How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

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timshellaw
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How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby timshellaw » Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:12 pm

Thinking about doing waitlist deferral (M is my top choice) because of an opportunity that arose with a non-profit in a field that relates to my interests. I spoke with Michigan and was told that while it's binding, I can retake the LSAT for scholarship consideration, just no funny business. Within Michigan's numbers I'm a bit below median (LSAT) and above 75th for GPA. I have retakes left and I'm finished with school now. I definitely think I can do much better.

In the crazy chance that I am granted a deferral, how generous is Michigan with merit aid? Would it be worth retaking and hoping for more money or is it silly to tie myself down and hope for money? I've looked at LSN and realize the numbers I'm looking at are pretty high.

Any thoughts?

elcee1987
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby elcee1987 » Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:49 pm

University of Michigan or Michigan State University?

jackbauer10
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby jackbauer10 » Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:58 pm

I feel like we're going to be able to answer this much more accurately if you give us some numbers. Where were you PTing and how many hours a week do you have to study before your retake? If you're already at 75% for GPA, get your LSAT up to 75% and you'll be looking at $$$.

timshellaw
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby timshellaw » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:16 pm

elcee1987 wrote:University of Michigan or Michigan State University?


University of Michigan.

timshellaw
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby timshellaw » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:25 pm

jackbauer10 wrote:I feel like we're going to be able to answer this much more accurately if you give us some numbers. Where were you PTing and how many hours a week do you have to study before your retake? If you're already at 75% for GPA, get your LSAT up to 75% and you'll be looking at $$$.


Thanks!

I was writing my honors thesis/graduating early/working (not a real excuse, but) while I was studying--basically, distracted by life. I postponed from June (crazy summer) to October (1st and only take), had a solid cycle and didn't really feel there was a need to retake until I realized I could get more money (so obvious it hurts).

I started at a cold take 160, improved somewhat but nothing to write home about. I'm a URM. I tutor and have a super flexible schedule. This non-profit opportunity is flexible as well (not a full-time position). I feel I'd be in a good place in the sense that I would still have a chance to attend my top choice school and I have a spouse, so having a year to plan a move would be absolutely helpful.

timshellaw
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby timshellaw » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:30 pm

Also, I was really stupid in my approach and even though I bought a TON of PTs (it's embarrassing how many I have, I also have all the "10 actual" books), I hardly took any. :oops: I did Blueprint and slacked on the homework as well. Hence why I think there's some potential left in my tank.

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jbagelboy
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby jbagelboy » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:42 pm

They are relatively generous but it also seems pretty standardized. Lets say your GPA is 3.8. With a 170, you'll probably get $15-20K. With a 172, $22.5-25K. With a 174, $30K+. I think after that its just Darrow.

I know with some degree of certainty that they stratify aid offers along these lines. They are generally less prone to negotiate with other offers as well, especially from DNCG.

Retake DEFINITELY a good idea for you. studying while in school blows.

Hrun
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby Hrun » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:46 pm

A bit confused. You want to defer your wait list? I thought Michigan didn't do this. What exactly are they telling you? They'll defer you position on the wait list or they will accept you next year?

timshellaw
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby timshellaw » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:50 pm

Hrun wrote:A bit confused. You want to defer your wait list? I thought Michigan didn't do this. What exactly are they telling you? They'll defer you position on the wait list or they will accept you next year?


http://www.law.umich.edu/prospectivestu ... /wait.aspx

If you know you want to defer and enter in a later year, we would encourage you to email us at law.jd.admissions@umich.edu and let us know; we may be able to make you a deferral offer for the next year's entering class. (We typically make about 10 such offers a year.) Please don’t request a deferral unless you feel certain that beginning at Michigan a year from now is your first choice for your legal education; it is our policy that deferral is binding, and because we have a limited number of slots for deferred admission, we necessarily need to get an answer from you in a relatively short amount of time—which means you won’t have a lot of time for a visit or other similar investigation...


To be clear, a deferral offer would be in lieu of an offer for this year's entering class; you cannot receive and accept a deferral offer from us and still continue to be considered for admission this summer or fall—once you have accepted our deferral offer, we would remove you from consideration for this year's class. Please note, too, that if you request a deferral offer, you need to provide us with details of what you plan to do during your deferral year.

timshellaw
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby timshellaw » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:52 pm

jbagelboy wrote:They are relatively generous but it also seems pretty standardized. Lets say your GPA is 3.8. With a 170, you'll probably get $15-20K. With a 172, $22.5-25K. With a 174, $30K+. I think after that its just Darrow.

I know with some degree of certainty that they stratify aid offers along these lines. They are generally less prone to negotiate with other offers as well, especially from DNCG.

Retake DEFINITELY a good idea for you. studying while in school blows.


Thanks I really appreciate this. My GPA is a tiny bit higher than what you listed, so this is great info.

Hrun
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby Hrun » Wed Apr 17, 2013 5:10 pm

timshellaw wrote:
Hrun wrote:A bit confused. You want to defer your wait list? I thought Michigan didn't do this. What exactly are they telling you? They'll defer you position on the wait list or they will accept you next year?


http://www.law.umich.edu/prospectivestu ... /wait.aspx

If you know you want to defer and enter in a later year, we would encourage you to email us at law.jd.admissions@umich.edu and let us know; we may be able to make you a deferral offer for the next year's entering class. (We typically make about 10 such offers a year.) Please don’t request a deferral unless you feel certain that beginning at Michigan a year from now is your first choice for your legal education; it is our policy that deferral is binding, and because we have a limited number of slots for deferred admission, we necessarily need to get an answer from you in a relatively short amount of time—which means you won’t have a lot of time for a visit or other similar investigation...




To be clear, a deferral offer would be in lieu of an offer for this year's entering class; you cannot receive and accept a deferral offer from us and still continue to be considered for admission this summer or fall—once you have accepted our deferral offer, we would remove you from consideration for this year's class. Please note, too, that if you request a deferral offer, you need to provide us with details of what you plan to do during your deferral year.


Wow! I think they changed the language this year. Anyway, if UM is your number one choice and you don't feel confident you'll get in next cycle, defer. My only concern with this option is how likely are they to give you a scholarship when they know Michigan is your only option because you signed a binding agreement. Let's say you scored higher on your LSAT. Technically you've qualified for a merit aid scholarship, which they give out to convince applicants to attend their school versus a competitor's. But you can't apply to a competitor. Will they seriously consider you for money or will they treat you like a EA applicant?

jackbauer10
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby jackbauer10 » Wed Apr 17, 2013 5:44 pm

Hrun wrote:Wow! I think they changed the language this year. Anyway, if UM is your number one choice and you don't feel confident you'll get in next cycle, defer. My only concern with this option is how likely are they to give you a scholarship when they know Michigan is your only option because you signed a binding agreement. Let's say you scored higher on your LSAT. Technically you've qualified for a merit aid scholarship, which they give out to convince applicants to attend their school versus a competitor's. But you can't apply to a competitor. Will they seriously consider you for money or will they treat you like a EA applicant?


Hrun brings up a good point. If money is the big consideration, retake and apply to CCNBVP as well as M. Write a Why Mich if you're worried about YP. Use other school's scholly money to negotiate and then have fun in Ann Arbor :)

timshellaw
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby timshellaw » Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:04 pm

jackbauer10 wrote:
Hrun wrote:Wow! I think they changed the language this year. Anyway, if UM is your number one choice and you don't feel confident you'll get in next cycle, defer. My only concern with this option is how likely are they to give you a scholarship when they know Michigan is your only option because you signed a binding agreement. Let's say you scored higher on your LSAT. Technically you've qualified for a merit aid scholarship, which they give out to convince applicants to attend their school versus a competitor's. But you can't apply to a competitor. Will they seriously consider you for money or will they treat you like a EA applicant?


Hrun brings up a good point. If money is the big consideration, retake and apply to CCNBVP as well as M. Write a Why Mich if you're worried about YP. Use other school's scholly money to negotiate and then have fun in Ann Arbor :)


Thanks!

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intlsplitr
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby intlsplitr » Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:41 pm

Hrun wrote:
timshellaw wrote:
Hrun wrote:A bit confused. You want to defer your wait list? I thought Michigan didn't do this. What exactly are they telling you? They'll defer you position on the wait list or they will accept you next year?


http://www.law.umich.edu/prospectivestu ... /wait.aspx

If you know you want to defer and enter in a later year, we would encourage you to email us at law.jd.admissions@umich.edu and let us know; we may be able to make you a deferral offer for the next year's entering class. (We typically make about 10 such offers a year.) Please don’t request a deferral unless you feel certain that beginning at Michigan a year from now is your first choice for your legal education; it is our policy that deferral is binding, and because we have a limited number of slots for deferred admission, we necessarily need to get an answer from you in a relatively short amount of time—which means you won’t have a lot of time for a visit or other similar investigation...




To be clear, a deferral offer would be in lieu of an offer for this year's entering class; you cannot receive and accept a deferral offer from us and still continue to be considered for admission this summer or fall—once you have accepted our deferral offer, we would remove you from consideration for this year's class. Please note, too, that if you request a deferral offer, you need to provide us with details of what you plan to do during your deferral year.


Wow! I think they changed the language this year. Anyway, if UM is your number one choice and you don't feel confident you'll get in next cycle, defer. My only concern with this option is how likely are they to give you a scholarship when they know Michigan is your only option because you signed a binding agreement. Let's say you scored higher on your LSAT. Technically you've qualified for a merit aid scholarship, which they give out to convince applicants to attend their school versus a competitor's. But you can't apply to a competitor. Will they seriously consider you for money or will they treat you like a EA applicant?


This. They have no reason to give away merit money to someone who signed a binding agreement. I would be extremely hesitant about retaking with the expectation that they will give you merit after a deferral. I think you would be best to stay on the waitlist, retake in June, and then try to use that for leverage off the WL.

If you kill the June LSAT you should probably reapply to YHS on down. It sounds like you aren't too fussed about a year off.

qwertyboard
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby qwertyboard » Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:13 pm

Don't rely on need-based aid unless you are living under an old carton box....

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jrthor10
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby jrthor10 » Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:07 am

Michigan's aid is standardized. I was a WL applicant last year and I applied for a deferral. I received the same aid as I would have had I been admitted last year. Hope this helps.

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calverna
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby calverna » Fri May 03, 2013 8:19 am

jrthor10 wrote:Michigan's aid is standardized. I was a WL applicant last year and I applied for a deferral. I received the same aid as I would have had I been admitted last year. Hope this helps.


This.

You are not considered any differently for merit aid simply because you deferred, although you lose the ability to negotiate using competing offers (since you won't have any).

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dsn32
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Re: How generous is Michigan (aside from Darrow)?

Postby dsn32 » Sat May 18, 2013 10:16 am

I would be shocked if they gave you any money at all if you deferred and signed the binding agreement with no aid offer in hand. They are extremely stingy when it comes to negotiating from an initial offer (in my experience, but many others as well). I think the TCR is retake and reapply.




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