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Bigred2008
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doesn't matter

Postby Bigred2008 » Mon Mar 15, 2010 11:34 am

Doesn't matter
Last edited by Bigred2008 on Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:55 pm, edited 2 times in total.

hsprophet
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby hsprophet » Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:28 pm

Disclose what you remember. If you can't remember the date, then just put the year. If you can't remember the calendar year, then put something like "during first year of college, 2002-2003."

One school asked for everything including ALL traffic offenses. I got a speeding ticket about five years ago. I just put the year (2004) and the details that I remembered (speed, outcome after court).

There's no excuse for not disclosing what they ask for, even if you don't remember all the details or there is no official record of it. That doesn't change the fact that it happened.

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TheLuckyOne
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby TheLuckyOne » Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:45 pm

hsprophet wrote:Disclose what you remember. If you can't remember the date, then just put the year. If you can't remember the calendar year, then put something like "during first year of college, 2002-2003."

One school asked for everything including ALL traffic offenses. I got a speeding ticket about five years ago. I just put the year (2004) and the details that I remembered (speed, outcome after court).

There's no excuse for not disclosing what they ask for, even if you don't remember all the details or there is no official record of it. That doesn't change the fact that it happened.


LOL what?!

Dude, if there is no record of it and no one really knows/cares, why on earth would you disclose it.

It's like saying to an adcom "I used to party and drink sooo much when I was 15", even though no one besides my friends knows about it. LOL

Do NOT disclose anything that cannot be dug up later by ABA. It's that simple.

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blerg
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby blerg » Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:48 pm

Did you go through any sort of punishment or did your RA just yell at you?

I'm editing this because if it were me, I'd probably disclose it, but I've also never gotten in trouble for anything and I am a ninny.
Last edited by blerg on Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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blerg
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby blerg » Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:49 pm

Also, call the office of housing and see if it's only in their files.

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Bigred2008
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby Bigred2008 » Mon Mar 15, 2010 1:45 pm

I had a hearing, Roommates and I had a party in my room and was written up, was required to write a reflection paper and was given a warning. But, I appealed, and it literally went away. I never found out the result of my appeal, I'm assuming it went well because there is no record of it. But because I don't have the outcome letter of my appeal I am worried, because if I put it on my app, and my school says that never happened how that would look for when I'm looking to gain admittance to the bar. Also, called the house during my lunch break, there is no record there.

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TheLuckyOne
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby TheLuckyOne » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:13 pm

Bigred2008 wrote:I had a hearing, Roommates and I had a party in my room and was written up, was required to write a reflection paper and was given a warning. But, I appealed, and it literally went away. I never found out the result of my appeal, I'm assuming it went well because there is no record of it. But because I don't have the outcome letter of my appeal I am worried, because if I put it on my app, and my school says that never happened how that would look for when I'm looking to gain admittance to the bar. Also, called the house during my lunch break, there is no record there.


Are you still not sure what to do?
No record = never happened. Period.

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Bigred2008
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby Bigred2008 » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:14 pm

doesn't matter
Last edited by Bigred2008 on Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

hsprophet
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby hsprophet » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:25 pm

TheLuckyOne wrote:Dude, if there is no record of it and no one really knows/cares, why on earth would you disclose it.


Because they ask you to disclose it. They don't have a footnote that says "only if there is proof."

If the disciplinary action falls into the requirements for disclosure, I'd disclose, period. In the end, something like this won't matter as to whether or not the school or the ABA feels like you have sufficient character. The issue is proper disclosure.

Getting in trouble for drinking in a dorm room means nothing to the bar. Not disclosing it turns it into a BIG deal. That is, if they ever found out. No record means they probably wouldn't, but why chance it? It's better to go ahead and practice good ethics now and get in the habit of it.

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bees
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby bees » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:28 pm

Bigred2008 wrote:I had a hearing, Roommates and I had a party in my room and was written up, was required to write a reflection paper and was given a warning. But, I appealed, and it literally went away. I never found out the result of my appeal, I'm assuming it went well because there is no record of it. But because I don't have the outcome letter of my appeal I am worried, because if I put it on my app, and my school says that never happened how that would look for when I'm looking to gain admittance to the bar. Also, called the house during my lunch break, there is no record there.


Just disclose it. It won't hurt you and will give you peace of mind. My whole judicial record was voided and I disclosed it anyways.

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JuTMSY4
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby JuTMSY4 » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:30 pm

bees wrote:
Bigred2008 wrote:I had a hearing, Roommates and I had a party in my room and was written up, was required to write a reflection paper and was given a warning. But, I appealed, and it literally went away. I never found out the result of my appeal, I'm assuming it went well because there is no record of it. But because I don't have the outcome letter of my appeal I am worried, because if I put it on my app, and my school says that never happened how that would look for when I'm looking to gain admittance to the bar. Also, called the house during my lunch break, there is no record there.


Just disclose it. It won't hurt you and will give you peace of mind. My whole judicial record was voided and I disclosed it anyways.


+1

When in doubt, disclose.

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Bigred2008
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby Bigred2008 » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:05 pm

doesn't matter
Last edited by Bigred2008 on Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

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mfeller2
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby mfeller2 » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:16 pm

I have a similar violation in my memory, but after my write up the judicial affairs officer said it would only be used in their "in-house" file. When I asked about putting it on any later law school applications, he told me to not worry about it since they don't disclose in-house incidents.
IMO "Forget about it!"

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TheLuckyOne
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby TheLuckyOne » Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:15 pm

hsprophet wrote:
TheLuckyOne wrote:Dude, if there is no record of it and no one really knows/cares, why on earth would you disclose it.


Because they ask you to disclose it. They don't have a footnote that says "only if there is proof."

If the disciplinary action falls into the requirements for disclosure, I'd disclose, period. In the end, something like this won't matter as to whether or not the school or the ABA feels like you have sufficient character. The issue is proper disclosure.

Getting in trouble for drinking in a dorm room means nothing to the bar. Not disclosing it turns it into a BIG deal. That is, if they ever found out. No record means they probably wouldn't, but why chance it? It's better to go ahead and practice good ethics now and get in the habit of it.


LOL, then you should prolly also disclose every time you crossed the road on red. That must be funny, I can imagine someone sitting there counting instances :lol:

You will look like a tool/sort of silly if really disclose something no one would have ever been aware of.
OP, if you really want a piece of mind, then find out if it can ever come out. Again, if it's not recorded = never happened. Schools don't really ask you for any violations you may have had throughout your life, but those that are written somewhere.

I rest my case, you do whatever feels right.

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bees
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby bees » Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:59 pm

TheLuckyOne wrote:LOL, then you should prolly also disclose every time you crossed the road on red. That must be funny, I can imagine someone sitting there counting instances :lol:

You will look like a tool/sort of silly if really disclose something no one would have ever been aware of.
OP, if you really want a piece of mind, then find out if it can ever come out. Again, if it's not recorded = never happened. Schools don't really ask you for any violations you may have had throughout your life, but those that are written somewhere.

I rest my case, you do whatever feels right.


I think this is pretty bad advice.

First off, your example is just awful. OP's incident WAS recorded (he was written up). THEN it was deleted/voided/erased. OP even had to write an essay (unless you appealed before this happened?). If you can't see the difference between that and crossing when the light is red and no one catches you...I dunno.

It's been pretty well established that people should disclose any arrests or run-ins with the law, even if they've had them cleared, or their record sealed, or whatever else one can to do be rid of that stuff. How is this different (besides the fact that arrests are a bit more serious that the stuff most people get in trouble for on campus)?

Also, if you really are worried about looking like a "tool" just be sure to include that your record was erased or that you successfully appealed.

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TheLuckyOne
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby TheLuckyOne » Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:27 pm

bees wrote:
TheLuckyOne wrote:LOL, then you should prolly also disclose every time you crossed the road on red. That must be funny, I can imagine someone sitting there counting instances :lol:

You will look like a tool/sort of silly if really disclose something no one would have ever been aware of.
OP, if you really want a piece of mind, then find out if it can ever come out. Again, if it's not recorded = never happened. Schools don't really ask you for any violations you may have had throughout your life, but those that are written somewhere.

I rest my case, you do whatever feels right.


I think this is pretty bad advice.

First off, your example is just awful. OP's incident WAS recorded (he was written up). THEN it was deleted/voided/erased. OP even had to write an essay (unless you appealed before this happened?). If you can't see the difference between that and crossing when the light is red and no one catches you...I dunno.

It's been pretty well established that people should disclose any arrests or run-ins with the law, even if they've had them cleared, or their record sealed, or whatever else one can to do be rid of that stuff. How is this different (besides the fact that arrests are a bit more serious that the stuff most people get in trouble for on campus)?

Also, if you really are worried about looking like a "tool" just be sure to include that your record was erased or that you successfully appealed.


I know I was running to extremes with my examples...

Ok, I don't really know how erasing the record works, but I would imagine if you erase it, it's..ummm..erased! and no one can really pick it up somewhere and turn it against OP. I agree with you if I'm wrong with my ideas about voiding records, however, if there is indeed no record whatsoever, I don't really see a reason to even bother including it. It can't help his application, it can only hurt, that's why if I were him I would look for a way not to include it without making any violations.

Basically, my advise comes down to: do your due diligence, find out what they mean by erasing a record, and draw conclusions. I don't see how it can be bad. It's one thing if it's archived, and another if it's completely erased.

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bees
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Re: Difference between disciplinary record and memory

Postby bees » Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:48 pm

TheLuckyOne wrote:I know I was running to extremes with my examples...

Ok, I don't really know how erasing the record works, but I would imagine if you erase it, it's..ummm..erased! and no one can really pick it up somewhere and turn it against OP. I agree with you if I'm wrong with my ideas about voiding records, however, if there is indeed no record whatsoever, I don't really see a reason to even bother including it. It can't help his application, it can only hurt, that's why if I were him I would look for a way not to include it without making any violations.

Basically, my advise comes down to: do your due diligence, find out what they mean by erasing a record, and draw conclusions. I don't see how it can be bad. It's one thing if it's archived, and another if it's completely erased.


I bet if it's erased then it no longer exists. But the risk isn't worth it.

His roommate was also written up (did he appeal too?). In his roommate's write up it will list the OP's name (I doubt undergrads are replacing everyone who has their record voided's name with "[redacted]" in other people's files) since they were written up together. I'd bet that somewhere, somehow the OP's name is still in his school's judicial records attached to that incident.

Will this ever come to light? Of course not. Is it extremely paranoid to think like this? Hell yes. Do schools ask to list only incidents that are still on record? Not on the applications I filled out (and they are even pretty clear when discussing legal transgressions that you also have to list offenses you've had expunged, etc). Isn't it smarter to do what the schools ask for and simply tell them every time you had any sort of disciplinary action taken against you? I'd say yes.

Anyways, I'm saying all this for the OP's sake (and others who search for stuff on this topic). I agree with you that erased is erased and there is a 99.9% chance nothing that isn't officially on your disciplinary record at school will ever be seen again.




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