AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
howardbeach
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AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby howardbeach » Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:08 am

Chance me? Any shot at top 20? GW? WUSTL?

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PDaddy
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby PDaddy » Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:46 am

howardbeach wrote:Chance me? Any shot at top 20? GW? WUSTL?


You are an AA male and gay, plus a splitter. You're in the 99th percentile for AA LSAT takers, but your GPA could cause some concern. Read this book to get some perspective on where you should consider applying (See P. 14 especially):

http://www.onbeingablacklawyer.com/obab ... x.html#/1/

keep in mind that there are a few non-top-20 schools that actually give you a better chance of achieving all-around success in your law career than do a few of the top-20 schools.

What happened to lower your GPA? Were you just bored or did you work full-time? Were you Ill? What are your softs and W.E.? Can you get strong LOR's?
Last edited by PDaddy on Sat Nov 03, 2012 3:05 am, edited 3 times in total.

howardbeach
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby howardbeach » Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:58 am

I graduated from a top 50 UG where I majored in a field they were ranked in the top 5 for, so a prestigious degree from an overall good institution.

Low grades were due to incredibly difficult family circumstances. I commuted back and forth to school (~5 hours) on weekends to help out with a failing family business and worked close to full time during the week to pay for school. Luckily, my work experience during school was with an internationally recognized organization where I worked as a full time, paid intern. After graduation, I got a great job at an equally awesome institution in NYC where I live now.

Soft factors: black, lgbt, low income family, first generation college grad, excellent work experience

I'll be able to get great letters of recommendation from supervisors and professors with whom I was close.

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PDaddy
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby PDaddy » Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:06 am

If all of the above is true, you are still in pretty good shape. Can you have a professor for whom you performed well write a letter detailing your struggles? Can one of your counselors or employers do it? If not, can you have a professor for whom you struggled do so?

If he/she knows about your struggles, he/she can say that you would have done better if not for these struggles. Added to a 164, you should be able to raise some eyebrows. Aside from your GPA, your only "weakness" appears to be lack of community service, but you worked during UG and achieved great success therein, so even that isn't going to hurt you.

Take a look at the book I recommended above: The Black Student's Guide to Law School. It's new and is specifically designed to aid black law school applicants. It has gotten very good reviews so far.

Note: Above, I advised you to pay close attention to P. 25 when I meant P. 14. See also PP. 30-46 and look at the 25/75% for each school.

Obviously the numbers won't apply as much to URM splitters. You should blanket the top-50 with most of your applications concentrated at #15-40. Wisconsin, W & L and North Carolina are great schools for African-Americans, and they are well-respected by recruiters.

They also have surprising reach into big markets (Chicago, NY and Charlotte, respectively). If you are interested in WUSTL, you must be considering the Chicago market. The U-Wisconsin can get you there just as easily.

Do apply to one or two top-10's, such as UVA, Northwestern, Duke, Cornell. If you want to take a shot at two of HYS, go ahead and do it. All they can do is say no. Also apply to a few #40-50, such as Maryland and Temple.

Found something equally helpful. Read it closely, and you will understand just what a rock star that 164 makes you. A 160/3.3 AA male can get into top-10 school, so a 164/2.3 student might still have a shot at a top-10.

You are going to love this:

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=195443

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PickledPanda
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby PickledPanda » Sat Nov 03, 2012 9:51 pm

PDaddy wrote:If all of the above is true, you are still in pretty good shape. Can you have a professor for whom you performed well write a letter detailing your struggles? Can one of your counselors or employers do it? If not, can you have a professor for whom you struggled do so?

If he/she knows about your struggles, he/she can say that you would have done better if not for these struggles. Added to a 164, you should be able to raise some eyebrows. Aside from your GPA, your only "weakness" appears to be lack of community service, but you worked during UG and achieved great success therein, so even that isn't going to hurt you.

Take a look at the book I recommended above: The Black Student's Guide to Law School. It's new and is specifically designed to aid black law school applicants. It has gotten very good reviews so far.

Note: Above, I advised you to pay close attention to P. 25 when I meant P. 14. See also PP. 30-46 and look at the 25/75% for each school.

Obviously the numbers won't apply as much to URM splitters. You should blanket the top-50 with most of your applications concentrated at #15-40. Wisconsin, W & L and North Carolina are great schools for African-Americans, and they are well-respected by recruiters.

They also have surprising reach into big markets (Chicago, NY and Charlotte, respectively). If you are interested in WUSTL, you must be considering the Chicago market. The U-Wisconsin can get you there just as easily.

Do apply toone or two top-10's, such as UVA, Northwestern, Duke, Cornell. If you want to take a shot at two of HYS, go ahead and do it. All they can do is say no. Also apply to a few #40-50, such as Maryland and Temple.

Found something equally helpful. Read it closely, and you will understand just what a rock star that 164 makes you[b][/b]. A 160/3.3 AA male can get into top-10 school, so a 164/2.3 student might still have a shot at a top-10.

You are going to love this:

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=195443


Do not blanket most of the top 15-50, that is absurd. ABSURD. That wastes your time, and the adcomms time while trying up resources on both ends. Instead consider the employment numbers on the ABA's website in regions you are willing to work in. Select 5-6 of those schools as safeties, then apply to the top 7-15 (16 If you like TX/UCLA/USC). I will say this, Yale and Stanford would be an absolute waste, and Harvard is probably a .000001% chance.

The LGBT boost is minimal soft, but the AA male is huge. The other softs are pretty nice.

howardbeach
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby howardbeach » Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:38 pm

Wow I'm so surprised by these responses. I was sure I was going to get a slew of negativity. I was considering ED'ing to GW but now I'm not as sure. I'm also a Virginia resident. Is UVA a possibility maybe? Would I stand to get any money anywhere? WUSTL? Indiana? T-30 down?

Thanks so much for the help, guys (or girls)!

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PickledPanda
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby PickledPanda » Sun Nov 04, 2012 12:04 am

howardbeach wrote:Wow I'm so surprised by these responses. I was sure I was going to get a slew of negativity. I was considering ED'ing to GW but now I'm not as sure. I'm also a Virginia resident. Is UVA a possibility maybe? Would I stand to get any money anywhere? WUSTL? Indiana? T-30 down?

Thanks so much for the help, guys (or girls)!


I would probably ED. This is your surest shot. You won't get much, if any, aid. But, it should give you a great shot at UVA.

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PDaddy
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby PDaddy » Sun Dec 30, 2012 6:57 pm

PickledPanda wrote:
PDaddy wrote:If all of the above is true, you are still in pretty good shape. Can you have a professor for whom you performed well write a letter detailing your struggles? Can one of your counselors or employers do it? If not, can you have a professor for whom you struggled do so?

If he/she knows about your struggles, he/she can say that you would have done better if not for these struggles. Added to a 164, you should be able to raise some eyebrows. Aside from your GPA, your only "weakness" appears to be lack of community service, but you worked during UG and achieved great success therein, so even that isn't going to hurt you.

Take a look at the book I recommended above: The Black Student's Guide to Law School. It's new and is specifically designed to aid black law school applicants. It has gotten very good reviews so far.

Note: Above, I advised you to pay close attention to P. 25 when I meant P. 14. See also PP. 30-46 and look at the 25/75% for each school.

Obviously the numbers won't apply as much to URM splitters. You should blanket the top-50 with most of your applications concentrated at #15-40. Wisconsin, W & L and North Carolina are great schools for African-Americans, and they are well-respected by recruiters.

They also have surprising reach into big markets (Chicago, NY and Charlotte, respectively). If you are interested in WUSTL, you must be considering the Chicago market. The U-Wisconsin can get you there just as easily.

Do apply toone or two top-10's, such as UVA, Northwestern, Duke, Cornell. If you want to take a shot at two of HYS, go ahead and do it. All they can do is say no. Also apply to a few #40-50, such as Maryland and Temple.

Found something equally helpful. Read it closely, and you will understand just what a rock star that 164 makes you[b][/b]. A 160/3.3 AA male can get into top-10 school, so a 164/2.3 student might still have a shot at a top-10.

You are going to love this:

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=195443


Do not "blanket" most of the top 15-50, that is absurd. ABSURD.

That wastes your time, and the adcomms time while trying up resources on both ends. Instead consider the employment numbers on the ABA's website in regions you are willing to work in. Select 5-6 of those schools as safeties, then apply to the top 7-15 (16 If you like TX/UCLA/USC). I will say this, Yale and Stanford would be an absolute waste, and Harvard is probably a .000001% chance.

The LGBT boost is minimal soft, but the AA male is huge. The other softs are pretty nice.


You are correct, to the extent that my choice of the word "blanket" is poor. I do NOT mean to convey that OP should apply to every top-50 school. I have actually counseled successful applicants for several years now, and my advice is sound.

Instead of using the word "blanket", I should have said "apply throughout", but that's the only mistake. I mean that OP should put in at least two or three apps in each batch of ten within the top-50. He needs to put out 20-25 applications, putting care into all of them. He should apply to half of the top-50. That's the way he will maximize his chances.

If you think OP shouldn't take a shot at two or three top-10's, you are sadly mistaken. Nothing I said is "absurd", except if you take the word "blanket" too literally. He will have a shot at a top-10 if he packages his apps correctly. As someone said above, OP should probably concentrate his top-10 efforts on the lower top-10 (UVA, NU Law, Duke, etc.), but he has a shot.
Last edited by PDaddy on Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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presh
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby presh » Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:02 pm

.
Last edited by presh on Thu Dec 31, 2015 6:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

howardbeach
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby howardbeach » Mon Mar 25, 2013 2:17 am

I really enjoy ~the law~. My current job is with a great institution but the work is menial/not stimulating and I'm not particularly fond of New York. The job also pays ~50k and I'd like to think that I'm a special snowflake and can get a high paying job at a firm if I work really hard in law school.

I know that sounds naive. For what it's worth, I didn't apply this cycle. I'm taking a prep course and trying to break a 170 on the June LSAT.

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Clearly
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby Clearly » Mon Mar 25, 2013 2:34 am

No idea on chances, but you're gonna have one hell of a diversity statement! Lol; good luck!

alex.feuerman
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby alex.feuerman » Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:27 am

Just apply to all T20. You might be surprised, with your stats you could get in some crazy places and be rejected by some other crazy places.
You *most likely* have no chance whatsoever at HYS, but I'd apply everywhere else. Don't let people tell you you're wasting your money. You never know. Get fee waivers.

I would not advise going to LS unless T20. You have a nice job, don't give it up. Retake.

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GW1010
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby GW1010 » Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:36 pm

Good to see fellow black LGBT scoring well on the LSAT! :) Unfortunately that GPA is brutal...I know how valuable AA's with 160+'s can be for T-14 schools, but they're going to pass on you with that 2.3. TBH you don't have a shot at UVA or anything higher than that, but I do think you could have a chance at Georgetown. If you look at the top 20 schools, Georgetown and GWU have the lowest GPA ranges. It's going to be risky, but because your LSAT is in line with GWU's median for all students, you could apply ED to Georgetown and regular decision to GWU and others. Alternatively, you can keep working an apply to Georgetown's part time program which I believe is the top ranked in the country and is more lenient in their admissions than the full-time program. Good luck, I'm rooting for you!

PRgradBYU
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby PRgradBYU » Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:45 pm

howardbeach wrote:I really enjoy ~the law~. My current job is with a great institution but the work is menial/not stimulating and I'm not particularly fond of New York. The job also pays ~50k and I'd like to think that I'm a special snowflake and can get a high paying job at a firm if I work really hard in law school.

I know that sounds naive. For what it's worth, I didn't apply this cycle. I'm taking a prep course and trying to break a 170 on the June LSAT.


If you break 170, you're going to have an (unpredictably) awesome cycle. Just sayin'.

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romothesavior
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby romothesavior » Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:56 pm

Where are you from and where do you want to practice?

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BerkeleyBear
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Re: AA Male 2.3, 164 (and gay!)

Postby BerkeleyBear » Tue Mar 26, 2013 4:08 pm

.




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