Vandy worth sticker?

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Xiaolong
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Vandy worth sticker?

Postby Xiaolong » Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:17 pm

Is it worth paying sticker at Vandy over half-tuition sholarship money at schools like BU or WUSTL? I mean, Vandy's performance this year in terms of placement is pretty insane and I don't see a reason why this trend will not continue in the future?

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danidancer
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby danidancer » Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:29 pm

This is something I'm very interested in myself. Since I've been WL/held at most of the low T14, UCLA, Vandy, etc, but have several very generous T20/T30 financial aid packages, this is a decision I could very well be facing in the future myself. Clearly T6 is still worth sticker, and I would probably jump for T10 as well. But GULC? Vandy? I'm not so sure... If you're interested in practicing in the midwest or Boston, I'd probably take the money and run...

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Aberzombie1892
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby Aberzombie1892 » Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:36 pm

Xiaolong wrote:Is it worth paying sticker at Vandy over half-tuition sholarship money at schools like BU or WUSTL? I mean, Vandy's performance this year in terms of placement is pretty insane and I don't see a reason why this trend will not continu


I personally don't think any school is worth sticker.

It just depends on what, in your mind, would constitute a school being worth more than another.

I will say however, that if you think that any school outside of the top few schools (i.e. outside the top 3 but less than 14, or 13 as it now goes apparently) would be worth sticker, surely Vanderbilt would be as well.

Xiaolong
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby Xiaolong » Sat Mar 06, 2010 2:35 am

danidancer wrote:This is something I'm very interested in myself. Since I've been WL/held at most of the low T14, UCLA, Vandy, etc, but have several very generous T20/T30 financial aid packages, this is a decision I could very well be facing in the future myself. Clearly T6 is still worth sticker, and I would probably jump for T10 as well. But GULC? Vandy? I'm not so sure... If you're interested in practicing in the midwest or Boston, I'd probably take the money and run...


From the placement data of the last two years, Vandy is getting close in terms of NLJ 250 placement to schools like Georgetown and Michigan and UVa (look at 08 and 09 data). So if people are willing to pay sticker at those two, why not Vandy? I wouldn't be surprised if Vandy breaks the 50% mark in the next couple of years.

What I also like about Vandy is their openness about their placement statistics. It seems like everyone is doing pretty well out of Vandy...

Xiaolong
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby Xiaolong » Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:25 am

Bump.

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tome
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby tome » Sun Mar 07, 2010 12:31 pm

I think so.

People who say paying sticker is a poor idea outside of HYS, or T6, or T10, or T14, or whatever a full of it, IMO. This is particularly true of Vandy. The long and short-term career difference between going to Vandy and, say Duke, I'd say is negligible. I am not saying pay $200k to go to a T4 school. But the idea that it is a good idea to pay sticker before some magic rank number, and then a bad idea after that number is clearly worthless. The employment data simply do not make such distinctions credible.

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missvik218
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby missvik218 » Sun Mar 07, 2010 12:46 pm

Waitlisted at Vandy, also VERY curious about this question before I start bombarding them with LOCIs professing I intend to attend if accepted. I'm leaning toward a "probably yes" in this case, of course that depends on your other options .... I really don't know.

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pleasetryagain
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby pleasetryagain » Sun Mar 07, 2010 12:49 pm

How are you paying for COL? Additional loans?

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Kchuck
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby Kchuck » Tue Apr 06, 2010 1:28 pm

Anyone know what the Decision Mailed 4/5 group was? Waitlist/rejections?

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missvik218
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby missvik218 » Tue Apr 06, 2010 1:29 pm

Kchuck wrote:Anyone know what the Decision Mailed 4/5 group was? Waitlist/rejections?

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=94928&start=2325

Probably the better place to ask.

sdv
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby sdv » Tue Apr 06, 2010 1:34 pm

I love Vandy, and am probably going there, but it all depends. If you know where you want to live and practice, then it's probably not worth it, but if you want as many options as possible, Vandy is it. It's about the only place outside of the T14 I can think of where you can go anywhere in the country (with some dilligence as far as resume shopping is concerned). But (and this is an extreme example) lets say you are 100% sure you want to practice in Pittsburgh. There are no top law schools in the area, so a Pitt degree will get you where you want to go, and they'll probably offer you a ton of money. Same for Cleveland and Case. in those cases, Vandy might not be worth it for you. At the same time, Vandy is a great school and you WILL get a job, and you WILL be able to pay off debt.

dating a med student has taught me that law school debt is absolutely NOTHING compared to med school debt, which is an extra year of tuition and living expenses plus a mandatory period in which you make barely enough money to survive. We have it easy. Go where you feel comfortable!

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missvik218
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby missvik218 » Tue Apr 06, 2010 2:47 pm

pleasetryagain wrote:How are you paying for COL? Additional loans?

Grad Plus will cover total COA, no?

de5igual
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby de5igual » Tue Apr 06, 2010 2:49 pm

sdv wrote:I love Vandy, and am probably going there, but it all depends. If you know where you want to live and practice, then it's probably not worth it, but if you want as many options as possible, Vandy is it. It's about the only place outside of the T14 I can think of where you can go anywhere in the country (with some dilligence as far as resume shopping is concerned). But (and this is an extreme example) lets say you are 100% sure you want to practice in Pittsburgh. There are no top law schools in the area, so a Pitt degree will get you where you want to go, and they'll probably offer you a ton of money. Same for Cleveland and Case. in those cases, Vandy might not be worth it for you. At the same time, Vandy is a great school and you WILL get a job, and you WILL be able to pay off debt.

dating a med student has taught me that law school debt is absolutely NOTHING compared to med school debt, which is an extra year of tuition and living expenses plus a mandatory period in which you make barely enough money to survive. We have it easy. Go where you feel comfortable!


but i'm pretty sure coming out of med school, you're more or less guaranteed a job. lawl school...not so much...

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legalease9
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby legalease9 » Tue Apr 06, 2010 3:09 pm

What do people think about Vandy's employment trends? Do you think they will maintain?

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tome
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby tome » Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:15 pm

legalease9 wrote:What do people think about Vandy's employment trends? Do you think they will maintain?


My understanding is that Vandy has had good placement forever. I see no reason to think that is gonna change.

fortissimo
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby fortissimo » Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:54 pm

Xiaolong wrote:
danidancer wrote:This is something I'm very interested in myself. Since I've been WL/held at most of the low T14, UCLA, Vandy, etc, but have several very generous T20/T30 financial aid packages, this is a decision I could very well be facing in the future myself. Clearly T6 is still worth sticker, and I would probably jump for T10 as well. But GULC? Vandy? I'm not so sure... If you're interested in practicing in the midwest or Boston, I'd probably take the money and run...


From the placement data of the last two years, Vandy is getting close in terms of NLJ 250 placement to schools like Georgetown and Michigan and UVa (look at 08 and 09 data). So if people are willing to pay sticker at those two, why not Vandy? I wouldn't be surprised if Vandy breaks the 50% mark in the next couple of years.

What I also like about Vandy is their openness about their placement statistics. It seems like everyone is doing pretty well out of Vandy...


That's pretty flawed reasoning because UVA and Mich put more into clerkships. (I.e. This current year Mich has put more than 20% into clerkships.) You have to look at clerkship + big law percentages together.

I would also be surprised if Vandy breaks the 50% mark in the next couple of years considering the vast reduction in biglaw hiring. (If median at Columbia can't cut it, median at Vandy won't cut it either.)

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missvik218
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby missvik218 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 9:33 am

fortissimo wrote:That's pretty flawed reasoning because UVA and Mich put more into clerkships. (I.e. This current year Mich has put more than 20% into clerkships.) You have to look at clerkship + big law percentages together.

I would also be surprised if Vandy breaks the 50% mark in the next couple of years considering the vast reduction in biglaw hiring. (If median at Columbia can't cut it, median at Vandy won't cut it either.)

True, but if you could argue T14 = Sticker-approriate then Vandy should most definitely be included viewtopic.php?f=1&t=108528. UVA and Mich may not have been great comparisons except for the atmospheres of the schools, but Vandy is competitive with G-town, Cornell, and NYU according to the 2009 NLJ 250 + 2008 clerkship numbers.

Also, Mich and UVA are clerkship machines, do you have class of 2009 or 2010 clerkship data? The links I've found have all been for class of 2008 which puts Mich (13.9%), UVA (12.4%), and Vandy (7.9%) as far as % of class placed into clerkships.

Rawlsian
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby Rawlsian » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:51 pm

missvik218 wrote:
fortissimo wrote:That's pretty flawed reasoning because UVA and Mich put more into clerkships. (I.e. This current year Mich has put more than 20% into clerkships.) You have to look at clerkship + big law percentages together.

I would also be surprised if Vandy breaks the 50% mark in the next couple of years considering the vast reduction in biglaw hiring. (If median at Columbia can't cut it, median at Vandy won't cut it either.)

True, but if you could argue T14 = Sticker-approriate then Vandy should most definitely be included viewtopic.php?f=1&t=108528. UVA and Mich may not have been great comparisons except for the atmospheres of the schools, but Vandy is competitive with G-town, Cornell, and NYU according to the 2009 NLJ 250 + 2008 clerkship numbers.

Also, Mich and UVA are clerkship machines, do you have class of 2009 or 2010 clerkship data? The links I've found have all been for class of 2008 which puts Mich (13.9%), UVA (12.4%), and Vandy (7.9%) as far as % of class placed into clerkships.


This year Vandy has already placed 12% in article III clerkships.

fortissimo
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby fortissimo » Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:47 am

missvik218 wrote:
fortissimo wrote:That's pretty flawed reasoning because UVA and Mich put more into clerkships. (I.e. This current year Mich has put more than 20% into clerkships.) You have to look at clerkship + big law percentages together.

I would also be surprised if Vandy breaks the 50% mark in the next couple of years considering the vast reduction in biglaw hiring. (If median at Columbia can't cut it, median at Vandy won't cut it either.)

True, but if you could argue T14 = Sticker-approriate then Vandy should most definitely be included viewtopic.php?f=1&t=108528. UVA and Mich may not have been great comparisons except for the atmospheres of the schools, but Vandy is competitive with G-town, Cornell, and NYU according to the 2009 NLJ 250 + 2008 clerkship numbers.

Also, Mich and UVA are clerkship machines, do you have class of 2009 or 2010 clerkship data? The links I've found have all been for class of 2008 which puts Mich (13.9%), UVA (12.4%), and Vandy (7.9%) as far as % of class placed into clerkships.


That's true. Vanderbilt places better than some Top 14 (cough Georgetown).

They told accepted students the new clerkship placement so far this year at Mich's ASW. I forget what the precise number is, but it's over 20% into Article III (federal) clerkships. I wouldn't be surprised if other schools increased their placement too, given how biglaw is half-dead.

JOThompson
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby JOThompson » Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:01 am

Is Vandy worth sticker for those of us who aren't super interested in biglaw or clerkships? I'm thinking I'd happily pay full price there. My other alternative is a T30 where I'd only owe COL debt.

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tome
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Re: Vandy worth sticker?

Postby tome » Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:12 pm

JOThompson wrote:Is Vandy worth sticker for those of us who aren't super interested in biglaw or clerkships? I'm thinking I'd happily pay full price there. My other alternative is a T30 where I'd only owe COL debt.


It really depends on what you want to do. If you are not that focused on getting a job at a place that is hard to get a job at, then it is probably not a big deal. However, some government jobs and public interest jobs are just as hard to get as biglaw and clerkships. If they are what you are focused on, then I'd go to Vandy if I were you. I am a big Vandy fan though. If I didn't get into Northwestern I think that is where I would have liked to go.




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