Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
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Br3v
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby Br3v » Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:24 am

AssumptionRequired wrote:
richalvarez wrote:
Rawlberto wrote:^^^
You need to retake.


Thanks, but can I get a little reasoning. Do you believe USC or UCLA would be possible with my GPA and record, assuming I improve my LSAT score. What score do you believe I would need given my circumstances? I'm really trying to debate if it makes sense to devote the time to retake.


No but you could shoot for USD. That below 3.0 GPA is going to kill you. If you break 170 you might have a chance at UCLA


OP has a 172?

AriGoldButNicer
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby AriGoldButNicer » Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:30 am

I think being urm will help a lot. People are forgetting how few urm's break a 170. For schools with no floor you're a great investment--raise lsat median, count as urm and median wise a 2.7 is the same as 3.1 or 3.2. However schools do have floors, and in the past ur test scores were poor predictors of performance (sat and ivy college). If your ps can be about something post college indicative of maturity then maybe they'd overlook this. This soumds weird but I found I outperformed my stats at schools (got $ with boarderline admit numbers) where the admission dean and I on paper had stuff in common (college major, similar family background and struggles, etc.) Are there any schools with spanish deans in the top 14? I know it is a totally fair process but people can have a soft spot towards those that remind them of themselves.

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bk1
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby bk1 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:57 am

AriGoldButNicer wrote:I think being urm will help a lot. People are forgetting how few urm's break a 170. For schools with no floor you're a great investment--raise lsat median, count as urm and median wise a 2.7 is the same as 3.1 or 3.2. However schools do have floors


This seems logical, but it isn't how schools look at it. Your second statement is correct. Schools have floors and it doesn't matter if a 2.7 and 3.1 affect their median the same way, they still aren't going to take the 2.7 if they don't take sub3's.

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bk1
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby bk1 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:59 am

AssumptionRequired wrote:
richalvarez wrote:
Rawlberto wrote:^^^
You need to retake.


Thanks, but can I get a little reasoning. Do you believe USC or UCLA would be possible with my GPA and record, assuming I improve my LSAT score. What score do you believe I would need given my circumstances? I'm really trying to debate if it makes sense to devote the time to retake.


No but you could shoot for USD. That below 3.0 GPA is going to kill you. If you break 170 you might have a chance at UCLA


USC and UCLA are virtually impossible with a sub3 GPA (even for a 180 URM) and USD is not worth attending.

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SublimeStyle
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby SublimeStyle » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:19 pm

bk1 wrote:
AriGoldButNicer wrote:I think being urm will help a lot. People are forgetting how few urm's break a 170. For schools with no floor you're a great investment--raise lsat median, count as urm and median wise a 2.7 is the same as 3.1 or 3.2. However schools do have floors


This seems logical, but it isn't how schools look at it. Your second statement is correct. Schools have floors and it doesn't matter if a 2.7 and 3.1 affect their median the same way, they still aren't going to take the 2.7 if they don't take sub3's.


This does make sense, but I'm wondering if the pretty substantial decrease in applications will soften some of those floors up a bit. Maybe NYU wasn't taking sub 3s in 2009 but are they still going to enforce it that strictly in 2012?

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bk1
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby bk1 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:24 pm

SublimeStyle wrote:This does make sense, but I'm wondering if the pretty substantial decrease in applications will soften some of those floors up a bit. Maybe NYU wasn't taking sub 3s in 2009 but are they still going to enforce it that strictly in 2012?


They might, they might not. It's pretty hard to tell. I'd imagine they are more likely to enforce it than not, but that's just my personal opinion.

The issue with shooting for NYU (especially if you ED there or choose not to ED elsewhere) is that you are gambling. As a sub3, even URM, there is a definite chance you might not get any T14. ED'ing somewhere else (e.g. UVA/NU/GULC) is more likely to solidify your chances of landing a T14 than if you held your ED out for NYU. Then it comes down to the question of whether it is worth the risk of not getting any T14 to increase your chances at NYU (which is primarily about how much better NYU is than the lower T14). Personally I don't think that NYU is better enough than the lower T14 to justify increasing your chances of striking out altogether. Which is why I would err on the side of caution and ED to a lower T14 (specifically NU since they are the most lenient to sub3's, assuming work experience) rather than NYU.

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JoeMo
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby JoeMo » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:32 pm

crumpetsandtea wrote:FWIW, I am a 2.8/176 non-URM splitter and I've gotten into GULC and NU, WL at UVa, and out at Michigan. Since you're URM your cycle will be undoubtedly better than mine, so I think you're pretty much T14 secure.

If you have a favorite T10 school (ie, Michigan/UVa/Penn/Boalt), then ED there to be sure of getting in. Otherwise, I'd say take your chances and blanket the T14.


Don't ED to Boalt, they are known to be GPA whores. Someone might have already said that but just wanted to make you aware. ED to UVA would probably give you the best chance but I'm with whoever said ED to where you really really want to go and blanket the rest of the T14 and someone should bite. Also, I hope you have waivers because blanketing can get really expensive.

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JoeMo
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby JoeMo » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:40 pm

Hey all, I don't know the answer but does it make a difference that OP is an engineering major? I thought it did and wouldn't that make him comparable to a 3.0/172 (1 try mind you) and thus could probably get into most of the T14?

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bk1
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby bk1 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:42 pm

JoeMo wrote:Hey all, I don't know the answer but does it make a difference that OP is an engineering major? I thought it did and wouldn't that make him comparable to a 3.0/172 (1 try mind you) and thus could probably get into most of the T14?


Nothing stops a sub3 from being anything but a sub3.

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bk1
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby bk1 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:45 pm

JoeMo wrote:Don't ED to Boalt, they are known to be GPA whores. Someone might have already said that but just wanted to make you aware. ED to UVA would probably give you the best chance but I'm with whoever said ED to where you really really want to go and blanket the rest of the T14 and someone should bite. Also, I hope you have waivers because blanketing can get really expensive.


IMO, this is folly. The opinion that "one should bite" while true, is obviously no guarantee. When sub3's, even URM's, get 1 T14 (maybe 2 if they are URM) acceptances at best it is easy to see that things could have gone the other way and that they got 0. I think it is best for sub3's to use their ED's tactically rather than just shooting for the T14 preference when the lower T14 are basically fungible.

UVA is the most likely to bite on actual ED. NU is the most likely to give a regular acceptance. That being said, I think there is an argument for ED'ing NU because even if you likely won't get the ED scholly package, I'd imagine that ED'ing ingratiates you to the adcomms and makes them more likely to accept you once they defer you from ED to RD.

tennisking88
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby tennisking88 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:50 pm

Boalt does not offer ED

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SublimeStyle
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby SublimeStyle » Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:03 pm

bk1 wrote:
JoeMo wrote:Don't ED to Boalt, they are known to be GPA whores. Someone might have already said that but just wanted to make you aware. ED to UVA would probably give you the best chance but I'm with whoever said ED to where you really really want to go and blanket the rest of the T14 and someone should bite. Also, I hope you have waivers because blanketing can get really expensive.


IMO, this is folly. The opinion that "one should bite" while true, is obviously no guarantee. When sub3's, even URM's, get 1 T14 (maybe 2 if they are URM) acceptances at best it is easy to see that things could have gone the other way and that they got 0. I think it is best for sub3's to use their ED's tactically rather than just shooting for the T14 preference when the lower T14 are basically fungible.

UVA is the most likely to bite on actual ED. NU is the most likely to give a regular acceptance. That being said, I think there is an argument for ED'ing NU because even if you likely won't get the ED scholly package, I'd imagine that ED'ing ingratiates you to the adcomms and makes them more likely to accept you once they defer you from ED to RD.


I think I'll regular apply to NYU, ED to UVA, and if they waitlist me then hopefully I'll have time to ED to NU. Either way, I wouldn't mind going to any of those three. Also, would having my undergrad from Cornell give me any advantage whatsoever of getting into Cornell Law?

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JoeMo
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby JoeMo » Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:22 pm

SublimeStyle wrote:
bk1 wrote:
JoeMo wrote:Don't ED to Boalt, they are known to be GPA whores. Someone might have already said that but just wanted to make you aware. ED to UVA would probably give you the best chance but I'm with whoever said ED to where you really really want to go and blanket the rest of the T14 and someone should bite. Also, I hope you have waivers because blanketing can get really expensive.


IMO, this is folly. The opinion that "one should bite" while true, is obviously no guarantee. When sub3's, even URM's, get 1 T14 (maybe 2 if they are URM) acceptances at best it is easy to see that things could have gone the other way and that they got 0. I think it is best for sub3's to use their ED's tactically rather than just shooting for the T14 preference when the lower T14 are basically fungible.

UVA is the most likely to bite on actual ED. NU is the most likely to give a regular acceptance. That being said, I think there is an argument for ED'ing NU because even if you likely won't get the ED scholly package, I'd imagine that ED'ing ingratiates you to the adcomms and makes them more likely to accept you once they defer you from ED to RD.


I think I'll regular apply to NYU, ED to UVA, and if they waitlist me then hopefully I'll have time to ED to NU. Either way, I wouldn't mind going to any of those three. Also, would having my undergrad from Cornell give me any advantage whatsoever of getting into Cornell Law?


Do you prefer UVA over NU? Because I would think you could do it either way. UVA does not have an ED deadline so if you shoot for NU first because you prefer it and they roll you then you can do UVA. Or you can do UVA you'll know in 15 days and have plenty of time to do NU. But I would go with preference first in that scenario.

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JoeMo
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby JoeMo » Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:26 pm

bk1 wrote:
JoeMo wrote:Don't ED to Boalt, they are known to be GPA whores. Someone might have already said that but just wanted to make you aware. ED to UVA would probably give you the best chance but I'm with whoever said ED to where you really really want to go and blanket the rest of the T14 and someone should bite. Also, I hope you have waivers because blanketing can get really expensive.


IMO, this is folly. The opinion that "one should bite" while true, is obviously no guarantee. When sub3's, even URM's, get 1 T14 (maybe 2 if they are URM) acceptances at best it is easy to see that things could have gone the other way and that they got 0. I think it is best for sub3's to use their ED's tactically rather than just shooting for the T14 preference when the lower T14 are basically fungible.

UVA is the most likely to bite on actual ED. NU is the most likely to give a regular acceptance. That being said, I think there is an argument for ED'ing NU because even if you likely won't get the ED scholly package, I'd imagine that ED'ing ingratiates you to the adcomms and makes them more likely to accept you once they defer you from ED to RD.



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Last edited by JoeMo on Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby crumpetsandtea » Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:31 pm

SublimeStyle wrote:I think I'll regular apply to NYU, ED to UVA, and if they waitlist me then hopefully I'll have time to ED to NU. Either way, I wouldn't mind going to any of those three. Also, would having my undergrad from Cornell give me any advantage whatsoever of getting into Cornell Law?

NU deadline for ED applications is November 15th, and you will have to fly in to do an interview in Chicago. Just letting you know if you're going to be EDing. If you're doing ED UVa first, you are going to want to apply ASAP (think mid-September) so you hear back by early October and have some time to prepare your NU app (Why NU, interview). Also, you should be careful about reading the schools' ED contracts to make sure NU doesn't say anything about pledging to not apply anywhere else ED during the cycle you apply ED to NU.

AriGoldButNicer
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby AriGoldButNicer » Tue Jan 24, 2012 6:58 pm

I think op's odds are being underestimated. I agree he is out at all west coadts but if s/he applies early and doesn't mess up the apps, i will bet anyone with odds they get a top 14 acceptance. I believe in the 172 plus urm formula like the 2000-2002 lakers believed in shaq and kobe.

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bk1
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby bk1 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:30 pm

AriGoldButNicer wrote:I think op's odds are being underestimated. I agree he is out at all west coadts but if s/he applies early and doesn't mess up the apps, i will bet anyone with odds they get a top 14 acceptance. I believe in the 172 plus urm formula like the 2000-2002 lakers believed in shaq and kobe.


I mean NU is fairly guaranteed imo, but it is a precarious position to be in when you have only 1 real shot at the T14 and the next best school is Vandy (nothing against Vandy) followed by WUSTL/GW.

AriGoldButNicer
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby AriGoldButNicer » Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:41 pm

bk1 wrote:
AriGoldButNicer wrote:I think op's odds are being underestimated. I agree he is out at all west coadts but if s/he applies early and doesn't mess up the apps, i will bet anyone with odds they get a top 14 acceptance. I believe in the 172 plus urm formula like the 2000-2002 lakers believed in shaq and kobe.


I mean NU is fairly guaranteed imo, but it is a precarious position to be in when you have only 1 real shot at the T14 and the next best school is Vandy (nothing against Vandy) followed by WUSTL/GW.

how's this. i bet u op gets 1 not named NU.

bottle of hibiki?

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bk1
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby bk1 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 2:49 am

AriGoldButNicer wrote:
bk1 wrote:
AriGoldButNicer wrote:I think op's odds are being underestimated. I agree he is out at all west coadts but if s/he applies early and doesn't mess up the apps, i will bet anyone with odds they get a top 14 acceptance. I believe in the 172 plus urm formula like the 2000-2002 lakers believed in shaq and kobe.


I mean NU is fairly guaranteed imo, but it is a precarious position to be in when you have only 1 real shot at the T14 and the next best school is Vandy (nothing against Vandy) followed by WUSTL/GW.

how's this. i bet u op gets 1 not named NU.

bottle of hibiki?


I can't say it isn't tempting.

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crumpetsandtea
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby crumpetsandtea » Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:13 am

IDK, I think GULC has good odds too...My stats are slightly higher than his but I'm non-URM and I got NU and GULC (held ED for NU, RD app to GULC) this cycle.

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bk1
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Re: Mex Splitter 172/2.7, shot at T14?

Postby bk1 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 11:54 am

crumpetsandtea wrote:IDK, I think GULC has good odds too...My stats are slightly higher than his but I'm non-URM and I got NU and GULC (held ED for NU, RD app to GULC) this cycle.


Oh I didn't know you got GULC. So maybe they are relaxing the floor (I know at least 2 sub3/170+/URMs did not get GULC last cycle).




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