Best Law School Laptop for the Money

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kalvano
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby kalvano » Sun Jul 11, 2010 4:37 pm

Emma. wrote:
Mr. Matlock wrote:
kalvano wrote:It's amazing how much people agonize over such a purchase.

Something about the thousand dollar mark of a purchase that seems to increase the level of fail aversion exponentially for me.


Buy the MBP Matlock. You won't regret it.



Until you realized you overpaid for the shiny.

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zeth006
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby zeth006 » Sun Jul 11, 2010 4:41 pm

kalvano wrote:
Emma. wrote:
Mr. Matlock wrote:
kalvano wrote:It's amazing how much people agonize over such a purchase.

Something about the thousand dollar mark of a purchase that seems to increase the level of fail aversion exponentially for me.


Buy the MBP Matlock. You won't regret it.



Until you realized you overpaid for the shiny.


In a word, subjective, but I'd rather not restart another Mac vs. PC argument.

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yinz
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby yinz » Sun Jul 11, 2010 4:44 pm

So which is better: Mac v. PC?

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Rudy
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Rudy » Sun Jul 11, 2010 4:58 pm

yinz wrote:So which is better: Mac v. PC?


Depends what you value. /argument


What is the concensus then? MBP or Lenovo <___>, depending on preference?

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kalvano
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby kalvano » Sun Jul 11, 2010 4:59 pm

Mac doesn't have the Trackpoint, therefore Mac is inferior.

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Mr. Matlock
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Mr. Matlock » Sun Jul 11, 2010 5:07 pm

kalvano wrote:Mac doesn't have the Trackpoint, therefore Mac is inferior.

Lenovo doesn't have the buy one get an ipod touch for your wife. Always be looking for things to placate the women in you life Kalvano. You should know this already! :wink:

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kalvano
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby kalvano » Sun Jul 11, 2010 5:12 pm

Mr. Matlock wrote:
kalvano wrote:Mac doesn't have the Trackpoint, therefore Mac is inferior.

Lenovo doesn't have the buy one get an ipod touch for your wife. Always be looking for things to placate the women in you life Kalvano. You should know this already! :wink:


We both have iPhones. If Mac let you take the money off the MacBook, then that would be nice.

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Rudy
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Rudy » Sun Jul 11, 2010 5:16 pm

kalvano wrote:Mac doesn't have the Trackpoint, therefore Mac is inferior.


And Lenovo doesn't have multi touch touchpads or magsafe power adapters.

As I said, it's a toss up based on how you assign utility- neither option dominates the other.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby ResolutePear » Sun Jul 11, 2010 5:23 pm

Rudy wrote:
kalvano wrote:Mac doesn't have the Trackpoint, therefore Mac is inferior.


And Lenovo doesn't have multi touch touchpads or magsafe power adapters.

As I said, it's a toss up based on how you assign utility- neither option dominates the other.


I disagree - for business applications, the Thinkpad murders the Macbook. Why? It has no security options - no fingerprint reader and no hardware-level encryption. Heck, lets talk about the software. Give me a Macbook and I'll have root in less than 3 minutes.

Why would I want to put my company's trade secrets and such on a mac? Hell, it even has clumsy HD encryption thanks only to strides made by the *Nix/BSD community.

Where the mac belongs is with multimedia consumers and professionals.

Thinkpads come with multi-touch now and theres a hack out now for the magsafe, too.

In a business/legal setting, the mac *IS* inferior.

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crazycanuck
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby crazycanuck » Sun Jul 11, 2010 5:28 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
Rudy wrote:
kalvano wrote:Mac doesn't have the Trackpoint, therefore Mac is inferior.


And Lenovo doesn't have multi touch touchpads or magsafe power adapters.

As I said, it's a toss up based on how you assign utility- neither option dominates the other.


I disagree - for business applications, the Thinkpad murders the Macbook. Why? It has no security options - no fingerprint reader and no hardware-level encryption. Heck, lets talk about the software. Give me a Macbook and I'll have root in less than 3 minutes.

Why would I want to put my company's trade secrets and such on a mac? Hell, it even has clumsy HD encryption thanks only to strides made by the *Nix/BSD community.

Where the mac belongs is with multimedia consumers and professionals.

Thinkpads come with multi-touch now and theres a hack out now for the magsafe, too.

In a business/legal setting, the mac *IS* inferior.


Eh the finger print thing is really just a huge annoyance.

One aspect that a lot of people don't take into account is Macs resale value. I just sold my 1st generation Macbook for $600 when I bought it for $1000 4ish years ago. PCs don't tend to have that kind of resale value.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby ResolutePear » Sun Jul 11, 2010 5:40 pm

crazycanuck wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
Rudy wrote:
kalvano wrote:Mac doesn't have the Trackpoint, therefore Mac is inferior.


And Lenovo doesn't have multi touch touchpads or magsafe power adapters.

As I said, it's a toss up based on how you assign utility- neither option dominates the other.


I disagree - for business applications, the Thinkpad murders the Macbook. Why? It has no security options - no fingerprint reader and no hardware-level encryption. Heck, lets talk about the software. Give me a Macbook and I'll have root in less than 3 minutes.

Why would I want to put my company's trade secrets and such on a mac? Hell, it even has clumsy HD encryption thanks only to strides made by the *Nix/BSD community.

Where the mac belongs is with multimedia consumers and professionals.

Thinkpads come with multi-touch now and theres a hack out now for the magsafe, too.

In a business/legal setting, the mac *IS* inferior.


Eh the finger print thing is really just a huge annoyance.

One aspect that a lot of people don't take into account is Macs resale value. I just sold my 1st generation Macbook for $600 when I bought it for $1000 4ish years ago. PCs don't tend to have that kind of resale value.


It's a huge annoyance until your laptop gets stolen and you worry every day and night about having to protect yourself when something important is floating around.

Think: 100,000 Credit card numbers belonging to your clients. There goes your clientèle when the news comes out.

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Rudy
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Rudy » Sun Jul 11, 2010 5:44 pm

crazycanuck wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
Rudy wrote:
kalvano wrote:Mac doesn't have the Trackpoint, therefore Mac is inferior.


And Lenovo doesn't have multi touch touchpads or magsafe power adapters.

As I said, it's a toss up based on how you assign utility- neither option dominates the other.


I disagree - for business applications, the Thinkpad murders the Macbook. Why? It has no security options - no fingerprint reader and no hardware-level encryption. Heck, lets talk about the software. Give me a Macbook and I'll have root in less than 3 minutes.

Why would I want to put my company's trade secrets and such on a mac? Hell, it even has clumsy HD encryption thanks only to strides made by the *Nix/BSD community.

Where the mac belongs is with multimedia consumers and professionals.

Thinkpads come with multi-touch now and theres a hack out now for the magsafe, too.

In a business/legal setting, the mac *IS* inferior.


Eh the finger print thing is really just a huge annoyance.

One aspect that a lot of people don't take into account is Macs resale value. I just sold my 1st generation Macbook for $600 when I bought it for $1000 4ish years ago. PCs don't tend to have that kind of resale value.


Agreed on fingerprint reader/ biometrics. They're annoying- a properly secure password would require about as much work as most commercial fingerprint readers to hack anyway- assuming you actually change your password as often as someone seriously concerned with security.

That being said, you're right, Mac's do not offer the degree of security (in terms of encryption and obvious file system) that a PC can have.

But:
1. Most people are not even close to competent enough to deal with that.
2. This is the discussion for Law School, not the legal profession.

I maintain they're equally viable options for an academic setting. I wasn't aware of the multitouch on lenovo- I will have to get one next.

The hack for magsafe is interesting but see my point 1 above.

Edit: Also, why not just not keep such files encrypted? A properly encrypted file would be just as good/ better than a biometric lock.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby ResolutePear » Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:10 pm

Rudy wrote:
crazycanuck wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
Rudy wrote:
And Lenovo doesn't have multi touch touchpads or magsafe power adapters.

As I said, it's a toss up based on how you assign utility- neither option dominates the other.


I disagree - for business applications, the Thinkpad murders the Macbook. Why? It has no security options - no fingerprint reader and no hardware-level encryption. Heck, lets talk about the software. Give me a Macbook and I'll have root in less than 3 minutes.

Why would I want to put my company's trade secrets and such on a mac? Hell, it even has clumsy HD encryption thanks only to strides made by the *Nix/BSD community.

Where the mac belongs is with multimedia consumers and professionals.

Thinkpads come with multi-touch now and theres a hack out now for the magsafe, too.

In a business/legal setting, the mac *IS* inferior.


Eh the finger print thing is really just a huge annoyance.

One aspect that a lot of people don't take into account is Macs resale value. I just sold my 1st generation Macbook for $600 when I bought it for $1000 4ish years ago. PCs don't tend to have that kind of resale value.


Agreed on fingerprint reader/ biometrics. They're annoying- a properly secure password would require about as much work as most commercial fingerprint readers to hack anyway- assuming you actually change your password as often as someone seriously concerned with security.

That being said, you're right, Mac's do not offer the degree of security (in terms of encryption and obvious file system) that a PC can have.

But:
1. Most people are not even close to competent enough to deal with that.
2. This is the discussion for Law School, not the legal profession.

I maintain they're equally viable options for an academic setting. I wasn't aware of the multitouch on lenovo- I will have to get one next.

The hack for magsafe is interesting but see my point 1 above.

Edit: Also, why not just not keep such files unencrypted? A properly encrypted file would be just as good/ better than a biometric lock.


The biometrics lock involves a hardware lock having to do with the CPU + key components. There are tools out now that allow you to easily recover the last state of a computer before shutdown - the FBI uses and the security industry does too. It's freely available.

It's true that people aren't competent enough, but ignorance isn't an excuse when you get your laptop stolen by a 16-year-old and your clients/bosses demand the information/property or hold you responsible for damages.

And as far as file encryption goes: most people's definition for file encryption involves putting a password on an excel folder. If they're really technical - bitlock the HD. There's a hack out for that. How about...there's a hack out for that - just a matter of getting the right tools on the net. But if a person can't use a biometric lock, chances are they can't use file encryption either.

Not saying the biometric is 100%, but when you have to bust out the solder to turn the laptop on, it changes the game.

Huh? Wait. I forgot.. this is a moot point because the macbook doesn't have this level of security. root plz.

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Rudy
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Rudy » Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:23 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
The biometrics lock involves a hardware lock having to do with the CPU + key components. There are tools out now that allow you to easily recover the last state of a computer before shutdown - the FBI uses and the security industry does too. It's freely available.

It's true that people aren't competent enough, but ignorance isn't an excuse when you get your laptop stolen by a 16-year-old and your clients/bosses demand the information/property or hold you responsible for damages.

And as far as file encryption goes: most people's definition for file encryption involves putting a password on an excel folder. If they're really technical - bitlock the HD. There's a hack out for that. How about...there's a hack out for that - just a matter of getting the right tools on the net. But if a person can't use a biometric lock, chances are they can't use file encryption either.

Not saying the biometric is 100%, but when you have to bust out the solder to turn the laptop on, it changes the game.

Huh? Wait. I forgot.. this is a moot point because the macbook doesn't have this level of security. root plz.



But all of this still only has relevance to private sector and not to a student.

Otherwise you're right on- I forgot about hardware level biometrics. The last laptop I had with a fingerprint reader was a piece of shit that just input a password for you- it served no real purpose.

So in short: I agree (still) that Macs are strictly worse for those who have to keep files secure at extreme levels (professionals, et. al.) I disagree that this is relevant for law school.

And really, shouldn't you be advocating Linux? Stability be damned, that's gonna give you the most security if you're that paranoid security minded.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby ResolutePear » Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:52 pm

Rudy wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
The biometrics lock involves a hardware lock having to do with the CPU + key components. There are tools out now that allow you to easily recover the last state of a computer before shutdown - the FBI uses and the security industry does too. It's freely available.

It's true that people aren't competent enough, but ignorance isn't an excuse when you get your laptop stolen by a 16-year-old and your clients/bosses demand the information/property or hold you responsible for damages.

And as far as file encryption goes: most people's definition for file encryption involves putting a password on an excel folder. If they're really technical - bitlock the HD. There's a hack out for that. How about...there's a hack out for that - just a matter of getting the right tools on the net. But if a person can't use a biometric lock, chances are they can't use file encryption either.

Not saying the biometric is 100%, but when you have to bust out the solder to turn the laptop on, it changes the game.

Huh? Wait. I forgot.. this is a moot point because the macbook doesn't have this level of security. root plz.



But all of this still only has relevance to private sector and not to a student.

Otherwise you're right on- I forgot about hardware level biometrics. The last laptop I had with a fingerprint reader was a piece of shit that just input a password for you- it served no real purpose.

So in short: I agree (still) that Macs are strictly worse for those who have to keep files secure at extreme levels (professionals, et. al.) I disagree that this is relevant for law school.

And really, shouldn't you be advocating Linux? Stability be damned, that's gonna give you the most security if you're that paranoid security minded.


Advocating Linux on a board of to-be lawyers is like advocating a comp. sci. degree.

I can agree that it may seem overboard, but at a previous client, I was brought in because of a string of credit-card charges made to higher-management employees. One was charged 5,000 while the others had similar charges placed. Well, investigations and everything done - conclusion was that an employee installed keyloggers/backdoors on company laptops when left unattended in their offices.

Prime example of when a small level of security would of saved a lot of headaches. Oh, and they still ended up signing a purchase order for Thinkpads.

But again, it really is business - but how I figure it.. if it's good enough for business - how can you go wrong?

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Rudy
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Rudy » Sun Jul 11, 2010 7:58 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
Rudy wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
The biometrics lock involves a hardware lock having to do with the CPU + key components. There are tools out now that allow you to easily recover the last state of a computer before shutdown - the FBI uses and the security industry does too. It's freely available.

It's true that people aren't competent enough, but ignorance isn't an excuse when you get your laptop stolen by a 16-year-old and your clients/bosses demand the information/property or hold you responsible for damages.

And as far as file encryption goes: most people's definition for file encryption involves putting a password on an excel folder. If they're really technical - bitlock the HD. There's a hack out for that. How about...there's a hack out for that - just a matter of getting the right tools on the net. But if a person can't use a biometric lock, chances are they can't use file encryption either.

Not saying the biometric is 100%, but when you have to bust out the solder to turn the laptop on, it changes the game.

Huh? Wait. I forgot.. this is a moot point because the macbook doesn't have this level of security. root plz.



But all of this still only has relevance to private sector and not to a student.

Otherwise you're right on- I forgot about hardware level biometrics. The last laptop I had with a fingerprint reader was a piece of shit that just input a password for you- it served no real purpose.

So in short: I agree (still) that Macs are strictly worse for those who have to keep files secure at extreme levels (professionals, et. al.) I disagree that this is relevant for law school.

And really, shouldn't you be advocating Linux? Stability be damned, that's gonna give you the most security if you're that paranoid security minded.


Advocating Linux on a board of to-be lawyers is like advocating a comp. sci. degree.

I can agree that it may seem overboard, but at a previous client, I was brought in because of a string of credit-card charges made to higher-management employees. One was charged 5,000 while the others had similar charges placed. Well, investigations and everything done - conclusion was that an employee installed keyloggers/backdoors on company laptops when left unattended in their offices.

Prime example of when a small level of security would of saved a lot of headaches. Oh, and they still ended up signing a purchase order for Thinkpads.

But again, it really is business - but how I figure it.. if it's good enough for business - how can you go wrong?


Very good point- you certainly can't go wrong with a Lenovo- more of a "what trade offs do you have to make." I personally prefer Mac OS (having used Mac, PC, and Linux to a large degree), and yes, the shiny of a Mac. But Lenovo is cheaper and does everything necessary.

clint4law
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby clint4law » Sun Jul 11, 2010 10:25 pm

so now that I got the laptop out of the way....what kinda printer do you guys and gals recommend? Are color printers necessary? My school offers free black and white printing but I'd still like to have access to a printer at home.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby ResolutePear » Sun Jul 11, 2010 10:32 pm

clint4law wrote:so now that I got the laptop out of the way....what kinda printer do you guys and gals recommend? Are color printers necessary? My school offers free black and white printing but I'd still like to have access to a printer at home.


Get a ThinkPrinter because you can never be too safe!

I kid, I kid.

Check out: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113291

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113290

I believe the difference is just a few features related to network/group printing. Nothing big - but overall, I havn't heard anything bad and being that it's only black.. just one cartridge. Also prints upto 10,000 pages a month soooo.. there you go.

Oh, and one more thought: The latter laser printer I linked has a qty. limit of 999... so hopefully it's not a big order!

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Rudy
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Rudy » Sun Jul 11, 2010 10:37 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
clint4law wrote:so now that I got the laptop out of the way....what kinda printer do you guys and gals recommend? Are color printers necessary? My school offers free black and white printing but I'd still like to have access to a printer at home.


Get a ThinkPrinter because you can never be too safe!

I kid, I kid.

Check out: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113291

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113290

I believe the difference is just a few features related to network/group printing. Nothing big - but overall, I havn't heard anything bad and being that it's only black.. just one cartridge. Also prints upto 10,000 pages a month soooo.. there you go.

Oh, and one more thought: The latter laser printer I linked has a qty. limit of 999... so hopefully it's not a big order!


I bought those for my dorm when I was on eboard- great purchase for super budget.

+1

clint4law
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby clint4law » Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:06 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
clint4law wrote:so now that I got the laptop out of the way....what kinda printer do you guys and gals recommend? Are color printers necessary? My school offers free black and white printing but I'd still like to have access to a printer at home.


Get a ThinkPrinter because you can never be too safe!

I kid, I kid.

Check out: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113291

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113290

I believe the difference is just a few features related to network/group printing. Nothing big - but overall, I havn't heard anything bad and being that it's only black.. just one cartridge. Also prints upto 10,000 pages a month soooo.. there you go.

Oh, and one more thought: The latter laser printer I linked has a qty. limit of 999... so hopefully it's not a big order!


thanks

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zeth006
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby zeth006 » Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:24 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
clint4law wrote:so now that I got the laptop out of the way....what kinda printer do you guys and gals recommend? Are color printers necessary? My school offers free black and white printing but I'd still like to have access to a printer at home.


Get a ThinkPrinter because you can never be too safe!

I kid, I kid.

Check out: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113291

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113290

I believe the difference is just a few features related to network/group printing. Nothing big - but overall, I havn't heard anything bad and being that it's only black.. just one cartridge. Also prints upto 10,000 pages a month soooo.. there you go.

Oh, and one more thought: The latter laser printer I linked has a qty. limit of 999... so hopefully it's not a big order!



ROFL. I'm using the first one right now! The wireless feature certain helps get rid of the need for an additional USB port.


Quick question though. Is it possible to have my desktop replacement and my notebook both connected wirelessly to the 2170W?

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Mr. Matlock
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Mr. Matlock » Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:51 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
clint4law wrote:so now that I got the laptop out of the way....what kinda printer do you guys and gals recommend? Are color printers necessary? My school offers free black and white printing but I'd still like to have access to a printer at home.


Get a ThinkPrinter because you can never be too safe!

I kid, I kid.

Check out: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113291

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113290

I believe the difference is just a few features related to network/group printing. Nothing big - but overall, I havn't heard anything bad and being that it's only black.. just one cartridge. Also prints upto 10,000 pages a month soooo.. there you go.

Oh, and one more thought: The latter laser printer I linked has a qty. limit of 999... so hopefully it's not a big order!

GREAT call on the printer!!! (Brother HL-2140) I've been kicking myself for not getting it at Best Buy 2 weeks ago for $69.00! However, Office Max has it on sale this week for $69! SOLD!!!

--LinkRemoved--

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Thomas Jefferson
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby Thomas Jefferson » Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:54 pm

Don't get a Dell. If you shell out for their extended warranty and service, they're good with fixing things very quickly. However, if you don't, or once it runs out, enjoy your imminent blue screen of death. I know I did.

/vent

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zeth006
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby zeth006 » Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:55 pm

Mr. Matlock wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
clint4law wrote:so now that I got the laptop out of the way....what kinda printer do you guys and gals recommend? Are color printers necessary? My school offers free black and white printing but I'd still like to have access to a printer at home.


Get a ThinkPrinter because you can never be too safe!

I kid, I kid.

Check out: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113291

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6828113290

I believe the difference is just a few features related to network/group printing. Nothing big - but overall, I havn't heard anything bad and being that it's only black.. just one cartridge. Also prints upto 10,000 pages a month soooo.. there you go.

That, or get the 2170 $70 from OfficeMax for a little more. It's been known to go in and out of sale for $70 or more with or without rebates.

http://slickdeals.net/forums/showthread ... &t=2119218

Oh, and one more thought: The latter laser printer I linked has a qty. limit of 999... so hopefully it's not a big order!

GREAT call on the printer!!! (Brother HL-2140) I've been kicking myself for not getting it at Best Buy 2 weeks ago for $69.00! However, Office Max has it on sale this week for $69! SOLD!!!

--LinkRemoved--

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zeth006
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Re: Best Law School Laptop for the Money

Postby zeth006 » Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:55 pm

Thomas Jefferson wrote:Don't get a Dell. If you shell out for their extended warranty and service, they're good with fixing things very quickly. However, if you don't, or once it runs out, enjoy your imminent blue screen of death. I know I did.

/vent



LOL. You're the guy who made the BSOD thread.




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