Black Canadian?

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
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John_rizzy_rawls
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby John_rizzy_rawls » Wed May 29, 2013 5:49 pm

Again...

Debating AA in the on-topics is not okay, there's a thread for that.

Knock it off.

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soj
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby soj » Wed May 29, 2013 6:41 pm

as rizzy said, you can discuss how AA works but you can't discuss how AA should work. take that to the AA debate thread in the lounge where your opinion can get the attention it deserves (none).

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thefuturenow
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby thefuturenow » Wed May 29, 2013 6:50 pm

Ded Precedent wrote:Flame.


Ded Abe called it. Obvious flame.

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bosmer88
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby bosmer88 » Wed May 29, 2013 7:22 pm

soj wrote:Call me cynical, but there's nothing law schools care less about than redressing past racial wrongs. They care about statistical or visible diversity. Black Canadians do get the URM bump. I don't know about Canadian First Nations because they so rarely apply to US law schools, but I would guess they get the bump, too.


I get that they care about visible diversity, but I think they will split hairs on a Black Canadian versus an African American. If we are talking about a Jamaican American versus African American, I agree with you in that they won't split hairs and that visible diversity is all that matters.

As I understood it, the bump benefits US Citizens/Residents, not international students. For the purposes of the bump, when the word Black is included on the application, it is referring to people (US citizens and residents) of African descent who do not identify as African American (West Indians, Afro-Latinos, Africans, some Pacific Islanders groups, etc). I really think a lot of people forget that African American and Black are not necessarily interchangeable. African American refers to a specific ethnic group in the US (ie generally those who are descended from Africans brought over to the US for the purposes of slavery) which AA was intended for, but this policy also came to encapsulate all Black people living in the US as a whole. Again, these are my thoughts on the matter.

I remember reading a very intriguing article in the NYT when I was applying to UG about adcomms wringing their hands over the issue of whether AA was serving the black populations it was intended to serve. The article raised the issue of whether it was problematic that the children of West Indian immigrants and African immigrants seemed to be reaping the benefits of AA at the expense of a lower number of African Americans (as I defined above) enrolled in colleges. This is something that has been brought up at the UG level, so it might be possible that adcomms at the graduate level are aware of this issue as well.

edit.
Last edited by bosmer88 on Wed May 29, 2013 8:21 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Emma.
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Emma. » Wed May 29, 2013 7:42 pm

There isn't some set "URM bump" that is automatically applied to all URMs of x or y ethnicity. It isn't an all or nothing proposition. Black males probably get more favorable treatment than black females, for instance. OP's application will almost certainly get some favorable treatment, but there's a good chance it won't be quite the same as if s/he were AA.

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ManoftheHour
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby ManoftheHour » Wed May 29, 2013 8:00 pm

bosmer88 wrote:
soj wrote:Call me cynical, but there's nothing law schools care less about than redressing past racial wrongs. They care about statistical or visible diversity. Black Canadians do get the URM bump. I don't know about Canadian First Nations because they so rarely apply to US law schools, but I would guess they get the bump, too.


I get that they care about visible diversity, but I think they will split hairs on a Black Canadian versus an African American. If we are talking about a Jamaican American versus African American, I agree with you in that they won't split hairs and that visible diversity is all that matters.

As I understood it, the bump benefits US Citizens/Residents, not international students. For the purposes of the bump, when the word Black is included on the application, it is referring to people (US citizens and residents) of African descent who do not identify as African American (West Indians, Afro-Latinos, Africans, some Pacific Islanders groups, etc). I really think a lot of people forget that African American and Black are not necessarily interchangeable. African American refers to a specific ethnic group in the US (ie generally those who are descended from Africans brought over to the US for the purposes of slavery) which AA was intended for, but this policy also came to encapsulate all Black people living in the US as a whole. Again, these are my thoughts on the matter.

I remember reading a very intriguing article in the NYT when I was applying to UG about adcomms committees wringing their hands over the issue of whether AA was serving the black populations it was intended to serve. The article raised the issue of whether it was problematic that the children of West Indian immigrants and African immigrants seemed to be reaping the benefits of AA at the expense of a lower number of African Americans (as I defined above) enrolled in colleges. This is something that has been brought up at the UG level, so it might be possible that adcomms at the graduate level are aware of this issue as well.


That's essentially what I was trying to say. Those guys that can't read got all over my back. Talking about Spain and the Chinese? Wtf...

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bosmer88
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby bosmer88 » Wed May 29, 2013 8:04 pm

ManoftheHour wrote:That's essentially what I was trying to say. Those guys that can't read got all over my back. Talking about Spain and the Chinese? Wtf...


I agreed with what you wrote earlier. Made sense to me.

Xixak
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Xixak » Thu May 30, 2013 10:14 am

I'm not a troll, and thanks a lot to the people who came in and gave me honest answers.

This is going to affect where I spend money to apply to next fall (2014), so thanks for the help.

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BruceWayne
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby BruceWayne » Thu May 30, 2013 10:35 am

OP JohnRizzy gave you the answer you need. Like he said, a lot of the other posts in here are stunningly inaccurate. You will definitely get the URM boost. With your 3.6 GPA you will only need something like a 166 to have a chance at Harvard. As long as you score in the 160s you will definitely get into a top 14 school.

Xixak
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Xixak » Thu May 30, 2013 10:51 am

BruceWayne wrote:OP JohnRizzy gave you the answer you need. Like he said, a lot of the other posts in here are stunningly inaccurate. You will definitely get the URM boost. With your 3.6 GPA you will only need something like a 166 to have a chance at Harvard. As long as you score in the 160s you will definitely get into a top 14 school.


I'm just curious how you guys know for sure though? Are there statistics that I can look at or maybe a report on it?

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thatdude222
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby thatdude222 » Thu May 30, 2013 11:31 am

Xixak wrote: I'm just curious how you guys know for sure though? Are there statistics that I can look at or maybe a report on it?


To get an idea, you can take a look at lawschoolnumbers.com and do a search for black/underrepresented minority applicants during recent admissions cycles with a similar combination gpa/lsat score and see where they were admitted. Of course, this information is all self-reported and is only a sample of applicants, but it will give you a rough idea of what schools you have a chance of being admitted to.

Xixak
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Xixak » Thu May 30, 2013 11:40 am

thatdude222 wrote:
Xixak wrote: I'm just curious how you guys know for sure though? Are there statistics that I can look at or maybe a report on it?


To get an idea, you can take a look at lawschoolnumbers.com and do a search for black/underrepresented minority applicants during recent admissions cycles with a similar combination gpa/lsat score and see where they were admitted. Of course, this information is all self-reported and is only a sample of applicants, but it will give you a rough idea of what schools you have a chance of being admitted to.


Sorry I meant how do you guys know that black Canadians are considered URMs?

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bosmer88
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby bosmer88 » Thu May 30, 2013 3:30 pm

I had a long answer but I really don't want to argue with anyone.

OP, my advice is get the highest score that you can on the LSAT. Don't just settle for getting something around 166.
Last edited by bosmer88 on Thu May 30, 2013 3:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Xixak
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Xixak » Thu May 30, 2013 3:41 pm

So much damn misinformation, can I just get a PROVEN answer from SOMEBODY please? I have no idea what to think any more.

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Emma.
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Emma. » Thu May 30, 2013 4:16 pm

Xixak wrote:So much damn misinformation, can I just get a PROVEN answer from SOMEBODY please? I have no idea what to think any more.


There is no proven answer. Put together the best applications you can. Apply broadly. Your app will probably receive more favorable treatment than a white applicant, but no one can tell you for sure whether every school will treat it this way, or how much of a "boost" you will get.

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Br3v
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Br3v » Thu May 30, 2013 4:31 pm

Emma. wrote:
Xixak wrote:So much damn misinformation, can I just get a PROVEN answer from SOMEBODY please? I have no idea what to think any more.


There is no proven answer. Put together the best applications you can. Apply broadly. Your app will probably receive more favorable treatment than a white applicant, but no one can tell you for sure whether every school will treat it this way, or how much of a "boost" you will get.


For real. Put together an application like you don't expect to get an extra benefit, if you end up getting it then your golden, if you don't then you have the best app you would have anyways.

Why be so obsessed with how low you can set your bar an get away with it?

Xixak
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Xixak » Thu May 30, 2013 11:30 pm

Br3v wrote:
Emma. wrote:
Xixak wrote:So much damn misinformation, can I just get a PROVEN answer from SOMEBODY please? I have no idea what to think any more.


There is no proven answer. Put together the best applications you can. Apply broadly. Your app will probably receive more favorable treatment than a white applicant, but no one can tell you for sure whether every school will treat it this way, or how much of a "boost" you will get.


For real. Put together an application like you don't expect to get an extra benefit, if you end up getting it then your golden, if you don't then you have the best app you would have anyways.

Why be so obsessed with how low you can set your bar an get away with it?


I'm not obsessed with how low I can set the bar, I'm aiming for a 180 on the LSAT.

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Br3v
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Br3v » Thu May 30, 2013 11:35 pm

Xixak wrote:
Br3v wrote:
Emma. wrote:
Xixak wrote:So much damn misinformation, can I just get a PROVEN answer from SOMEBODY please? I have no idea what to think any more.


There is no proven answer. Put together the best applications you can. Apply broadly. Your app will probably receive more favorable treatment than a white applicant, but no one can tell you for sure whether every school will treat it this way, or how much of a "boost" you will get.


For real. Put together an application like you don't expect to get an extra benefit, if you end up getting it then your golden, if you don't then you have the best app you would have anyways.

Why be so obsessed with how low you can set your bar an get away with it?


I'm not obsessed with how low I can set the bar, I'm aiming for a 180 on the LSAT.


Good then don't forget it.

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John_rizzy_rawls
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby John_rizzy_rawls » Thu May 30, 2013 11:38 pm

You've gotten the right answer 10 times. You are the Black in the Black/African American box distinction.

Go high as score as possible on the LSAT, don't let the "boost" make you complacent at all.

Xixak
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Xixak » Fri May 31, 2013 10:03 am

John_rizzy_rawls wrote:You've gotten the right answer 10 times. You are the Black in the Black/African American box distinction.

Go high as score as possible on the LSAT, don't let the "boost" make you complacent at all.


Will do. I just wanted to know, I plan to do my best on the LSAT regardless of my status.

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TatNurner
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby TatNurner » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:08 am

Interesting perspectives.
Last edited by TatNurner on Fri Aug 02, 2013 5:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

indo
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby indo » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:30 am

John_rizzy_rawls wrote:You've gotten the right answer 10 times. You are the Black in the Black/African American box distinction.

Go high as score as possible on the LSAT, don't let the "boost" make you complacent at all.


+1

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jurisprudence101
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby jurisprudence101 » Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:09 pm

So I take it that the general consensus is "as long as you tick the box" there will be some sort of boost? US citizenship isn't required? Fellow black Canadian here as well who is debating whether or not its worth it to apply to certain schools, thanks for the replies so far!

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Dr. Dre
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Dr. Dre » Thu Jun 06, 2013 8:57 am

Mr. Rawls for mod 2014.

Xixak
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Re: Black Canadian?

Postby Xixak » Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:10 pm

Dr. Dre wrote:Mr. Rawls for mod 2014.


Lol.




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