LOCI article and samples

(Personal Statement Examples, Advice, Critique, . . . )
ecclaw07
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby ecclaw07 » Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:56 pm

omg wrote:
braun223 wrote:Hey Ken,

In my LOCI to GWU, would a significant scholarship offer to William & Mary be something to mention? For example, "Although I have been offered a significant scholarship at the College of William and Mary Law School, the George Washington University Law School is my first choice because...etc."

Or, are they too far apart in the rankings to be considered peer schools? Also, I will be sending one to Notre Dame, a school closer in ranking.

Thanks.


This is a great question. In general, I've heard conflicting advice about whether we should mention our other acceptances at all. What are people's thoughts?

FWIW, on Michigan's Waitlist FAQ, they specifically say not to. "If you are on our waitlist, we are already well aware that you are an appealing candidate with much to commend you. So telling us that other schools think that will not help your candidacy."

cmontferrat
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby cmontferrat » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:49 pm

Should we sign them with ink or does the print of "sincerely, jane doe" suffice?

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prezidentv8
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby prezidentv8 » Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:00 pm

cmontferrat wrote:Should we sign them with ink or does the print of "sincerely, jane doe" suffice?


I'm thinking that if we, as applicants, enjoy seeing ink of the non-printer variety, adcoms do as well. Probably won't make a difference though.

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broach911
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby broach911 » Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:02 pm

They honestly will most likely not notice but I do feel it adds an extra something when you take the time to sign something (notably in blue ink). Shows you didn't just print it out and throw it in an envelope.

On a side note can anyone look over my LOCI to GW I'm planning on sending it out tomorrow and I would appreciate a read through. I'm willing to trade. PM me if you can.

braun223
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby braun223 » Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:30 pm

omg wrote:
braun223 wrote:Hey Ken,

In my LOCI to GWU, would a significant scholarship offer to William & Mary be something to mention? For example, "Although I have been offered a significant scholarship at the College of William and Mary Law School, the George Washington University Law School is my first choice because...etc."

Or, are they too far apart in the rankings to be considered peer schools? Also, I will be sending one to Notre Dame, a school closer in ranking.

Thanks.


This is a great question. In general, I've heard conflicting advice about whether we should mention our other acceptances at all. What are people's thoughts?



Any other thoughts/opinions?

Dtrain777
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Dtrain777 » Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:57 pm

braun223 wrote:
omg wrote:
braun223 wrote:Hey Ken,

In my LOCI to GWU, would a significant scholarship offer to William & Mary be something to mention? For example, "Although I have been offered a significant scholarship at the College of William and Mary Law School, the George Washington University Law School is my first choice because...etc."

Or, are they too far apart in the rankings to be considered peer schools? Also, I will be sending one to Notre Dame, a school closer in ranking.

Thanks.


This is a great question. In general, I've heard conflicting advice about whether we should mention our other acceptances at all. What are people's thoughts?



Any other thoughts/opinions?


From what I've gathered reading various sites and talking to adcoms, my recommendation would be NOT to include such a statement in a LOCI. While I think that it's always a good idea to try to leverage money from a school you've been accepted to by letting them know what other schools/scholarships you have been awarded, I do not think it is a good idea to write that in a LOCI to get off a WL. Telling them that you have another very strong offer is just more reason for them not to let you in off the WL (even if you told them why you thought GW>W&M w/scholarship). They know you're a good applicant because they chose to WL you and telling them that you have lots of other very strong options doesn't strike me as a good idea. That is my opinion, use it as you will.

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SpAcEmAn SpLiFF
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby SpAcEmAn SpLiFF » Sun Mar 15, 2009 1:19 pm

is it worth it to mention things like personal circumstances that make a school a top choice (ie your family is all moving to boston, or your fiance got a job in atlanta, etc)?

Dtrain777
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Dtrain777 » Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:51 pm

SpAcEmAn SpLiFF wrote:is it worth it to mention things like personal circumstances that make a school a top choice (ie your family is all moving to boston, or your fiance got a job in atlanta, etc)?


definitely let them know it's your top choice but I think when you say why it should be something that has to do with the school (such and such program or the placement in such and such field etc.) rather than just "i'm going to be in that city anyways I might as well go to your school"

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Ken
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Ken » Sun Mar 15, 2009 11:54 pm

Regarding the question of whether the mention the benefits of the law school's location (family, spouses job), this is important when you are conveying that you want to get in to a school that may have wait listed you as a means of yield protection. If you have a 3.8 and 170 and are applying to University of Iowa, they may wait list you anticipating that you are T14 bound. But if you convey that your wife was accepted to the acclaimed U. of Iowa writers workshop for their 2 year program, then the school will quickly let you in as they reason you will choose to attend (as most know, yield protection is done by schools to only admit those students they think will attend and by having a high yield (a high percentage of those accepted choosing to attend), they rise in the USNWR rankings). While no firm evidence is out, I would say that over 1/4 of wait lists are done for yield protection.

If one's being wait listed was not yield protection but because you may be at or just below the median GPA or LSAT, then conveying the draw of the academic program is stronger than mentioning just location. Both reasons can be conveyed, but include more that attracts you then merely locational preference.

In regards to mentioning other law schools, I would not do so if the other law schools are not considered peer schools (writing to a T14 law school of your acceptances to those in the Top 25 is not impressive). Overall, I would stay away from it but perhaps if you were accepted to a higher ranked rival (in at Yale, trying to get in at Harvard or in at Stanford and trying to get in to Berkeley), then it may possibly be effective. But some good advice above seems to indicate that in general stay away from mentioning other acceptances and do so only if they will really impress the admissions committee.

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Bosque
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Bosque » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:54 pm

I just sent out my letter to Stanford, if it is successful (or even if not, I guess) I will send it to you once I have completed my cycle. Thanks for all you do Ken!

EDIT: If anyone is just dying to see it sooner, PM me.
Last edited by Bosque on Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

Dtrain777
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Dtrain777 » Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:29 pm

Bosque wrote:I just sent out my letter to Stanford, if it is successful (or even if not, I guess) I will send it to you once I have completed my cycle. Thanks for all you do Ken!


I have sent out four letters with the intention of writing at least one more. I too am going to wait until my cycle is over before posting them but I will do so for future applicants.

rubies
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby rubies » Thu Mar 19, 2009 12:06 pm

Hey Ken,

I have applied to a JD/MPH dual degree program and have just received my acceptance letter from the School of Public Health. I have been in review for about 2 months at UH Law and am wondering if I should express the significance of the decision letter on my choice of law school. I have been in contact with the assistant dean of admissions who encourages new information that is important.

I don't know if this qualifies as such; what are your opinions?

Thank you!

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jackrabbitjones
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby jackrabbitjones » Sun Mar 29, 2009 3:32 pm

[deleted]

moved here:
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=66226
Last edited by jackrabbitjones on Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

zero1
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby zero1 » Sun Mar 29, 2009 8:17 pm

Bosque wrote:I just sent out my letter to Stanford, if it is successful (or even if not, I guess) I will send it to you once I have completed my cycle. Thanks for all you do Ken!

EDIT: If anyone is just dying to see it sooner, PM me.



Sending it in before receiving a decision?

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Bosque
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Bosque » Sun Mar 29, 2009 8:47 pm

zero1 wrote:
Bosque wrote:I just sent out my letter to Stanford, if it is successful (or even if not, I guess) I will send it to you once I have completed my cycle. Thanks for all you do Ken!

EDIT: If anyone is just dying to see it sooner, PM me.



Sending it in before receiving a decision?


Yup, I did.

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Lily
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Lily » Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:27 pm

This thread might be a good place to pose this question/concern (I apologize if it is not). I am a nontraditional applicant in my early 30s. I have submitted an application to just one school because it is the only school I wish to attend. I am still awaiting review, but I anticipate I may be waitlisted. My trouble is that saying something like "your school is my top choice" in a LOCI rings a bit false, as I am no longer considering any other schools. Rather, when I decided I wanted to attend law school, I considered my options and made my decision at that time. Is it a major Adcomm faux pas to simply express that in my letter?

Of course, they could just accept me outright, and I wouldn't need to concern myself with this. :wink: Any wisdom any of y'all can provide?

Thanks again for all your help, fellow TLSers! This forum has certainly given me an education regarding best practices among law school applicants.

Dtrain777
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Dtrain777 » Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:37 pm

Lily wrote:This thread might be a good place to pose this question/concern (I apologize if it is not). I am a nontraditional applicant in my early 30s. I have submitted an application to just one school because it is the only school I wish to attend. I am still awaiting review, but I anticipate I may be waitlisted. My trouble is that saying something like "your school is my top choice" in a LOCI rings a bit false, as I am no longer considering any other schools. Rather, when I decided I wanted to attend law school, I considered my options and made my decision at that time. Is it a major Adcomm faux pas to simply express that in my letter?

Of course, they could just accept me outright, and I wouldn't need to concern myself with this. :wink: Any wisdom any of y'all can provide?

Thanks again for all your help, fellow TLSers! This forum has certainly given me an education regarding best practices among law school applicants.

I think if a school is literally your only option you should let them know that they are the only school you're considering and why this is the case. I don't think this is a faux pas and I don't think it would hurt you. If nothing else you're giving them more information to make their job easier, and I think they will really appreciate that. All this is especially true if your numbers are either competitive or overly competitive for the given school.

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Lily
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Lily » Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:41 pm

Dtrain777 wrote:
Lily wrote:This thread might be a good place to pose this question/concern (I apologize if it is not). I am a nontraditional applicant in my early 30s. I have submitted an application to just one school because it is the only school I wish to attend. I am still awaiting review, but I anticipate I may be waitlisted. My trouble is that saying something like "your school is my top choice" in a LOCI rings a bit false, as I am no longer considering any other schools. Rather, when I decided I wanted to attend law school, I considered my options and made my decision at that time. Is it a major Adcomm faux pas to simply express that in my letter?

Of course, they could just accept me outright, and I wouldn't need to concern myself with this. :wink: Any wisdom any of y'all can provide?

Thanks again for all your help, fellow TLSers! This forum has certainly given me an education regarding best practices among law school applicants.

I think if a school is literally your only option you should let them know that they are the only school you're considering and why this is the case. I don't think this is a faux pas and I don't think it would hurt you. If nothing else you're giving them more information to make their job easier, and I think they will really appreciate that. All this is especially true if your numbers are either competitive or overly competitive for the given school.


hehe. Yeah, my numbers are not spectacular. Thanks for the comment! I would like to avoid sounding as if I was simply shortsighted and am desperate to get in. While I would LOVE to attend this year and feel it is the right time, I am fine with continuing to work and reapplying next cycle.

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Ken
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Ken » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:55 pm

I think there is no harm and only benefits in conveying that a school is your sole choice and convey the reasons why this is the case (ideally it is not simply because the law school is nearby and convenient).

Jackrabbit, you will want to wait until you actually get your final grades before sending the LOCI.

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tudo ben
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby tudo ben » Tue Mar 31, 2009 3:06 pm

Ken, great site and thanks for all the helpful information. LOCI question for anyone with thoughts:

In writing a LOCI to a school that actually isn't your top choice and that you would not definitely attend if accepted (but might as well try), how do we feel about language like "XXX school is among my top choices" and "I will very likely accept an offer of admission if one is granted", etc. Does this hurt? Is it overly obvious that you're being careful to not commit and speak in definites? I used much stronger language in my LOCI to my top choice, but for honesty and ethical reasons I feel like I should soften it when writing to my non-top choice WL's.

Thanks!

legendairy
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby legendairy » Thu Apr 02, 2009 1:42 am

Thank you SO much for this post. I just got wait listed for UC Davis and was utterly clueless about what the protocol was - this is an excellent start. :)

lbthomps
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby lbthomps » Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:45 pm

I got a waitlist letter from the University of Arizona yesterday. I really want to attend and I need to complete the form they sent by May 15 to stay on the list. My question is should I include my LOCI and LOR in the same letter confirming I would like to be on the waitlist or should I send them separately? I was going to send everything together but I wanted to get some opinions.

Dtrain777
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby Dtrain777 » Sat Apr 04, 2009 12:25 am

lbthomps wrote:I got a waitlist letter from the University of Arizona yesterday. I really want to attend and I need to complete the form they sent by May 15 to stay on the list. My question is should I include my LOCI and LOR in the same letter confirming I would like to be on the waitlist or should I send them separately? I was going to send everything together but I wanted to get some opinions.

My suggestion would be to send the form in now and then send the LOCI and LOR in a week or two.

lbthomps
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby lbthomps » Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:46 pm

Thanks! I sent in my form to stay on the waitlist.

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lucydog
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Re: LOCI article and samples

Postby lucydog » Mon Apr 06, 2009 12:56 am

tudo ben wrote:Ken, great site and thanks for all the helpful information. LOCI question for anyone with thoughts:

In writing a LOCI to a school that actually isn't your top choice and that you would not definitely attend if accepted (but might as well try), how do we feel about language like "XXX school is among my top choices" and "I will very likely accept an offer of admission if one is granted", etc. Does this hurt? Is it overly obvious that you're being careful to not commit and speak in definites? I used much stronger language in my LOCI to my top choice, but for honesty and ethical reasons I feel like I should soften it when writing to my non-top choice WL's.

Thanks!


That is the language that I used for non-first choice LOCI's. Plus, every year schools get a ton of people sending them LOCI with the first choice proclamation, only to change their minds as time goes on and back out when they are extended an offer, so I don't know how much a difference "first choice" vs. "one of my top choices" will make.

Also, while discussing LOCI language tweaks. I think there is a big difference between telling a school they are your top choice, and telling them you will matriculate if offered admission. The former is just your opinion, while the latter seems to burden you with an ethical obligation.




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