that my GPA will come from those 2 years of undergraduate work?


I think your LSAC GPA would be only those 2 years of undergrad grades... However, I think for most law schools, you must hold a bachelor's degree to be eligible for admission. I think there are some that do not require a bachelor's, though, not sure. I feel like law schools would understand why you don't have a bachelor's if you wrote an addendum.

I'm interested in what the answer is to your question and whether you are eligible for admission w/o a bachelor's. I can't really help you out.


But I have a Doctor of Pharmacy, isn't that held in higher esteem than a bachelors of anything in academic terms?

thatsnotmyname
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby thatsnotmyname » Wed May 26, 2010 7:10 pm

drgodfather wrote:
thatsnotmyname wrote:
drgodfather wrote:I graduated college with a Doctor of Pharmacy and have no other degree. However, a law school told me they only take undergrad GPA but the undergrad courses I took were not enough to get a degree. I did pre-pharmacy for 2 years and pharmacy for 4 years. Are they really suggesting that my GPA will come from those 2 years of undergraduate work?


I think your LSAC GPA would be only those 2 years of undergrad grades... However, I think for most law schools, you must hold a bachelor's degree to be eligible for admission. I think there are some that do not require a bachelor's, though, not sure. I feel like law schools would understand why you don't have a bachelor's if you wrote an addendum.

I'm interested in what the answer is to your question and whether you are eligible for admission w/o a bachelor's. I can't really help you out.


But I have a Doctor of Pharmacy, isn't that held in higher esteem than a bachelors of anything in academic terms?


Yea, that's why I said I don't really know and I think they would understand if you wrote an addendum. But I have read on several law school web sites that a bachelor's degree is a requirement for admission. So I'm must not exactly sure how easy it is to get that requirement waived or if your Doctor of Pharmacy fulfills that requirement. I feel like it should but don't know. I feel like you should call or e-mail a few admissions offices and see what they say.

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thesealocust
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby thesealocust » Wed May 26, 2010 7:52 pm

edited / never mind
Last edited by thesealocust on Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

drgodfather
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Wed May 26, 2010 8:15 pm

thesealocust wrote:
thatsnotmyname wrote:You must hold a bachelor's degree to be eligible for admission.


How is my degree not fitting for law school? It's like saying "you must hold a bronze sword" and that my gold sword just doesn't cut it, no pun intended.

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kalvano
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby kalvano » Wed May 26, 2010 8:19 pm

drgodfather wrote:How is my degree not fitting for law school?



Because it's not a bachelor's degree that the schools require.

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clintonius
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby clintonius » Wed May 26, 2010 8:20 pm

Only hearsay, but I've also heard that in combined programs, when computing GPA the LSAC considers all classes taken before the undergrad degree was awarded. Can you see if the school will grant you an incidental Bachelor's?

drgodfather
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Wed May 26, 2010 8:38 pm

clintonius wrote:Only hearsay, but I've also heard that in combined programs, when computing GPA the LSAC considers all classes taken before the undergrad degree was awarded. Can you see if the school will grant you an incidental Bachelor's?


But I don't have an undergrad degree, being enrolled in Pharmacy is the same as being enrolled in a graduate program. Or at least I paid tuition at a graduate rate. All I have are undergrad courses that I took before being admitted into a College of Pharmacy.

This is gonna kill me if I can't get into law school because I don't have a bachelors degree. A doctor of pharmacy is higher on scale than a bachelors.

EDIT: I should also add that I qualify for normal graduate school so why wouldn't I qualify for law school?

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kalvano
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby kalvano » Wed May 26, 2010 8:42 pm

I don't think anyone here can answer this question.

You need to call LSAC or the school.

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clintonius
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby clintonius » Wed May 26, 2010 8:45 pm

drgodfather wrote:
clintonius wrote:Only hearsay, but I've also heard that in combined programs, when computing GPA the LSAC considers all classes taken before the undergrad degree was awarded. Can you see if the school will grant you an incidental Bachelor's?
But I don't have an undergrad degree, being enrolled in Pharmacy is the same as being enrolled in a graduate program. Or at least I paid tuition at a graduate rate. All I have are undergrad courses that I took before being admitted into a College of Pharmacy.

Right. So an incidental degree is one that is awarded while you are en route to a higher degree. A friend of mine just earned an incidental Master's after finishing certain requirements in his PhD program. You could ask the school to award you an incidental Bachelor's for fulfilling certain requirements on the way to the Doctor of Pharmacy degree.

xyzzzzzzzz
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby xyzzzzzzzz » Thu May 27, 2010 1:33 am

kalvano wrote:I don't think anyone here can answer this question.

You need to call LSAC or the school.


+1000

SuperFreak
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby SuperFreak » Thu May 27, 2010 8:25 am

Why would anyone want to leave pharmacy to become a lawyer?

Crazy. Great hours. Great pay. Respect. No partners breathing down your neck.

drgodfather
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Fri May 28, 2010 12:02 pm

SuperFreak wrote:Why would anyone want to leave pharmacy to become a lawyer?

Crazy. Great hours. Great pay. Respect. No partners breathing down your neck.


I have terrible hours, decent pay, almost no respect from patients, and I have managers and a company breathing down my neck.

03121202698008
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby 03121202698008 » Fri May 28, 2010 12:05 pm

thesealocust wrote:
thatsnotmyname wrote:You must hold a bachelor's degree to be eligible for admission.


It's an ABA requirement. Not sure how you would get around this other than completing what you needed for have a BA/BS confer.

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TheBigMediocre
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby TheBigMediocre » Fri May 28, 2010 12:17 pm

Doesn't CVS pay pharmacists ~$90k a year to fill prescriptions for 40 hours/week? I'm not trying to be cynical/sarcastic. I legitimately thought this is what the lifestyle was like

Edit: Fixed a typo that was irking me.
Last edited by TheBigMediocre on Fri May 28, 2010 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

drgodfather
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Fri May 28, 2010 12:28 pm

blhoward2 wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
thatsnotmyname wrote:You must hold a bachelor's degree to be eligible for admission.


It's an ABA requirement. Not sure how you would get around this other than completing what you needed for have a BA/BS confer.


Are you a representative of LSAC or the ABA? If not then I have a hard time believing you.

I've already spoken to the LSAC and numerous law schools and they have told me that a Pharm.D. is an acceptable degree to have and there are no law schools in the country that would reject me on the basis of having a Doctor of Pharmacy rather than a Bachelors degree.

03121202698008
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby 03121202698008 » Fri May 28, 2010 12:40 pm

drgodfather wrote:
blhoward2 wrote:
thesealocust wrote:
thatsnotmyname wrote:You must hold a bachelor's degree to be eligible for admission.


It's an ABA requirement. Not sure how you would get around this other than completing what you needed for have a BA/BS confer.


Are you a representative of LSAC or the ABA? If not then I have a hard time believing you.

I've already spoken to the LSAC and numerous law schools and they have told me that a Pharm.D. is an acceptable degree to have and there are no law schools in the country that would reject me on the basis of having a Doctor of Pharmacy rather than a Bachelors degree.


http://www.abanet.org/legaled/standards/2009-2010%20StandardsWebContent/Chapter5.pdf wrote:Standard 502. EDUCATIONAL REQUIREMENTS
(a) A law school shall require for admission to its J.D. degree program a bachelor’s
degree, or successful completion of three-fourths of the work acceptable for a bachelor’s
degree, from an institution that is accredited by an accrediting agency recognized by the
Department of Education.
2009-2010 ABA Standards for Approval of Law Schools 39

(b) In an extraordinary case, a law school may admit to its J.D. degree program an
applicant who does not possess the educational requirements of subsection (a) if the
applicant’s experience, ability, and other characteristics clearly show an aptitude for the
study of law. The admitting of cer shall sign and place in the admittee’s  le a statement of
the considerations that led to the decision to admit the applicant.
Interpretation 502-1

Before an admitted student registers, or within a reasonable time thereafter, a law school shall
have on  le the student’s of cial transcript showing receipt of a bachelor’s degree, if any, and
all academic work undertaken. “Ofcial transcript” means a transcript certi ed by the issuing
school to the admitting school or delivered to the admitting school in a sealed envelope with seal
intact. A copy supplied by the Law School Data Assembly Service is not an ofcial transcript,
even though it is adequate for preliminary determination of admission.


You either need a bachelors or 3/4ths of the work required to obtain one. So, 2 years of undergrad would not qualify unless the school agreed to give you undergrad credit for pharm work. You could be accepted under (b) but that is up to each school to certify or not.

To answer your OP, if you are eligible, they will count only the undergrad work. There is a guy on here who took 2 AP courses in high school then went to a school that doesn't give grades and LSAC says he has a 2.0 from those two classes.

Edit: I'm not saying you are ineligible. But it's another hurdle you may need to address. (Or the schools may address for you...) e.g. Since most schools list this as a requirement for admission, a Dean may need to qualify you before consideration.

Also, if I worked for LSAC or ABA, WTF would I be on TLS?

drgodfather
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby drgodfather » Fri May 28, 2010 1:12 pm

blhoward2 wrote:You either need a bachelors or 3/4ths of the work required to obtain one. So, 2 years of undergrad would not qualify unless the school agreed to give you undergrad credit for pharm work. You could be accepted under (b) but that is up to each school to certify or not.

To answer your OP, if you are eligible, they will count only the undergrad work. There is a guy on here who took 2 AP courses in high school then went to a school that doesn't give grades and LSAC says he has a 2.0 from those two classes.

Edit: I'm not saying you are ineligible. But it's another hurdle you may need to address. (Or the schools may address for you...) e.g. Since most schools list this as a requirement for admission, a Dean may need to qualify you before consideration.

Also, if I worked for LSAC or ABA, WTF would I be on TLS?


The only problem is that those two years of undergrad are the only classes that could possibly go toward a Bachelors degree. In the four years of my professional pharmacy work, none of those classes would go towards any requirements for a Bachelors degree.

Certainly I qualify under subsection "b". Anyone with a doctorate obviously has competency.

EDIT: I only asked so I can take your answers with a grain of salt.

CMDantes
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Re: Undergrad GPA: I have a very unique problem

Postby CMDantes » Fri May 28, 2010 2:06 pm

Why would you go on a forum asking questions only to become defensive and arrogant when people honestly try to answer your questions?

If you require someone who works for the ABA or LSAC to answer your question, why don't you go email them?

Some people on this forum boggle my mind.




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