Is Michigan really better than UVA?

(Applications Advice, Letters of Recommendation . . . )

Which is it, UVA or Michigan??

University of Virginia
62
42%
University of Michigan
85
58%
 
Total votes: 147

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PLATONiC
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Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby PLATONiC » Wed May 12, 2010 9:25 pm

In what way, though? UVA seems to have a higher percentage of graduates going to the top firms according to the "Go-To" law schools rankings for 2008~2010.

What does Michigan have that consistently gets them to rank higher than UVA? In your opinion, which school is better???

rundoxierun
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed May 12, 2010 9:27 pm

peer schools.. neither is categorically better

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PLATONiC
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby PLATONiC » Wed May 12, 2010 9:29 pm

It might seem a little pointless of me starting a pole on this, since I've already seen so many polls showing people would rather go to Mich than UVA. But I just don't see why... I'm wondering if poling results would differ if UVA was #9 and Mich was #10.

rundoxierun
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed May 12, 2010 9:32 pm

PLATONiC wrote:It might seem a little pointless of me starting a pole on this, since I've already seen so many polls showing people would rather go to Mich than UVA. But I just don't see why... I'm wondering if poling results would differ if UVA was #9 and Mich was #10.


Lots of ppl have never been to UVA and fear it will be super southern/fratty/conservative.. this explains the poll results

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holydonkey
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby holydonkey » Wed May 12, 2010 9:34 pm

As a completely unbiased commenter, I'd have to say Michigan is better.

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Joan Hollaway
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby Joan Hollaway » Wed May 12, 2010 9:35 pm

holydonkey wrote:As a completely unbiased commenter, I'd have to say Michigan is better.

+1
T9 ftw

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luhrenzo
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby luhrenzo » Wed May 12, 2010 9:38 pm

from an someone who has not shot at either school, based on non-law related factors (weather, social atmosphere, geographic location) i actually prefer UVA and C'Ville, fwiw

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holydonkey
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby holydonkey » Wed May 12, 2010 9:44 pm

luhrenzo wrote:from an someone who has not shot at either school, based on non-law related factors (weather, social atmosphere, geographic location) i actually prefer UVA and C'Ville, fwiw
Based on non-baseball related factors, I believe the Washington Nationals will win the World Series.

miamiman
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby miamiman » Wed May 12, 2010 9:46 pm

Serious q: can michigan indefinitely maintain its rank if the larger state in which it operates has...for lack of a better expression, failed?

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luhrenzo
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby luhrenzo » Wed May 12, 2010 9:49 pm

holydonkey wrote:
luhrenzo wrote:from an someone who has not shot at either school, based on non-law related factors (weather, social atmosphere, geographic location) i actually prefer UVA and C'Ville, fwiw
Based on non-baseball related factors, I believe the Washington Nationals will win the World Series.


i love lamp

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cardnal124
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby cardnal124 » Wed May 12, 2010 9:52 pm

miamiman wrote:Serious q: can michigan indefinitely maintain its rank if the larger state in which it operates has...for lack of a better expression, failed?


Can Berkeley?

And Michigan hasn't failed, just Detroit. Still have the Chicago market to go to.

miamiman
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby miamiman » Wed May 12, 2010 9:56 pm

cardnal124 wrote:
miamiman wrote:Serious q: can michigan indefinitely maintain its rank if the larger state in which it operates has...for lack of a better expression, failed?


Can Berkeley?

And Michigan hasn't failed, just Detroit. Still have the Chicago market to go to.


Last time I checked, detroit was the only meaningful city in michigan. And analogizing the challenges in california (considerable) to those in michigan (catastrophic, apocalyptic) is just laughable.

I have no bone to pick with michigan as a school - its fabulous - but I think this is a real question

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cardnal124
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby cardnal124 » Wed May 12, 2010 10:00 pm

miamiman wrote:
cardnal124 wrote:
miamiman wrote:Serious q: can michigan indefinitely maintain its rank if the larger state in which it operates has...for lack of a better expression, failed?


Can Berkeley?

And Michigan hasn't failed, just Detroit. Still have the Chicago market to go to.


Last time I checked, detroit was the only meaningful city in michigan. And analogizing the challenges in california (considerable) to those in michigan (catastrophic, apocalyptic) is just laughable.

I have no bone to pick with michigan as a school - its faculous - but I think this is a real question


As far as out-of-state law students should be concerned California is worse off. I haven't heard of 30% tuition rate hikes at Michigan.

So long as the school can attract good students, faculty, and have a national reach, they will maintain rank.

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holydonkey
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby holydonkey » Wed May 12, 2010 10:00 pm

miamiman wrote:Serious q: can michigan indefinitely maintain its rank if the larger state in which it operates has...for lack of a better expression, failed?
Not a problem. It's not like the law school is the only top program at Michigan.

#9 School of Education
#8 College of Engineering
#6 Medical School
#9 Earth Sciences
#8 Math
#5 Library and Info Sciences
#4 Poly Sci
#3 Psychology
#7 History
#3 Sociology
#5 Nursing
#7 Public Affairs

etc etc

Also, last I heard, 97% of law grads leave the state.

miamiman
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby miamiman » Wed May 12, 2010 10:05 pm

I guess the question I'm building towards is can Umich maintain its stature absent ANY home market to place into?

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Burgstaller04
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby Burgstaller04 » Wed May 12, 2010 10:08 pm

To answer the title question: Yes

Mr. Pablo
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby Mr. Pablo » Wed May 12, 2010 10:23 pm

miamiman wrote:I guess the question I'm building towards is can Umich maintain its stature absent ANY home market to place into?

It has and it will continue to do so. Detroit has been a shithole for a couple of decades, nor has it ever been any sort of legal mecca. UM has a great reputation across the country and I can't see any reason why the economy of its home state would alter that.

sumus romani
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby sumus romani » Wed May 12, 2010 10:25 pm

cardnal124 wrote:
miamiman wrote:Serious q: can michigan indefinitely maintain its rank if the larger state in which it operates has...for lack of a better expression, failed?


Can Berkeley?

And Michigan hasn't failed, just Detroit. Still have the Chicago market to go to.



There are lots of other cities in MI that have failed. Flint, for example, used to be an important manufacturing city. Same with Lansing. Detroit is the biggest failure by far, but there are lots of smaller manufacturing cities that, when added up, really amount to a lot of failure.

Now, having said this, I'd bet that at this point, very little M funds come from the state, at least for the law school.

I voted for M notwithstanding the above, because of AA and M's general awesomeness.

sumus romani
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby sumus romani » Wed May 12, 2010 10:28 pm

Mr. Pablo wrote:
miamiman wrote:I guess the question I'm building towards is can Umich maintain its stature absent ANY home market to place into?

It has and it will continue to do so. Detroit has been a shithole for a couple of decades, nor has it ever been any sort of legal mecca. UM has a great reputation across the country and I can't see any reason why the economy of its home state would alter that.



Yale has no home market either, yet you don't ask this question about Yale. Look, not having a home market is an advantage in some ways for an elite school, I would guess, because it forces you to be national.

RPK34
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby RPK34 » Wed May 12, 2010 10:31 pm

Going back to 2005, Michigan has never sent a greater percentage of students into NLJ250 or Article III clerkships than UVA, though UVA generally just barely edges them out.

Michigan is probably going to place better into the Midwest, VA will place into DC better, and both have a pretty good national reach. Not a huge difference in quality though.

miamiman
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby miamiman » Wed May 12, 2010 10:33 pm

Did you seriously argue:

1. Lacking a home market is ever a positive?

2. There exist any similarities between yls and mich law beyond the fact that they are both law schools?

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GordonBombay
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby GordonBombay » Wed May 12, 2010 10:33 pm

Image

TITCR

RPK34
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby RPK34 » Wed May 12, 2010 10:34 pm

sumus romani wrote:
Mr. Pablo wrote:
miamiman wrote:I guess the question I'm building towards is can Umich maintain its stature absent ANY home market to place into?

It has and it will continue to do so. Detroit has been a shithole for a couple of decades, nor has it ever been any sort of legal mecca. UM has a great reputation across the country and I can't see any reason why the economy of its home state would alter that.



Yale has no home market either, yet you don't ask this question about Yale. Look, not having a home market is an advantage in some ways for an elite school, I would guess, because it forces you to be national.


Yale? What's your point? It's Yale.

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D Brooks
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby D Brooks » Wed May 12, 2010 10:38 pm

Ran here.

And TCR is "not even a little bit."

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D Brooks
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Re: Is Michigan really better than UVA?

Postby D Brooks » Wed May 12, 2010 10:39 pm

GordonBombay wrote:Image

TITCR




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